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Some friends were over at the house the other day and we were talking about the underclass (poor people). One of them works for social services and has got harsher in her tone about the disadvantaged as she has experienced more of the so called real people. She says, "it almost makes you want to vote republican"
The general feeling of our group was that 90% of the underclass (poor people) are a combination of lazy, stupid or unskilled. It was mostly their fault not society or business (employers). 20-30 years ago one could be a lazy uneducated person and do alright because there were plenty of jobs for everyone in manufacturing and strong unions, today, if you have no skills you will be poor forever. Agree?
You are generalizing. Individuals are individuals. Are there lazy, stupid, and unskilled people? Sure. Some are rich and some are poor. As was pointed out in several posts, some people, regardless of whether they are lazy, stupid, or unskilled, just don't care all that much about riches. I know it's hard to believe here in the materialism and workaholism capital of the world--but it's true. I'm one of them. IQ > 134; I'm very driven and not lazy at all (my drive just happens to have nothing to do with my employment); plenty of skills/education. So there you go. It takes all kinds.
I don't know why it never occurs to elitists that are supposed to be so well versed in the mechanics of our economy, that there simply in not enough gainful employment in our current societal structure for every individual. Thank you out -sourcing, impersonal technological advancement, and unbridled population expansion.
When making generalizations about the poor, such as the OP did, it really depends on who you're speaking of.
If you're speaking of the world's poor, well than blaming their poverty on laziness and stupidity is just plain ludicrous. And if you're speaking of America's poor, but you're referring to say, the illegal aliens living in poverty in the U.S., or the disabled or disenfranchised mentally ill who all fall through the cracks in our system,then again, laziness and stupidity is not to be blamed.
But if you're speaking of the poor in the U.S. who were born and raised here, and who had access to a free education and financial aid for college and/or trade school, then yes. I agree. Generally speaking, their poverty is most likely a result of laziness, lack of education and plain old stupidity.
There are countless people living on welfare and food stamps in the U.S. who are able-bodied, had the opportunity to become educated, and have access to employment....but they'd rather live off the system. We all know this is true. And in the U.S., under the circumstances I outlined in the paragraph above this is the rule, not the exception. So to a certain degree, I agree with the OP.
I like the discussion so far. But I did not say I believed all poor people were stupid and lazy, I just said that most people in the discussion believed this to be true. I was just looking for your opinion and I sure have got it so far. Keep them coming.
What about, unambitious and unassuming? Maybe they don't have a drive for money or possessions?
The that is mostly being lazy if tehy rely on others to survive. You can be unassuming and still earn your way thru life. Unambitious at a point become lazy. Don't care for possessions only means you want food.heal;thcare and a roff over your head but if you don't work at getting them then your lazy to start with.Many thni tehy should earn a living doing something they can earn a living at because they are not good at it or there is ni demnand. Survival means you often do what you won't pick to do. If you say want to take a chnce to be a movie satr and are one of the huge percentage that doesn't make it ;you can esxpect to be poor because of choice very likely.Many say the don't care about possessions but they want to walkdown nice streets;have parks;sewer systemsand runing water but tehy never remmeber that someone pays for these possessions they enjoy.
Some friends were over at the house the other day and we were talking about the underclass (poor people). One of them works for social services and has got harsher in her tone about the disadvantaged as she has experienced more of the so called real people. She says, "it almost makes you want to vote republican"
The general feeling of our group was that 90% of the underclass (poor people) are a combination of lazy, stupid or unskilled. It was mostly their fault not society or business (employers). 20-30 years ago one could be a lazy uneducated person and do alright because there were plenty of jobs for everyone in manufacturing and strong unions, today, if you have no skills you will be poor forever. Agree?
They're on a path to Poordom when they don't graduate from high school or have a baby out of wedlock when they are very young. Both decisions put them on a path of diminishing choices in life and you should strive to maximize your choices in life.
Poor decision-making is what it is. Don't think it's tied to IQ but it could be tied to family influence.
I don't know about lazy, but the poor tend to be less intelligent (and as a result less skilled). In a country like the US they really do bake their cake, unfortunately their kids get raised by them in communities of people just like them and the cycle repeats.
Even if something bad happens to someone intelligent that pushes them into poverty, they usually don't say poor for long. Its generally speaking the unintelligent that are persistently poor.
By the way, most manufacturing requires a decent degree of skill. In today's economy most of it is fairly high skilled.
I was talking about 30 years ago many people who would be struggling today were able to get high paid low skill factory jobs that took care of their family but only needed a high school diploma and you were trained on the job. My own Father had such a job, he was paid a good union wage of about $25 an hour (in today's money) and only had a high school diploma. He worked on an assembly line and was trained on the job. I understand that many factory jobs NOW DAYS do require a skill and ones that involve quick on the job training pay about one half of what they use to inflation adjusted.
Quote:
Originally Posted by user_id
I don't know about lazy, but the poor tend to be less intelligent (and as a result less skilled). In a country like the US they really do bake their cake, unfortunately their kids get raised by them in communities of people just like them and the cycle repeats.
Even if something bad happens to someone intelligent that pushes them into poverty, they usually don't say poor for long. Its generally speaking the unintelligent that are persistently poor.
By the way, most manufacturing requires a decent degree of skill. In today's economy most of it is fairly high skilled.
Last edited by Weekend Traveler; 06-24-2009 at 03:59 AM..
is a lazy poor person who doesn't want to work any worse then a lazy rich spoon fed kid who happens to live off the parent's $$ but has no drive or
responsibilities? Either one could be a concern as an adult.
The one thing i'd say, growing up in poor areas in Milwaukee in a violent single ( at times ) parent household living on welfare/stamps, I never used that as an excuse to live that way as an adult. I refused to use the bottle as a crutch, and would not allow my child to be raised in situations I lived thru.
And you know what--it can be done. It takes hard work, and some times a little luck, and anyone can make it out of those spots. Does that mean life won't ever throw me a curve again? Nope. But I made sure that I have the strength to get thru anything.
Lastly, I try to hold my judgement on anyone who is young and in those poor levels--a child can not control what their parent does ( as I well know ). It's too bad that some people lump all together, if an adult won't take a helping hand so be it; but it should still be offered to a child.
I wouldn't go that far to say that most are. However, most are missing some basic skill that they didn't pick up along the way. Such as showing up to work on time (Just ask any employer).
Here's the thing. There remains a good deal of social mobility in this country, where people move up and down the income ladder and, institutionally, our society does a pretty good job of providing the mechanisms for even the poorest people to move up in life. There's an education system and programs galore for anybody who asks for help, along with an enormous number of charities and volunteer organizations.
The net result? If you simply stay in school, do what your employer asks of you, constantly strive to be better at your job, and save 10% of what you make, you are almost guaranteed at least a middle-class lifestyle. If you take a few calculated risks along the way, invest in additional education, and really develop a network of mentors, then you'll do even better. I know people who have come to this country with next to nothing, not even a knowledge of the language, who are wealthy individuals today simply because they took advantage of the opportunities offered them.
I know one guy who came here from Greece in 1969, and started working as a dishwasher in a restaurant, not knowing the first word of English. Today, he owns five restaurants and is a rich man. He urges his employees to go to night school, to learn more about the restaurant biz, and the whatnot, even to the point of paying the tuition for a couple of his more motivated employees. But most ignore him and continue to work in a menial job--chiefly because they won't make the extra effort.
The other thing is that the persistently poor do two things that virtually guarantee a life of poverty: 1) Drop out of school, and 2) Have children at an early age while single. These two factors pretty much destroy opportunity. Yet, society bends over backwards to advise people NOT to do these things. You can walk into a Planned Parenthood and get contraception. You can find programs that will do next to anything to keep you on the education track. All you have to do is take advantage of them.
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