Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > Hawaii
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 08-05-2015, 02:35 PM
 
Location: Honolulu
430 posts, read 639,463 times
Reputation: 632

Advertisements

Back in the day houses were designed properly for Hawaii with big louver windows, generous roof overhangs, and windows all around to allow crossflow.
But a most houses built within the past few decades seem to be designed to mainland temperate climate standards with tiny sliding windows (only half the area actually opens), small roof overhangs that provide no shade, dark roofs, and floor plans designed with no regard for airflow.

Those features kind of make sense for a cold winter and summer with air conditioning. Were the architects assuming that the houses would be air conditioned? Or were they just going by what buyers thought they wanted?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 08-05-2015, 02:49 PM
 
1,584 posts, read 2,107,569 times
Reputation: 1885
Quote:
Originally Posted by thejackalope View Post
Back in the day houses were designed properly for Hawaii with big louver windows, generous roof overhangs, and windows all around to allow crossflow.
But a most houses built within the past few decades seem to be designed to mainland temperate climate standards with tiny sliding windows (only half the area actually opens), small roof overhangs that provide no shade, dark roofs, and floor plans designed with no regard for airflow.

Those features kind of make sense for a cold winter and summer with air conditioning. Were the architects assuming that the houses would be air conditioned? Or were they just going by what buyers thought they wanted?
Air conditioning is a new housing necessity across the globe; this isn't unique to Hawaii. Homes in Hawaii should be built to circulate air naturally AND also be able to be mechanically cooled by ac EFFICIENTLY.

Jalousies are ridiculous window systems that will hopefully disappear into oblivion. They provide horrible security, horrible insulation values, horrible sound proofing values, horrible storm protection and ugly sight lines. They are the most ridiculous window systems ever built.

A much better alternative are awning windows. They achieve the same airflow benefits as jalousies (the ONLY benefit of jalousie windows) but awning windows are secure, well-insulated for energy savings, inside/outside noise mitigation, high storm protection and clear/open sight lines.

You can blame our inept city planners at the DPP for our shallow 30" overhangs. Apparently they think that is all that's needed to keep the sun out. We are the only state in the nation that has such a short overhang requirement. Everywhere else it's 36" or more.

Dark roofs are preferred because of aesthetics. Light colored roofs are ugly and blinding for those looking from above. All other bad design aspects are a result of amateur architects and developers desperate to pull a profit.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-05-2015, 02:57 PM
 
Location: Middle of the valley
48,518 posts, read 34,815,517 times
Reputation: 73734
I disagree. My old 1950's house was hotter than heck and it was mainly windows. I installed a split system a/c that labored to make a difference.

Then 1970's house. Hotter than heck. Had window a/c's and our electricity bill for that house where we only ran a/c at night was more than my house now (which is what you describe) with central a/c running 24/7.

God bless double paned windows, double walls and insulation.
__________________
____________________________________________
My posts as a Mod will always be in red.
Be sure to review Terms of Service: TOS
And check this out: FAQ
Moderator: Relationships Forum / Hawaii Forum / Dogs / Pets / Current Events
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-05-2015, 02:59 PM
 
Location: On the Chesapeake
45,337 posts, read 60,512,994 times
Reputation: 60924
Could part of the reason be security (break ins) concerns?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-05-2015, 03:21 PM
 
Location: Honolulu
430 posts, read 639,463 times
Reputation: 632
Quote:
Originally Posted by pj737 View Post
Air conditioning is a new housing necessity across the globe; this isn't unique to Hawaii. Homes in Hawaii should be built to circulate air naturally AND also be able to be mechanically cooled by ac EFFICIENTLY.

Jalousies are ridiculous window systems that will hopefully disappear into oblivion. They provide horrible security, horrible insulation values, horrible sound proofing values, horrible storm protection and ugly sight lines. They are the most ridiculous window systems ever built.

A much better alternative are awning windows. They achieve the same airflow benefits as jalousies (the ONLY benefit of jalousie windows) but awning windows are secure, well-insulated for energy savings, inside/outside noise mitigation, high storm protection and clear/open sight lines.

You can blame our inept city planners at the DPP for our shallow 30" overhangs. Apparently they think that is all that's needed to keep the sun out. We are the only state in the nation that has such a short overhang requirement. Everywhere else it's 36" or more.

Dark roofs are preferred because of aesthetics. Light colored roofs are ugly and blinding for those looking from above. All other bad design aspects are a result of amateur architects and developers desperate to pull a profit.
In theory AC may be a necessity but in Hawaii it is a luxury. The houses I'm referring to typically have no AC or at best a window unit!

I agree that awning windows are the best of both worlds, so why weren't all these houses built with those instead of sliders? Cost?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-05-2015, 03:35 PM
 
1,584 posts, read 2,107,569 times
Reputation: 1885
Quote:
Originally Posted by thejackalope View Post
In theory AC may be a necessity but in Hawaii it is a luxury. The houses I'm referring to typically have no AC or at best a window unit!

I agree that awning windows are the best of both worlds, so why weren't all these houses built with those instead of sliders? Cost?
What was once a luxury is now a necessity. When I was in school, not a single building had ac. Now most buildings in schools have ac. People are being conditioned to controlled environments. Homes that were once tolerable are no longer comfortable because people need lower humidity and heat to remain comfortable. This is technology impacting human evolution.

Another reason is noise. Neighbors are being placed closer together. Blasting home theaters and tvs are the norm. Nobody wants to hear their neighbors and respectful people don't want to bother their neighbors with their noise... hence the need to close windows... and that necessitates air conditioning.

Awnings are very expensive and that's why you rarely see them in homes. If more people would use them, the price would drop.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-05-2015, 03:38 PM
 
Location: Honolulu
430 posts, read 639,463 times
Reputation: 632
Quote:
Originally Posted by pj737 View Post
What was once a luxury is now a necessity. When I was in school, not a single building had ac. Now most buildings in schools have ac. People are being conditioned to controlled environments. Homes that were once tolerable are no longer comfortable because people need lower humidity and heat to remain comfortable. This is technology impacting human evolution.

Another reason is noise. Neighbors are being placed closer together. Blasting home theaters and tvs are the norm. Nobody wants to hear their neighbors and respectful people don't want to bother their neighbors with their noise... hence the need to close windows... and that necessitates air conditioning.

Awnings are very expensive and that's why you rarely see them in homes. If more people would use them, the price would drop.
Correction: Most schools in Hawaii don't have AC
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-05-2015, 07:22 PM
 
Location: Middle of the Pacific
480 posts, read 623,106 times
Reputation: 501
I've never lived in a house with awning windows. They do look like great choice for a hawaiian hale. Great for air flow and available in double or triple pane for added strength and sound proofing.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-05-2015, 08:21 PM
 
Location: Moku Nui, Hawaii
11,050 posts, read 24,017,648 times
Reputation: 10911
A lot of it depends upon who built the house, I'd think, more so than when the house was built.. Frequently we get folks who move over here from the mainland and build a house they are familiar with - not realizing how inappropriate they are. Also a lot of houses are built as "spec" houses so the contractors building them don't intend to live in them. Smaller "nail on" windows are cheaper to install than louvers or bigger windows. Smaller roof overhangs = less roofing = cheaper construction costs = more profit. There's folks out there that aren't trying to make houses, they are trying to make money and it shows in the results. I would hope that the houses that actually have an architect involved are better designed.

We're in an early 1950's house and have no A/C nor need for A/C. If anything, just the opposite. The house has lots of ventilation, 3' overhangs with lanais which further cool the air before it enters the house and views of the ocean which also lets in the ocean breezes, etc. etc. Silver aluminum roof that is still the original roof. Three windows in the living room and they are all 6' wide and 4' tall. Wood framed sliders, although the rest of the house has double hung sash windows. Try finding those in modern construction! Each sash has 10# of weight to get each window to move easily.



We're still restoring the house, but this window has all new sash cords. The old ones were made of cotton and eventually give out. The new ones are nylon and they should last a lot longer. If not, we'll take the windows apart and replace the cords again. (Still need to scrape the excess paint off the window panes, put in the ceiling, patch and paint the cabinets, etc. etc. It's an old house that was bought as a "tear down" from folks who thought it would take too much work to save it.)

They've also been adopting the mainland building codes. Which encourages double wall construction and house wrap. I'm betting there will be loads of mildew houses coming up in a few years as the houses with house wrap age and collect humidity. The new codes also call for more bracing walls which means less room for windows.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-05-2015, 08:27 PM
 
Location: Kahala
12,120 posts, read 17,897,957 times
Reputation: 6176
Quote:
Originally Posted by pj737 View Post
and that necessitates air conditioning.
Perhaps the practically non-existent trade winds and almost everyday high temperature records also is necessitating air conditioning.

In July, 33 high temperature records have been tied or set in Hawaii.

Hawaii Local Breaking News and Headlines - More high temperature records set across state - Hawaii News - Honolulu Star-Advertiser

And we haven't even hit the hottest time of the year yet and it has been miserable.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:




Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > Hawaii

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top