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OpenD, we're talking about people moving to Hawaii here. If they weren't wacky and were "thinking clearly" they'd live somewhere more practical. What criteria did you factor into your calculations that made you think that the Big Island is the most logical place to live?
Have you considered the possibility that you could get a much bigger salary raise than the cost of shipping a car, if you lived somewhere else? Are you going to do that?
Buying a used car in Hawaii is not for the casual consumer. The salt issues with rust and wiring corrosion, the vog in Volcano area, the bad roads that tear up suspensions, rats eating wires, etc.... Bringing a $1000 or $2000 car here can indeed make sense if you are confident in what you have.
Winkosmosis made a good choice with his shipment.
I would rather have a $1000 mainland car from a rust-free southern state than a $2000 island car.
I've never had a car loan but I don't get the upside down thing. Why does it matter if you're upside down? A car isn't an investment.
That's correct. A car is an expense. But most people don't relate to it that way. A whole industry depends on it.
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Originally Posted by winkosmosis
OpenD is afraid that you total the car and the insurance payout doesn't cover the rest of the loan? How is that any different from selling the car and not getting enough to pay off the loan?
It's not. The point is, there's no reason to get into a position where you owe more than a car is worth, unless you making an emotional decision that you want something that can't be justified rationally.
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Originally Posted by winkosmosis
If you keep the car until it's hardly worth anything, and don't total it, it ends up being irrelevant what the car was "worth" many years before.
True enough, but hardly anyone actually does that. Studies show that on average the best scenario is to buy a well maintained two year old car and drive it 10 years, but hardly anyone does that. Except your average millionaire.
Quote:
Originally Posted by winkosmosis
If you're the kind of irresponsible person who buys a new car every 3 years, then it would be a problem because you end up losing a lot each time you sell, but in that case you're wasting money anyway.
Exactly right. All I was trying to point out before is that when you make a decision emotionally like that, it doesn't "make sense," instead it's just "what you want." And getting your head straight about which is which is both freeing, and empowering.
We often pay money to reduce hassle... it's part of what money is for. It's not just there to buy goods, but also services. Like saving me lots of time & hassle.
Yes, yes, yes... we all do. But how often do we stop and think about how MUCH we're paying, for what, and then actually make a free choice? My observation is that people go completely unconscious about these things until and unless circumstances force them to examine the choice closely.
There's nothing inherently wrong with spending $1,000 or whatever else to ship a car here. But spending a bunch of money unconsciously because you can't deal with it is a luxury few of us can afford.
I've been following Pulitzer Prize winning economist Thomas L Friedman's projections that food and fuel prices could double this year globally. If that happens... even if it only partly happens... Hawai'i will almost certainly get hit harder than most places, because we're on the end of such a long supply chain. Then the difference between having a car that gets 25mpg and one that gets 40mpg will become much clearer. Then having saved $1,500 on your moving expenses and socked it away will become much clearer.
In any case, don't sandbag people in conversations like this... saying you paid $3,000 to ship a car when it did not come out of your own pocket is BS.
What criteria did you factor into your calculations that made you think that the Big Island is the most logical place to live?
I never said that. Not even close.
What I have been saying, and will continue to say, is that thinking clearly beats going unconscious, or just doing what you've always done. As Socrates famously said, "The unexamined life is not worth living."
Maybe spending $3,000 to ship a car makes total sense. Maybe it makes no sense. But the only way to tell is to think about it clearly. And I've been pointing out ways to do that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by winkosmosis
Have you considered the possibility that you could get a much bigger salary raise than the cost of shipping a car, if you lived somewhere else? Are you going to do that?
I never said anything like that either. See? You've gone unconscious. That's not me you're talking to.
"Hawaii’s average price for regular gasoline slipped 1 cent from last week to $3.74 per gallon...
"Honolulu’s average price for a gallon of regular unleaded remained unchanged from last week at $3.63; it is 31 cents higher than the same week last year.
"Hilo’s average price also held steady from last week at $3.76 per gallon, and is 20 cents higher than the same week last year.
"Meanwhile, Wailuku’s average price per gallon slipped 1 cent from last week to $4, but it is still 21 cents higher than last year."
And as I said, $4.09/gal at my corner store here in Volcano.
In any case, don't sandbag people in conversations like this... saying you paid $3,000 to ship a car when it did not come out of your own pocket is BS.
No, it's not. I had a relocation budget, just like anyone coming to Hawaii does. I had X dollars I could spend to get me, my family, and my stuff here. Just because the X dollars was being paid by someone else doesn't mean I didn't have to make the same decisions as someone paying their own way here. And I maintain that it was well, well worth shipping my car (which used a good fraction of the X dollars and meant there was a bunch of other stuff I couldn't afford to bring) to avoid the hassle of selling & buying... even if it would have been slightly "cheaper" to do it the other way.
And I just filled up my tank for less than $3.50 a gallon. Gas prices at your corner station are not representative of gas prices everywhere in the state. If people are telling you that they're not paying $4+ a gallon, why do you think they're making it up?
Too bad that corner store in Volcano doesn't show up on the following website... HawaiiGasPrices.com
I don't buy gas there often, but the fact that the AAA gas survey shows that same kine price elsewhere proves my pint... which is that gas prices are up sharply from last year and they are staying high and projected to go higher.
Friedman, commenting on the revolution in Egypt, mentioned that looking at it from a man-on-the-street level, said it mostly was driven by consumer anger that gasoline and wheat had doubled in price there in a year. And he predicts the same will happen here... the doubling of fuel and food prices this year, at least.
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