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AFAIK - Oil is still being pumped out of the southwest NYS and Pennsylvania oil field where it was first commercialized in 1840 or so. It is still a primary source of lubricating oil and, apparently still economically viable. I believe biomass algae can be converted into fuel and lubricating oil so the use of oil will never end because there are some non fuel uses where it is the best material available. Also note there are still some very special uses for sperm whale oil.
IMHO the ultimate large scale (no Boy Scout breeder reactors here) source for electricity and industrial process heat is Nuclear Fission with full fuel reprocessing and breeding non fissionable elements into fissionable reactor fuel. This is an expensive system but what other energy system can produce more fuel than it consumes? That is the key to creating a energy system for the future. That can create a world wide industrial prosperity for mankind. That makes it worth doing!
Fracking is a liquid, it works for water as well as oil, recovery process where relatively impermeable (flow resisting) rock is made less resistant by cracking the rock by injecting very high pressure water and holding the cracks open with sand or similar material. Combined with long horizontal drilling (amazingly it is possible to turn the drill from vertical to horizontal while drilling) this allows a huge volume of source rock to be tapped for oil and/or natural gas. Unfortunately it also can release a huge amount of oil contaminated hot water that is disposed of by injecting it into the ground using a separately located set of wells.
One of the side effects of reinjection of the contaminated water is previously stable (locked) small and not so small geologic faults (existing cracks in the rock) to become less stable and move causing many small earthquakes and the occasional not so small tremors in places where they were nearly nonexistent. Oklahoma is now shakier then California.
One of the axioms is no matter how much something is studied there will be unforeseen consequences. the earthquakes associated with Fracking were expected but are much more frequent and stronger than predicted.
AFAIK - Oil is still being pumped out of the southwest NYS and Pennsylvania oil field where it was first commercialized in 1840 or so. It is still a primary source of lubricating oil and, apparently still economically viable. I believe biomass algae can be converted into fuel and lubricating oil so the use of oil will never end because there are some non fuel uses where it is the best material available. Also note there are still some very special uses for sperm whale oil.
IMHO the ultimate large scale (no Boy Scout breeder reactors here) source for electricity and industrial process heat is Nuclear Fission with full fuel reprocessing and breeding non fissionable elements into fissionable reactor fuel. This is an expensive system but what other energy system can produce more fuel than it consumes? That is the key to creating a energy system for the future. That can create a world wide industrial prosperity for mankind. That makes it worth doing!
Well, to be fair, I don't think we need the sun to produce more than it consumes, but I understand your point.
I'm not nearly as educated about which alternative fuels we should be using as much as I on which current fuels we shouldn't.
How did I know? Easy, I have had wood slash hauled to the local biomass electric generation plant.
Wait you actually think biomass is the same thing as wood?? Omg, when people say there cars run on dinosaur corpses you really think that is what is happening huh? Wow.
There will never be a time when the LAST Drop of Oil or LAST chunk of coal is gone...
What typically happens is price increases with scarcity so that other products become more viable... it is very much the plan President Obama put forth... he candidly said for alternative energy to viable the price of oil and coal must increase.
Finite means an end, gone, finni
Move the goal posts much? You referred to those fossil fuels as commercial sources of electricity. They are absolute finite sources of commercial energy.
And let's not pretend simple economics dictates a market that is as federally subsidized as oil. Unless you need another lesson?
Location: New Albany, Indiana (Greater Louisville)
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Within reason going green saves money and businesses will continue to find ways to reduce energy use. There was a lot of good improvements in environmental technology when Dubya was president, hybrid car sales grew exponentially.
I'm an engineer and when statement "There will not always be coal, gas and oil" is left unchecked some will believe this.
Oooo appeals to authority, another logical fallacy. I have a graduate degree in a related science, actually worked at the macindo well head during the dwh spill, and I teach environmental and earth sciences at the local uni, do I win??
Quote:
As for oil... we were suppose to have already exhausted the world's supply by now...
We have not run out of whale oil which was once the staple for lamps... it just isn't used anymore to be significant and is a violation under the Endangered Species Act.
Anyway just because we have no run out "yet" does not change they fundamental FACT that fossil fuels are by their very definition finite and even more so when used for commercial energy generation as you originally stated.
Nice try but no.
And as for your attempt to compare fossil fuels to a biofuel like whale oil. You have got to be kidding right??? Or at least fibbing about the engineer part, because that is the literal difference between finite sources like fossil fuels and renewable sources like biofuels. Organisms if their populations are kept high enough they could be used renewably, nothing will produce more fossil oil.
There is nothing we can do. Give up. the world is doomed. Start bottling all the air and water you can and save it so you can live a few days longer than anyone else. The last one standing wins.
Wood is not efficient enough to use to generate electricity.
This is your post...
Quote:
Originally Posted by lkb0714
Wait you actually think biomass is the same thing as wood?? Omg, when people say there cars run on dinosaur corpses you really think that is what is happening huh? Wow.
I referenced and cited the California Department of Energy Website with link to prove Wood is currently used to generate electricity...
An example of a biomass facility is the Wheelabrator Shasta power plant, one of the most modern independent wood-fired power plants. The 49 MW (net) plant processes 750,000 tons of mill waste and forest residues from Shasta County and surrounding areas. Unusable waste wood from surrounding public and private land are selectively removed and processed in the plant to improve remaining standing timber.
Oooo appeals to authority, another logical fallacy. I have a graduate degree in a related science, actually worked at the macindo well head during the dwh spill, and I teach environmental and earth sciences at the local uni, do I win??
I tried... sometimes that is all that can be done.
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