Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Green Living
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 10-26-2011, 12:47 PM
 
Location: in area code 919 & from 716
927 posts, read 1,460,397 times
Reputation: 458

Advertisements

Quote:
Solyndra got $535 million in federal loans. It got another billion dollars in private investment, much of that from a key Democratic fundraiser. But yesterday, suddenly, the clean energy company shut down. More than a thousand workers were dismissed without severance. (SOURCE)
That money would have been better spent if it had been distributed among the
less than 325 million people in the United States ...

How long will it take about 312 million people to pay for 535 million dollars? (over a million and a half dollars per person)

.... and Obama's agenda is what? GOOD? REALLY?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 10-27-2011, 06:48 AM
 
Location: nj
68 posts, read 226,688 times
Reputation: 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by Digital_Duck View Post
How long will it take about 312 million people to pay for 535 million dollars? (over a million and a half dollars per person)
i think your math is off by a few zeros.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-27-2011, 09:55 AM
 
Location: A blue island in the Piedmont
34,111 posts, read 83,064,731 times
Reputation: 43697
math errors or not...
I don't see ANY "green agenda" doing much good for the poor.
Well, at least not anything beyond basic frugality.

eg: scratch cooking from whole, raw and staples produces less paper/plastic waste.

hth
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-28-2011, 03:39 AM
 
41,813 posts, read 51,102,593 times
Reputation: 17865
The cost of green energy will hit the poor the hardest since such a large portion of their money is spent on it, this is one reason the cap and tax scheme included a lot of increased funding for energy assistance.

Let me provide a great example of it here in PA. As homeowner you can go and purchase a solar system but you need the initial investment which might be on average in the $30K to $60K range. The federal government picks up about 30% of the cost and then the state kicks in another 20%, both are tax credits.

The homeowner can then get renewable energy credits for every 1000kWh of electricity the solar panels produce which are sold like commodities. The power distributor has to purchase these credits to be in compliance with alternative energy mandates, the cost to purchase them is then passed onto the consumer....... including low income families that can least afford it. The rich guy with his $30 to $60 K investment not only has half of it paid for by the taxpayer but makes money off the system. A forum member of mine posted an estimate a solar installer gave him, I'm sure it was over estimate but with the tax breaks and the estimated value of the credits given to him he could start to see a return on his investment in 7 or 8 years.


Quote:
http://www.paaeps.com/

The Pennsylvania Alternative Energy Portfolio Standard (AEPS) requires that an annually increasing percentage of electricity sold to retail customers in Pennsylvania is from alternative energy sources. The program requires that retail energy suppliers utilize Alternative Energy Credits (AECs) for demonstrating compliance with the standard. An AEC is created each time a qualified alternative energy facility produces 1000 kWh of electricity. The AEC is then be sold or traded separately from the power. This makes it easy for individuals and businesses to finance and invest in clean, emission free solar power.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-28-2011, 07:27 AM
 
3,457 posts, read 3,626,532 times
Reputation: 1544
i see two things at work here. there is a correlation between poor people and people who live close to heavy industry. poor people are more likely to be living next to a coal fired power plant, for example, so the folks whose health benefits most from the EPA's rules are the poor.

at the same time, environmental rules hurt the poor financially more than anyone else, since it drives up the cost of living. this is why so many poor and lower-income people are against environmental regulation.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-28-2011, 09:35 AM
 
Location: Northern MN
3,869 posts, read 15,179,145 times
Reputation: 3614
The middle class and rich are penny pincer's too as they don't like spending money that don't have to.
They may be able to afford it but they don't like it.
The poor can't afford it even if they like it.

His agenda doesn't make scene on any level.
It's poorly thought out and it embraces special interest groups.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Cletus Awreetus-Awrightus View Post
this is why so many poor and lower-income people are against environmental regulation.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-28-2011, 09:56 AM
 
3,457 posts, read 3,626,532 times
Reputation: 1544
Quote:
Originally Posted by snofarmer View Post
His agenda doesn't make scene on any level.
It's poorly thought out and it embraces special interest groups.
personally, i support the new restrictions on mercury.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-28-2011, 09:58 AM
 
Location: Out in the Badlands
10,420 posts, read 10,840,581 times
Reputation: 7801
Quote:
Originally Posted by Digital_Duck View Post
That money would have been better spent if it had been distributed among the
less than 325 million people in the United States ...

How long will it take about 312 million people to pay for 535 million dollars? (over a million and a half dollars per person)

.... and Obama's agenda is what? GOOD? REALLY?
He is following Kim Jong-il's lead...let them eat grass...it's green.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-28-2011, 10:08 AM
 
Location: Northern MN
3,869 posts, read 15,179,145 times
Reputation: 3614
sure, but it's been a few years the last regs were in 08.

Relevant to
Business that produce, import or sell products containing PFOS or mercury including the textile and related industries, fire fighting industries, photographic, photolithography and semiconductor application industries, the aviation sector and metal-plating industries in the UK
Took effect on
27 June 2008
From 27 June 2008, new rules will introduce restrictions on the marketing and use of Perfluorooctane sulfonates (PFOS) and substances that break down to it.
The restrictions will apply to:
  • the placing on the market or use of a substance or constituent of preparations in a concentration equal to or above 0.005 per cent by mass
  • the placing on the market in semi-finished products or articles - or any part thereof - if the concentration of PFOS is equal to or higher than 0.1 per cent by mass according to a prescribed formula
The restrictions will not apply to certain coatings for use in printing processes and/or certain chromium plating systems that meet specified conditions. They will also not apply to the substances and preparations used to produce them.
Fire-fighting foams that were placed on the market before 27 December 2006 can be used until 27 June 2011.
Measuring devices containing mercury

From 3 April 2009, new restrictions will apply to the placing on the market of fever thermometers containing mercury and other non-electronic measuring devices containing mercury that are sold to the general public - eg manometers and thermometers other than those used to measure fever.
From 3 October 2009, you will not be allowed to place barometers containing mercury meeting certain specifications on the market.
The restrictions will not apply to measuring devices that were more than 50 years old on 3 October 2007.
As of 31 December 2007, the table of substances, preparations and restrictions at Schedule 1 of these regulations replaced the one previously in force under the Controls on Dangerous Substances and Preparations Regulations 2006.
New restrictions on Perfluorooctane sulfonates (PFOS) and mercury in certain measuring devices | Business Link

Concerning the export of mercury.

  • Federal agencies are prohibited from conveying, selling or distributing elemental mercury that is under their control or jurisdiction. This includes stockpiles held by the Departments of Energy and Defense.
  • Export of elemental mercury is prohibited from the United States beginning January 1, 2013.
  • The Department of Energy (DOE) shall designate one or more DOE facilities for long-term management and storage of elemental mercury generated within the U.S. This designation must occur no later than January 1, 2010.

Laws and Regulations | Mercury | US EPA


Quote:
Originally Posted by Cletus Awreetus-Awrightus View Post
personally, i support the new restrictions on mercury.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-28-2011, 09:01 PM
 
Location: mid wyoming
2,007 posts, read 6,835,862 times
Reputation: 1930
We gotta get this idiot out of office.......
and most of his buddies too.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Green Living
Similar Threads

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top