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I'm trying, Im trying. But I can't find any. I just read four different news accounts of the new bill, but none told me the details of the bill. The news media doesn't give us the facts, it just gives us a play by play of the Washington back-stabbing.
Im puzzled by the right's disappointment with it. It looks to me like it requires 35-million new customers with money in their hands to flock to the existing health insurance companies and hand over that money. What's not to love about that, if your are a supporter of big business profiteering and gouging of the American people?
I'm trying, Im trying. But I can't find any. I just read four different news accounts of the new bill, but none told me the details of the bill. The news media doesn't give us the facts, it just gives us a play by play of the Washington back-stabbing.
I agree. As I have told people many, many times, the only real information you can find on this will come from the executives of all the corporations associated with the healthcare industry. The insurance execs right now will be sponsoring the **** out of any sort of state resistance to this bill.
Obama has villainized the wrong industry (insurance) to force this bill. He played on people's emotions for public approval to get it passed (uninsured dying of cancer, uncovered pre-existing, etc). That is why we need reform, not a takeover.
For the American people, the only effective propaganda to push this bill would have to of had a foundation of blame - so he blamed insurance, exclusively.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jtur88
Im puzzled by the right's disappointment with it. It looks to me like it requires 35-million new customers with money in their hands to flock to the existing health insurance companies and hand over that money. What's not to love about that, if your are a supporter of big business profiteering and gouging of the American people?
I'm not a proponent of big business profiting at the expense of the American people who can't afford it.
Which is why I am unhappy about the fact that pharmaceuticals, hospitals, doctors, research, and etc. are damn expensive.
Insurance companies operate off an average profit margin of a measly 4%. Why is that? Because every other business associated with the healthcare industry is so damn expensive and operating off much higher margins.
It's no wonder why they have to double and triple premiums, why they can't insure thousands and thousands of pre-existing, because they would not profit!
But when a person has cancer, is trying to get medical help and pay their bills, what happens? They are turned down because it's the insurance companies policy not to cover them. Because they CAN'T!
As for why the right is against the bill, a lot of reasons. Some equally as partisan as red or blue, just like many on the left.
... government workers and managers will never be paid as much as the equivalent insurance company employees. It really does not require a mass of million dollar clerks to process computerized claims....
Can you see me rolling on the floor, laughing hysterically at the thought that government workers will do the job more efficiently and cheaper than those from the private sector? Where are you from, Greg? Have you never been in a government office? Never worked with government employees? Or are you one?
Granted, top level managers do make more than their government counterparts, but that's more than made up by the work standards of government employees -- easy hours, vacation and transfer benefits, medical coverage, early retirement, fat pension, and most importantly, low risk of termination. Let's face it, government employees have an easy life compared to most of us. I've kicked myself many times for not choosing that path. When I was young and making lots of money, I laughed at government employment, but in the end they get the last laugh.
Instead of investing in their own company like the rest of us, they take their paychecks and buy stock in us, the real workers in the country.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jays1983
... How about we tax the **** out of oil to subsidize our healthcare instead? Maybe pharmaceuticals with their outrageous margins?
Better yet, let's tax the healthcare industry to subsidize oil and pharmaceuticals so we don't have to pay so much for a tank of gas and a bottle of pills.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jtur88
... Im puzzled by the right's disappointment with it. It looks to me like it requires 35-million new customers with money in their hands to flock to the existing health insurance companies and hand over that money. What's not to love about that, if your are a supporter of big business profiteering and gouging of the American people?
I'm curious. Who said they support big business profiteering and gouging the American people? Seems I'd remember that....
What is to stop me from saving money by paying the $700 fine each year
The safeguards for such are not yet in place. Currently they offer jailtime and fines. I think they are going to ammend to bill to exclude jailtime. Who knows, they sure don't. That's why you gotta love our politicians, they will pass a bill and figure it out later.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmarie123
How will insurance companies stay in business?
They can't. And they won't. Most will fold between 1-3 years and they will tell you that themselves - they'd be screaming it, but you know how the market would react.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmarie123
Or is that the plan? They all go out of business and then we all have not choice but to actually all fall under government run health care?
Yes, and that is what I've been trying to explain throughout this thread. Unless they address cost controls in the bill other than those of the insurance industry, they will have no choice but to declare bankruptcy. They will mandate pricing structures and to cover the high risk and people of pre-existing conditions.
In summary, coupled with their already very low margins and high risk patients with government set pricing, it's an inevitable outcome.
Now is it clear as to why Obama chose to attack Insurance? He's not stupid, and his goal has most certainly been to tackle healthcare and socialize it. Something that politicians have been trying for a 100 years.
From CNN:
• Insurers can no longer refuse to sell or renew policies because of an individual's health status. Health plans can no longer exclude coverage for pre-existing conditions. Insurers can't charge higher rates because of heath status, gender or other factors.
So that tells me they must set their base prices REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY high to cover all that... and we just all have to pay it no matter the price. The price is not regulated.
From CNN:
• Insurers can no longer refuse to sell or renew policies because of an individual's health status. Health plans can no longer exclude coverage for pre-existing conditions. Insurers can't charge higher rates because of heath status, gender or other factors.
The price is not regulated.
By price regulation I mean no cap on prices. If they have to charge $10,000 a person a month to cover their costs, they can, and we have to buy it. My point is that the amount of the price is not capped, so they can literally charge anything they want under the sun, and we are forced by law to pay it. We have to pay whatever they ask because we do not have the choice to say, "That is a ridiculous price, I'd rather just pay for it myself" we have to buy it.
Can you imagine, millionaires could easily pay out of pocket for medical expenses, but no longer are allowed by law to make the choice. Bill Flipping Gates has to buy medical insurance... do you think he needs it? No!
If my most expensive person costs me $1 million dollars, and you cost me nothing because you haven't been to a doctor in 5 years, you offset the cost of that million dollar customer, and end up paying psychotically high prices since I have to charge you the same.
It doesn't help the unhealthy person, it penalizes the healthy person. I eat right, I exercise, I don't smoke, I follow the food pyramid, I am at a healthy weight, I use sunscreen, and I will pay the same as the crack addict with 7 sexually transmitted diseases who is 100lbs overweight with diabetes that is not regulated through diet and gets lung cancer from 2 packs a day. Do you think they are going to charge us both my price? Or are they going to charge us both the crack addict price?
Rate hikes would do no good because after 2011 the bill requires the insurers to spend at least 80 cents on the dollar per enrollee. Now if the insurers do not spend at least 80 cents per dollar on each consumer, they have to rebate the difference.
In other words, any rate hike would have to be justified by a customer's medical needs and is traceable back to their medical receipts.
So it would do them no good to hike the rates.
As you can see, this is what makes the Insurers the biggest losers with this bill. It is specifically designed to destroy their profit margins. They have absolutely no reason to compete because the greatest margin they can collect per dollar is 15 cents. That has to cover every bit of their overhead, which would be fine, if it weren't for other pieces in the bill which further destroy their profits. (I.E. forced to enroll the millions of high risk patients) Even if they could maintain a margin which allows them to continue to do business, they could never grow or expand their market reach because a. they are not allowed to compete across state lines and b. They have no expendable capital to reinvest in themselves.
So, Johnny Crackhead gets the same medical care as you, at the same price, but costs the insurance company hundreds of thousands of dollars more per year because of his lazy, careless, wreckless and unhealthy lifestyle.
This is where the people are the biggest losers. To add, within the next 4 years this bill is projected to cost you, as an individual, 1-5.5% increase on your income taxes.
In summary, that is a very sneaky way to tell insurance corporations that they, in fact, DO have pricing caps. They just don't call it that.
Good luck finding that on whitehouse.gov propeganda sites. If this isn't destruction of Capitalism, you tell me what is.
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I'm curious. Who said they support big business profiteering and gouging the American people? Seems I'd remember that....
