Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Location: Southernmost tip of the southernmost island in the southernmost state
982 posts, read 1,167,424 times
Reputation: 1652
Advertisements
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tulemutt
Those aren’t *minimalists*. Those are homeless people. And, by the way, the “footprint” they leave is almost entirely trash they rummage from the consumer world around us all. They don’t generate hardly any trash of their own purchasing. They don’t create and market and use hardly anything toxic: chemicals, fertilizers, fuels, etc.
Do I do my own work? … why yes, I do . My fat bank account is the result of near blind luck. And I’ve used it frequently to support others less fortunate.
I apologize if my reply came across as too personal a critique. I just find that a lot of environmentalist/minimalist/anti-capatalist preaching is hollow. I don't really care how you use your money, that is yoir choice, but the fact remains, it is very easy to be a minimalist when everything in your life is minimal except you savings account. Someone without that kind of money, trying to live a low impact life is going to look a lot more like the Amish; eschewing superfluous possessions, but still owning an awful lot of "stuff" to get the work done and survive in this modern world.
Although I wish he put a shirt on: Elon Musk has bigger fish to fry than the Twitter lawsuit right now ... like getting his hands on some SPF during his trip to Mykonos, where he's doing the yacht thing with famous friends.
The richest man in the world also looked to be one of its most fair-skinned as he took a dip in the Aegean Sea. His pal Ari Emanuel, CEO of William Morris Endeavour, was waiting to hose him down with some fresh water when he got back on the deck of their yacht.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grassyknoll
I just find that a lot of environmentalist/minimalist/anti-capatalist preaching is hollow. I don't really care how you use your money, that is yoir choice, but the fact remains, it is very easy to be a minimalist when everything in your life is minimal except you savings account.
A rare I agree.
I'll also add in my opinion a society of minimalists is not a good society. It stifles innovation - when I think of minimalists - I think of the old iron curtain or the Mao days in China. That era of minimalism did nothing for their people.
I apologize if my reply came across as too personal a critique. I just find that a lot of environmentalist/minimalist/anti-capatalist preaching is hollow. I don't really care how you use your money, that is yoir choice, but the fact remains, it is very easy to be a minimalist when everything in your life is minimal except you savings account. Someone without that kind of money, trying to live a low impact life is going to look a lot more like the Amish; eschewing superfluous possessions, but still owning an awful lot of "stuff" to get the work done and survive in this modern world.
I understand your critique. No problem. And I actually agree that a lot of preaching is hollow … from most extreme positions on contemporary issues.
As for my minimalism being easy well, yes it is. Living with less is easier than living with more. But the interesting fact is: I acquired my wealth because I was living always on the super cheap, minimalist style. I saved a chunk of money others might have spent on mortgages and possessions … I dumped my savings into gold just before the oil embargo of the early 70s … then made it a habit to buy low and sell high in more gold and a few select pieces of real estate over the years. While the real estate was for my two wives’ personal security and pleasure, they both passed away and the grossly increased values have come back to me.
I don’t “eschew personal possessions” on any kind of ideological, ethical, moral basis. I eschew them because I don’t enjoy the burdens that go with. The less I have the less I have to maintain and protect. I still have many things, though. I’ve got a half dozen boats. Couple of trucks / vans. Cargo-trailer full of tools as a mobile workshop. Now, since second wife passed a couple years ago, I’m a landlord burdened by real estate (which I am arranging to give to my kids). Oh, and a new girlfriend
Bottom line for me is: studying anthropology, history and psychology, eastern philosophies, and science at a layman’s level has been foundational for my lifestyle choices. I don’t need a bunch of crap vampiring my energies. I don’t expect or demand others should feel similarly. And I don’t care if they do.
…
I'll also add in my opinion a society of minimalists is not a good society. It stifles innovation - when I think of minimalists - I think of the old iron curtain or the Mao days in China. That era of minimalism did nothing for their people.
Maoist China wasn’t minimalism … it was despotic oppression.
Minimalism, at its true root, is simpler than what you are trying to ridicule. At its deepest, it is simply divorcing oneself from the tyranny of material desires ruling one’s choices. Divorcing oneself … from concern. I don’t particularly eschew what you pursue materially. I just know I personally don’t need it and don’t care to be burdened by much stuff. I know nobody needs all this *innovation*. Homo sapiens have been around, prospering, for near ½ million years and only *innovated* in less than the last 10,000. And it’s been quite self destructive.
You like it? Knock yourself out. But science overall, anthropology, physiology, biology and history prove all this *innovation* is just shiny baubles and trinkets to fight over. Go for it, fight all you like. Enjoy. I’m out of your loop and have been for many decades.
Minimalism, at its true root, is simpler than what you are trying to ridicule.
And you knock yourself out - although I'm surprised a self proclaimed minimalist is on the internet.
I'm also not ridiculing it - I do think it is a very bad and toxic concept - a big difference. All the things we take for granted - electricity, clean water, transportation, the internet you are using, medicine/vaccines - were not created by minimalists......
Location: Southernmost tip of the southernmost island in the southernmost state
982 posts, read 1,167,424 times
Reputation: 1652
Quote:
Originally Posted by whtviper1
I'm also not ridiculing it - I do think it is a very bad and toxic concept - a big difference. All the things we take for granted - electricity, clean water, transportation, the internet you are using, medicine/vaccines - were not created by minimalists......
That might be a bit of a reach, saying they weren't created by minamilists.
Take for example the internet. I am sure that some of the original architects/programmers saw the internet as a way to streamline and consolidate data (much of which at the time was stored physically). I would not suggest I know the ideology of these creators, but surely some of them were minamilists or inclined towards minamilism.
That might be a bit of a reach, saying they weren't created by minamilists.
Take for example the internet. I am sure that some of the original architects/programmers saw the internet as a way to streamline and consolidate data (much of which at the time was stored physically). I would not suggest I know the ideology of these creators, but surely some of them were minamilists or inclined towards minamilism.
The internet was a concept by the US Government to be used as a cold war weapon. The vision was computers could be networked to talk to each other in the event the Soviets knocked out the phone system.
Edison, Ford, Carnegie, Vanderbilt, etc were not exactly minimalists......
And - in my opinion - an actual minimalist would not be using the internet. That does not seem very minimal to me.
Location: Southernmost tip of the southernmost island in the southernmost state
982 posts, read 1,167,424 times
Reputation: 1652
Quote:
Originally Posted by whtviper1
in my opinion - an actual minimalist would not be using the internet. That does not seem very minimal to me.
I think using an electronic means of communication is very minamilistic.
Even a phone and land-line would entail more equipment and resources.
Would you suggest pen and paper correspondence? Perhaps yodeling?
But seriously - when I think of a minimalist - the first thing that pops into my mind is Ted Kaczynski - in my opinion, something is off about a minimalist. It just feels like it has an abnormal aspect to it.
Location: Southernmost tip of the southernmost island in the southernmost state
982 posts, read 1,167,424 times
Reputation: 1652
Quote:
Originally Posted by whtviper1
I like the idea of yodeling.
But seriously - when I think of a minimalist - the first thing that pops into my mind is Ted Kaczynski - in my opinion, something is off about a minimalist. It just feels like it has an abnormal aspect to it.
There is Websters definition of minimalist, but that is sort of irrelevant to the discussion. It is such a subjective term in the way that it is used that I bet if you ask 10 people their definition of minimalist, you'd get 10 interpretations.
I feel I live a minamilistic life in some areas (not a lot of clothes, still using a 10 year old Galaxy Note cell phone) but in other areas I routinely acquire "things" (modern 20v cordless power tools rock and were definitely worth upgrading to).
So yeah, minimalism is largely in the eye of the beholder.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
. My fat bank account is the result of near blind luck. And I’ve used it frequently to support others less fortunate.
well, yes it is. Living with less is easier than living with more. But the interesting fact is: I acquired my wealth because I was living always on the super cheap, minimalist style. I saved a chunk of money others might have spent on mortgages and possessions … I dumped my savings into gold just before the oil embargo of the early 70s … then made it a habit to buy low and sell high in more gold and a few select pieces of real estate over the years. While the real estate was for my two wives’ personal security and pleasure, they both passed away and the grossly increased values have come back to me.
I’m out of your loop and have been for many decades.
