Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Just to note, what I mean by "technical matters" is more so mathematics based subjects not necessarily say being good at fixing a car.
I've never seen a women pushed out of a Mathematics or related program before, instead the programs try hard to get them in (often for political reasons). I have also not seen them get pushed out of the work place, although employers are less likely to hire based on political pressure.
So, if men and are women perform equivalently in these sorts of subjects I think its truly odd that there are so few of them. I mean its really dramatic, I'm not talking about 60/40, more like 95/5. I can really only think of one thing that would account for this difference - genetics.
I can really only think of one thing that would account for this difference - genetics.
In The Netherlands women still have to overcome the glass ceiling because women usually don't get the pay men get for doing the same job.
I guess the Dutch still believe that women will quit their jobs once they become pregnant?
Is that what you mean with genetics, since men are genetically 'challenged' to become pregnant?
I do think there may be some physical/genetic differences. Of course, there are exceptions to every "rule." Some women have extremely high aptitudes for math, for technical things etc. It's been my experience, however, that in general, women tend to excel more at verbal tasks, reading comprehension etc. while men excel more in the math/technical fields. My personal opinion is that this is more than just environment or social training. I do believe it may be that our brains are just kinda "wired differently."
Why is that? Was she a geneticist that studied these matters? No.... so why is she even relevant? I never claimed there was absolutely no women in these fields, rather that there is dramatically more men.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tricky D
Is that what you mean with genetics, since men are genetically 'challenged' to become pregnant?
No, I mean that the genetic differences between the sexes make women and men better at different sorts of mental tasks.
There are rather obvious differences genetically in men and women. Men are on average far more stronger than women, for example. So, given the numerous physical differences in men and women why would it be surprising that there are numerous mental differences as well? Its not, and given the dramatic difference in the number of men vs women in mathematics based fields even today, that is a good indication that there is something genetic lurking in the background.
Knowing the differences between men and women mentally would actually benefit society. Why push women into say Computer Science when you know that men are better suited for such things? Of course you shouldn't push them out either. But if the sexes are good at different things then society should get out of the way and let them do what they do best, instead of putting political pressure on universities, employers etc to get more women/men into such and such field.
But if the sexes are good at different things then society should get out of the way and let them do what they do best, instead of putting political pressure on universities, employers etc to get more women/men into such and such field.
Just because men generally are physically stronger than women does this mean that a man is always stronger than a woman.
How about drive (motivation) vs genetics?
Do you truly believe that people should let their genetics be the deciding factor? I'm more comfortable with a person's motivation.
But I agree with you that only the best man or woman should get the job, but even then heart could be more important than talent (or genetics).
I know TONS of women who are better at mathematics than I am (ie. smarter ). However, I know very few women who are more mechanically inclined than me although I'm sure there are a lot of those out there as well.
Just because men generally are physically stronger than women does this mean that a man is always stronger than a woman.
I never suggested this, I said "men are on average stronger". That is to say if you took the strength of all men and women and added it up, then men as a group would be much stronger. That doesn't mean every men is strong than ANY women though.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tricky D
How about drive (motivation) vs genetics?
Do you truly believe that people should let their genetics be the deciding factor?
People should do whatever they want to do. Government, universities or whatever else shouldn't try to push a particular sex into such and such field when there is good reason to believe the other sex is better at it though. Let people do whatever they are going to do.
I think males have a higher spacial quotient, and women have a higher empathic quotient on average...but men are more pushed towards higher mathematics/science careers more then based on genetics. Let the chips fall where they lay, don't encourage anyone to go some where unless they are good at it...and don't discourage anyone unless they are truly hideous at it.
"Success is 10% inspiration and 90% perspiration, that's why many engineers smell really bad"
"Success is 10% inspiration and 90% perspiration, that's why many engineers smell really bad"
LoL, I don't mind sweating myself cauz it frees up my natural male pheromones.
Originally Posted by Humanoid
Quote:
That is to say if you took the strength of all men and women and added it up, then men as a group would be much stronger.
Be that as it may, I rather focus on each case individually than look at groups.
Quote:
Government, universities or whatever else shouldn't try to push a particular sex into such and such field when there is good reason to believe the other sex is better at it though. Let people do whatever they are going to do.
Am I missing something, because it seems that you're arguing your own case?
I mean in The Netherlands we try to motivate girls to consider studying mathematics (and other sciences) because they generally won't choose it out of their own.
So you would advise your daughter not to study mathematics because boys generally are better at it?
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
In The Netherlands women still have to overcome the glass ceiling because women usually don't get the pay men get for doing the same job.
Is that what you mean with genetics, since men are genetically 'challenged' to become pregnant?
I'm more comfortable with a person's motivation.
Be that as it may, I rather focus on each case individually than look at groups.
Am I missing something, because it seems that you're arguing your own case?
