Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Location: Approximately 50 miles from Missoula MT/38 yrs full time after 4 yrs part time
2,308 posts, read 4,121,626 times
Reputation: 5025
Advertisements
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hopes
My adult son wants to get a gun dog. My goodness, there are so many breeds. He's trying to pick one breed to use for both waterfowl and small game. We don't have many upland birds in our region, except for turkey.
Since this will be a family pet living in my home, a great temperment is a must and low shedding is a plus. We also don't want a dog that requires 60-80 minutes of VIGOROUS excersise per day.
We already own a labrador and a basset but they're just family pets, not gun dogs. The labrador was gun shy and the basset was a rescue, which required we sign a contract promising not to use him for hunting.
We are considering an english spaniel or boykin. Or a standard poodle bred specifically to hunt (since they're super smart to learn different skills and don't shed).
Any opinions or alternate suggestions?
......Hopes....
In my 70 years of hunting, I have had (5*) different breeds of "Hunting Dogs" as well as 3 other breeds that were acquired for (2) different reasons: security & companionship. (German Shepard, Boxer & Boston Terrier)
.....* Labs, Golden Retrievers, German S H Pointers, American Brittanys & French Brittanys and a Boykin.
I think it would help if we knew what region you live in, so we would know what state or part of the country your son intends to do his "hunting". (Water fowl hunting in AR is vastly different than up here in MT or on the east coast for example....................Secondly: what type of "small game" are you refering to. Many outdoorsmen or "hunters" think of "small game as: squirrels, rabbits, coons etc. Is this what you are referring to, since you have ruled out "upland birds"?
IMO it is important (after the breed is selected) to establish "who is going to be the dog's master". If your son wants to end up with a "properly trained' and "obedient" hunting companion (and in-house companion)........your son should be "understood in the dog's mind" as being the "alpha". i.e.: "CONSISTENCY" in ALL aspects of the dog's contact with your son, you and your husband is the "key" to ending up with a properly trained, obedient & happy dog that is a pleasure to have around. i.e.: Whatever commands he uses....you should use the same----whatever he won't tolerate.....you won't tolerate----establish two times per day to feed the dog...and stick to those times! (This also helps in establishing when the dog will have his "daily "B/Ms" ).
A few more thoughts (opinions if you will):
If , (as you have stated) "he wants to do this right"...I would get a puppy at 7 to 8 weeks of age "From a breeder with a 'time-proven' reputation.
I would acquire two travel crates: Keep one in the back of the SUV....and the other one in the Utility Room. Condition the new dog to: #1/:.. be in the Travel crate in the auto ANYTIME you take him for a ride or travel with him........#2/:..start the new puppy/dog sleeping in the travel crate that is in the Utility Room...Get that new dog used to being in that Travel Crate-----IT WILL become "his Security Blanket" over time! .............Believe me....Trust me......there is nothing as helpful, stress relieveing, and in general, as convenient as having a dog THAT LIKES HIS TRAVEL CRATE!.
Sorry for "preaching", but the above is only a portion of what I would suggest.........again, based on your son..."wanting to do this right".
And lastly......."PATIENCE", PATIENCE, PATIENCE......... hope your son realizes he CANNOT lose his temper when something goes wrong. (sorry for the unintentional italics & also I don't mean to imply that your son would be prone to lose his temper)... One "rule" I have always employed with all the dogs I have had over these past 70 years: "You don't ever strike a dog with your hand and then expect him to allow you to USE THE SAME HAND to pet and stroke him."
.......Obviously, it goes without saying......I don't believe a dog should ever be struck with anything.................................
P.S. My current dog (and maybe my last one--being in my 80th year)....is a 5 1/2 yr old French Brittany that I got when he was 7 weeks old. As with all my dogs, I have trained him myself. I happen to live on some (fenced w/ smooth wire) acreage outside of town here in western Montana, so it is to my benefit to have complete control over my dog when I am out side with him. Thus, by age one year: he was completely "fence broke"; snake broke; deer broke; elk broke; turkey broke and "responds' (comes back to me) to a "BEEPER" that is on his collar that I can activate from a hand-held transmitter. He points and retrieves: quail; pheasant; grouse; partridge & dove. At this age........."what else can 'an old Montana Bird Hunter ask for" My big game hunting days are behind me..............
Although she never would have made a waterfowl retriever; my best small game dog was a mixed breed. Probably a combination of Bassett and Dachshund. I could not look at the gun cabinet without her begging to go hunt. She would jump up and her tail would start wagging - I think she even knew how to spell out G U N. She was a great rabbit dog because she ran them slow. She was a little slow on snowshoes - however she never gave up. But; she would also hunt anything that I wanted to hunt - except for the waterfowl. She would even help me dig chipmunks out of our stone rows. She even learned how to point (not a true point - she just froze and wagged her tail).
She also made a great family pet.
For the OP: If you cannot hunt with your Bassett; maybe you could let it hang around with a few good Dachshunds?
My adult son wants to get a gun dog. My goodness, there are so many breeds. He's trying to pick one breed to use for both waterfowl and small game. We don't have many upland birds in our region, except for turkey.
Since this will be a family pet living in my home, a great temperment is a must and low shedding is a plus. We also don't want a dog that requires 60-80 minutes of VIGOROUS excersise per day.
We already own a labrador and a basset but they're just family pets, not gun dogs. The labrador was gun shy and the basset was a rescue, which required we sign a contract promising not to use him for hunting.
We are considering an english spaniel or boykin. Or a standard poodle bred specifically to hunt (since they're super smart to learn different skills and don't shed).
Any opinions or alternate suggestions?
Hi Hopes. Here's my thoughts. I assume he's hunting western PA (if your the same Hopes from the Pittsburgh forum ) That means your son will be hunting stocked pheasants, grouse, rabbits maybe, and waterfowl,. I think Labs or English Springers are probably the best choice for a first time gun dog. And unlike what one of the posters said- these dogs can work for you "right out of the box" or at least with a modest amount of training. Of course there is some training : "hup" and "come" are essential. But beyond that its just getting the dog exposed to birds- and the gun.
If ducks are a bigger part of the plan then I would opt for the Lab. Both are fine for pheasants or grouse- I prefer to watch a Springer work, but that is subjective. You should look for proven hunting lines, partricularly on the females side. What I would not do is go for an unpopular breed like the poodle. There is a reason that they are not popular in the field. There may be some really good ones out there but the odds of getting one are smaller. The Pudelpointer is another matter- they are serious hunting dogs, but your selection may be limited in this area. They don't shed so much if at all. You could consider a German Shorthair if cold weather waterfowling were not the primary activity- both the PP and the GSP will retrieve ducks but they are pointers (duh), not flushers, which is a different way of hunting, and would need a bit more attention in the training department, but they are smart dogs and the GSP is very low maintenance. They will still shed somewhat. They are probably a better choice if Grouse hunting will be a major pursuit. The field bred Springers and Shorthairs tend to be more "high energy" than the labs, but they all settle down over time. PPs and GSPs are usually bad if you have cats. I've only had Spaniels so much of what I've written is just stuff I've picked up. Thats enough out of me....
Field bred dogs require tons of training and double tons of exercise.
You could consider getting an older dog from a gun dog trainer breeder. Lots of times they have older dogs they've used in competition and then bred but are past breeding age. Get them fixed, they are fine for hunting, more likely to appreciate laying around the house.
Be careful though, kennel dogs as in dogs that have spent their lives in a dog run, can be hard to reliably housebreak.
Location: Approximately 50 miles from Missoula MT/38 yrs full time after 4 yrs part time
2,308 posts, read 4,121,626 times
Reputation: 5025
Quote:
Originally Posted by Giesela
Field bred dogs require tons of training and double tons of exercise.
You could consider getting an older dog from a gun dog trainer breeder. Lots of times they have older dogs they've used in competition and then bred but are past breeding age. Get them fixed, they are fine for hunting, more likely to appreciate laying around the house.
Be careful though, kennel dogs as in dogs that have spent their lives in a dog run, can be hard to reliably housebreak.
............Some good points of information in the quoted post.........
Regarding the amount of exercise certain breeds of "sporting" or "field Bred Dogs" require and how much "area" they need to "run" on a daily basis:
Of the five breeds of "hunting-dogs" that I have had (Labs, Pointers, Goldens, Brittanys and Boykin).............I, (IMHO) would rate the Brittanys are requiring the most exercise and ability to "run their a$$ off" at least twice a day.......and more if possible..............I would put Labs "at the other end of "that spectrum".
I also found out (many years ago) that by feeding twice a day (in my case
7 am and 5pm) ....and keeping to that schedule ..............I "can almost set my watch" as to when "my canine companion" will have to have his "BM"(s)......again in my case it is 2 hours after feeding,...i.e.: 9am,...2pm & 7pm. (The 2pm "job" is the result of a mid-afternoon "run & play" session.)
At age 5 1/2 he HAS NEVER "gone #1 or #2" in his 10' x 20' fenced dog run.
(even though on some occasions he is in the dog-run from 9 thirty to 5 pm.)
Also, in those 5 1/2 years, he has traveled (in his travel-crate--in the SUV-- 68,000 miles,) and never once "messed -in-the-crate". (I do stop and let him out every 4 to 5 hours).
I site the above info, "only to point out" the very positive results of having a dog on a schedule that you adhere to...........They are after-all: "Creatures-of Habit"!
Be sure and check anyone you speak to out thoroughly and get references.
One thing to remember. If your son wants a hunting dog, training will be required and the best option if he's a serious,hunte will be a field bred dog (not one bred for show) which will mean the dog will require a great deal of exercise both physical and mental.
If you don't want "high energy" then a female English Springer is a good choice. We've had Labs, Brittanys, English Springers, and Springers. By far, our female English Springers were the best. Good family dogs too. Funny thing, my four legged Grandbaby, a gorgeous blue eyed Aussie/Border cross turned out to be the best flusher I've ever seen...even stops after the flush and started pointing but hasn't figured the stop when pointing part out yet lol.
If you don't want "high energy" then a female English Springer is a good choice. We've had Labs, Brittanys, English Springers, and Springers. By far, our female English Springers were the best. Good family dogs too. Funny thing, my four legged Grandbaby, a gorgeous blue eyed Aussie/Border cross turned out to be the best flusher I've ever seen...even stops after the flush and started pointing but hasn't figured the stop when pointing part out yet lol.
So.....just what is the difference between an English Springer and a Springer? Do you mean an imported Springer?
Also- I think the dogs lineage will have a lot more to say about energy level than the sex. Your typical field bred springer- male or female- is going to be a relatively high energy dog. Thats going to be the rule for most gun dogs, with a few exceptions like many but not all labs, some of the versatile continentals (spinnones, wirehaired pointing griffons, some GSPs), Clumber and Sussex Spaniels, the larger Coverly -type Eng. Setters.
If you don't want "high energy" then a female English Springer is a good choice. .
You're kidding right?
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
