Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Those numbers aren't high. I felt awful when I was taking cholesterol medication and blood pressure medication and reflux medication, and quit taking them and just improved my diet.
For a year and a half, I was a faithful vegan and I didn't even eat any oil. My high cholesterol numbers only came down 20 points - from around 250 to maybe 230. That was only cholesterol being produced by my own body.
Cholesterol medication stops your body from making it's own cholesterol, which is needed for healthy cells and brain function, on and on.
I now trust that my body knows what it's doing. Im no longer a strict vegan. But, I'd say I'm still 90 percent vegan. I'm not saying it's for everyone. But, I can tell you that I feel a heck of a lot better not taking medications.
I also just stopped using ibuprophen and my blood pressure came way down into the normal range. I didnt' know that ibuprophen causes high blood pressure.
So, really it just seems that most medication given to us actually cause more problems than they cure.
Anyway, I say if he feels fine I wouldn't worry about it. If he's not eating a ton of animal products, I think he can trust his body to be making a substance it needs.
I think it's really weird, once I thought about it, to take a medication that stops your body from doing it's natural function - like making it's own cholesterol.
These numbers are created by an industry that profits from them, so they're suspect, in my view - meaning what number of cholesterol means you need to take their drug.
There's just no solid proof that an amount of cholesterol in the blood means you will get heart disease.
Like I say, I feel much better off those drugs and I'm just not going to worry about it. It's simple logic to me. I think these drug companies have railroaded the medical profession.
I'm sorry, but with numbers like that WHY is she recommending a statin?
It doesn't make any sense. Unless there is a severe risk factor you left off.
I would consider getting a new PCP. Seriously.
I don't know what would qualify as a severe risk factor. He obtained copies of all of his test results and everything is normal, except for the elevated blood sugar. But statins wouldn't help with that and via diet, exercise and a few supplements his sugar levels are steadily decreasing anyway.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RationalExpectations
1. I would have him go to a cardiologist.
2. I suspect the most important thing your husband can do is to make sure he does not progress from pre-diabetic to full-on type 2 diabetes, as that will substantially increase his chance of heart disease, among other bad things.
If it were me, I'd talk to the doctor about going on Metformin to reduce his A-1c.
3. The blood lipid numbers are indicators of potential coronary artery disease - but they are not foolproof as many people have said.
4. Instead of just evaluating indicators of potential coronary artery disease, why not instead actually look inside the coronary arteries? A non-invasive CT coronary angiogram does this. See https://www.mayoclinic.org/tests-pro...t/pac-20385117. You get an injection of a (I think) radioactive dye, and a giant CT machine takes a bunch of x-rays of your coronary arteries, and the computer assembles them together so the radiologist can "fly through" the inside of your coronary arteries to actually see how much they are clogged.
Once you have these results, you now know which arteries have how much occlusion. The internist and cardiologist can then figure out what, if anything, to do.
Yes, he definitely does not want to come down with diabetes. He asked her why she was suggesting statins and she stated that they are not mandatory for him but they may lower his risk score by reducing his LDL. I am kind of scratching my head about this, he does not have any indications of circulation issues and had his carotids scanned a few years ago to make sure that an episode of dizziness was not due to carotid artery disease. The scan was completely clear, no deposits, and the cardio told him this was indicative of clear arteries elsewhere as well.
Huh, I found this risk calculator and it states everyone with a 10 year risk higher than 7.5% should be on statins?? Husband's risk is 11% according to his test numbers. If these are new guidelines, I guess everyone is going to be on statins shortly.
Consider a moderate-to-high intensity statin in patients with a 10-year ASCVD risk of 7.5% or higher (assuming no clinical ASCVD or diabetes, aged 40 to 75 years, and LDL 70 to 189 mg/dL) https://clincalc.com/cardiology/ascvd/pooledcohort.aspx
I was on statins for many years over three differen. I worked my way through most of the popular statin drugs, switching from one to the next based on the whims of my health insurance (not the doctor). Finally i was put on lovastatin primarily because of cost. After about 3 or 4 months I started having leg weakness, falls, and loss of nerve sensitivity in my leg. My doctor took me off statins and I did a blood test about 3 months later and, without meds, my results were high normal. My family risk level was fairly low so I probably never needed statins in the first place. The drugs don't all work the same way. I was okay with two or three drugs but not the fourth one. My doctor considers it an allergy but I'm happy to be off of the drugs.
Just because a doctor says you need a certain drug, it doesn't mean you have to take it. Statins have too many bad side effects. Change your diet, exercise and avoid doctors, and you should be fine.
Location: Was Midvalley Oregon; Now Eastside Seattle area
13,065 posts, read 7,500,158 times
Reputation: 9789
Quote:
Originally Posted by SunGrins
I was on statins for many years over three differen. I worked my way through most of the popular statin drugs, switching from one to the next based on the whims of my health insurance (not the doctor). Finally i was put on lovastatin primarily because of cost. After about 3 or 4 months I started having leg weakness, falls, and loss of nerve sensitivity in my leg. My doctor took me off statins and I did a blood test about 3 months later and, without meds, my results were high normal. My family risk level was fairly low so I probably never needed statins in the first place. The drugs don't all work the same way. I was okay with two or three drugs but not the fourth one. My doctor considers it an allergy but I'm happy to be off of the drugs.
This.
Original adverse reaction sheet, said the occurrence of muscle pain is "rare". It took many years before the true rare was approaching 40% in certain ethnic groups and high ten% in the white population.
Due Diligence is required and you need to verify my numbers.
Yes, he definitely does not want to come down with diabetes. He asked her why she was suggesting statins and she stated that they are not mandatory for him but they may lower his risk score by reducing his LDL. I am kind of scratching my head about this, he does not have any indications of circulation issues and had his carotids scanned a few years ago to make sure that an episode of dizziness was not due to carotid artery disease. The scan was completely clear, no deposits, and the cardio told him this was indicative of clear arteries elsewhere as well.
It certainly is a good sign. Is the doctor recommending statins an internist? Family practice doctor?
While your husband is asymptomatic, you can't learn too much from that. For example, I am asymptomatic and I have several risk factors for coronary artery disease. I sought out an academic cardiologist - a doctor at a University medical school who spends most of his time in research & teaching at the medical school but who sees patients in clinic a day per week (or was it a day every 2 weeks?). He's up on the latest academic research and still has real world patient experience.
Given my significant risk factors, we decided to do the Coronary CT Angiogram even though I pass a treadmill test and have no symptoms. One of my coronary arteries is 70% occluded. Another is 30% occluded. The rest are clear. Absent the actual Coronary CT Angiogram, all doctors could do is make informed guesses based on blood tests, family history, etc.
Regarding statins, he did not want to increase my dose of Crestor - he says that he is most worried about patients who develop an intolerance for statins. The official data say 5% to 10% of patients cannot tolerate statins. This physician said data from the university's clinical practice indicate an intolerance rate of 15% to 20%. The biggest worry is someone who tolerates a small or medium dose of a statin, but once they step up to a high dose, they can no longer tolerate any statin and must stop taking them altogether. That hypothetical patient is screwed.
His practical advice to me was to (a) focus on not developing full Type II Diabetes by being on a full dose of Metformin, (b) diet & exercise, (c) take blood pressure meds, and (c) don't shovel snow. He was serious about the latter. Shoveling snow can lead to a heart attack several hours later.
Those numbers aren't high. I felt awful when I was taking cholesterol medication and blood pressure medication and reflux medication, and quit taking them and just improved my diet.
For a year and a half, I was a faithful vegan and I didn't even eat any oil. My high cholesterol numbers only came down 20 points - from around 250 to maybe 230. That was only cholesterol being produced by my own body.
Cholesterol medication stops your body from making it's own cholesterol, which is needed for healthy cells and brain function, on and on.
I now trust that my body knows what it's doing. Im no longer a strict vegan. But, I'd say I'm still 90 percent vegan. I'm not saying it's for everyone. But, I can tell you that I feel a heck of a lot better not taking medications.
I also just stopped using ibuprophen and my blood pressure came way down into the normal range. I didnt' know that ibuprophen causes high blood pressure.
So, really it just seems that most medication given to us actually cause more problems than they cure.
Anyway, I say if he feels fine I wouldn't worry about it. If he's not eating a ton of animal products, I think he can trust his body to be making a substance it needs.
I think it's really weird, once I thought about it, to take a medication that stops your body from doing it's natural function - like making it's own cholesterol.
These numbers are created by an industry that profits from them, so they're suspect, in my view - meaning what number of cholesterol means you need to take their drug.
There's just no solid proof that an amount of cholesterol in the blood means you will get heart disease.
Like I say, I feel much better off those drugs and I'm just not going to worry about it. It's simple logic to me. I think these drug companies have railroaded the medical profession.
Yes, I was put on BP drugs years ago and was not able to function. Very slow heart beat, too weak to get out of bed, etc. So they did a holter monitor and my BP was fine, I just had white coat hypertension. Recently it crept back up again, but I found out I was low in Vit D and started taking that, hibiscus tea and coq10 and more exercise and BP numbers are fine again. I believe a lot of issues are down to diet/lifestyle. We don't eat red meat at all, haven't for years. Fish, chicken, eggs are about it. I do cook with grass fed butter sometimes, but most of the time I use olive oil.
I also wonder about the cutoff for medication getting lower and lower. BP numbers that now require meds used to be considered normal. The same seems true for lipids. I wonder if there is solid research, which isn't funded by drug manufacturers, behind all of this.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SunGrins
I was on statins for many years over three differen. I worked my way through most of the popular statin drugs, switching from one to the next based on the whims of my health insurance (not the doctor). Finally i was put on lovastatin primarily because of cost. After about 3 or 4 months I started having leg weakness, falls, and loss of nerve sensitivity in my leg. My doctor took me off statins and I did a blood test about 3 months later and, without meds, my results were high normal. My family risk level was fairly low so I probably never needed statins in the first place. The drugs don't all work the same way. I was okay with two or three drugs but not the fourth one. My doctor considers it an allergy but I'm happy to be off of the drugs.
Were your lipids high or was it a cautionary move? Falls can kill you a lot faster than high cholesterol, glad you are okay.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PinkString
Just because a doctor says you need a certain drug, it doesn't mean you have to take it. Statins have too many bad side effects. Change your diet, exercise and avoid doctors, and you should be fine.
Yes, we are primarily focusing on his blood sugar which has to come down. Not on board with avoiding docs though, they ARE helpful for the most part.
Quote:
Originally Posted by leastprime
This.
Original adverse reaction sheet, said the occurrence of muscle pain is "rare". It took many years before the true rare was approaching 40% in certain ethnic groups and high ten% in the white population.
Due Diligence is required and you need to verify my numbers.
Yes, we know several people who are on statins due to very high cholesterol and they've all had issues. Plus there've been quite a few recalls so it's altogether worrisome.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RationalExpectations
It certainly is a good sign. Is the doctor recommending statins an internist? Family practice doctor?
While your husband is asymptomatic, you can't learn too much from that. For example, I am asymptomatic and I have several risk factors for coronary artery disease. I sought out an academic cardiologist - a doctor at a University medical school who spends most of his time in research & teaching at the medical school but who sees patients in clinic a day per week (or was it a day every 2 weeks?). He's up on the latest academic research and still has real world patient experience.
Given my significant risk factors, we decided to do the Coronary CT Angiogram even though I pass a treadmill test and have no symptoms. One of my coronary arteries is 70% occluded. Another is 30% occluded. The rest are clear. Absent the actual Coronary CT Angiogram, all doctors could do is make informed guesses based on blood tests, family history, etc.
Regarding statins, he did not want to increase my dose of Crestor - he says that he is most worried about patients who develop an intolerance for statins. The official data say 5% to 10% of patients cannot tolerate statins. This physician said data from the university's clinical practice indicate an intolerance rate of 15% to 20%. The biggest worry is someone who tolerates a small or medium dose of a statin, but once they step up to a high dose, they can no longer tolerate any statin and must stop taking them altogether. That hypothetical patient is screwed.
His practical advice to me was to (a) focus on not developing full Type II Diabetes by being on a full dose of Metformin, (b) diet & exercise, (c) take blood pressure meds, and (c) don't shovel snow. He was serious about the latter. Shoveling snow can lead to a heart attack several hours later.
His doc is a geriatric specialist. She only takes patients 65 and older and is very thorough. I mentioned your suggestion to him and told him he should first make sure that he really needs to take a statin, based on the condition of his arteries. So he is going to talk to her about a scan when he goes back in 6 months. In the meantime we will just keep working on his blood sugar.
Yes, we used to live in snow country and people would keel over every winter. The cold is not good for people with heart disease either, constricts arteries and causes angina.
I read many docs are taking metformin even though they have no blood sugar issues, apparently it has benefits beyond sugar control? Are you still taking it even after the recall?
I read many docs are taking metformin even though they have no blood sugar issues, apparently it has benefits beyond sugar control? Are you still taking it even after the recall?
I don't know about about uses beyond blood sugar. Yes, I'm still taking metformin.
There have been several recalls of generic metformin over the years. I'm not aware of a current one. I just did a google search:
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
