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Old 02-12-2023, 08:09 AM
 
574 posts, read 267,563 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoonose View Post
Do you know the implications? - "just gastrointestinal"
There are many many reasons for malabsorption of iron besides colorectal cancer. Most temporary and resolve on their own with proper diet, and no need for medical intervention.

Regular use of antibiotics, NSAIDs, some infections are common cause for temporary gastrointestinal distress that make absorption of iron difficult.

Antibiotics and NSAIDs being a forced error by the medical community.
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Old 02-12-2023, 08:27 AM
 
18,802 posts, read 8,471,648 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FlBeachIguana View Post
There are many many reasons for malabsorption of iron besides colorectal cancer. Most temporary and resolve on their own with proper diet, and no need for medical intervention.

Regular use of antibiotics, NSAIDs, some infections are common cause for temporary gastrointestinal distress that make absorption of iron difficult.

Antibiotics and NSAIDs being a forced error by the medical community.
LGI cancer is the biggie and needs to be ruled out soon.
Antibiotics causing iron deficiency is way down on any list. I'm trying to think if I've ever even seen a case.
NSAID's and upper GI blood loss not uncommon.
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Old 02-12-2023, 08:35 AM
 
574 posts, read 267,563 times
Reputation: 395
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoonose View Post
LGI cancer is the biggie and needs to be ruled out soon.
Antibiotics causing iron deficiency is way down on any list. I'm trying to think if I've ever even seen a case.
NSAID's and upper GI blood loss not uncommon.
If I were her, I'd try fixing my diet and waiting a few months, re-taking that test before blindly rushing into a colonoscopy.

Tetracyclines and Quinolones block iron absorption.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/7317...n%20absorption.

But so do NSAIDs, many cardiac medications (ACE2 inhibs), as well as Levothyroxine which Crazy Cat Lady is probably on.

All of those modalities may have a minor differential impact, but combined with poor diet and some recent lifestyle stressors (like illness) may tip her into a temporary anemic state that she can remedy through diet.
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Old 02-12-2023, 09:38 AM
 
18,802 posts, read 8,471,648 times
Reputation: 4130
Quote:
Originally Posted by FlBeachIguana View Post
If I were her, I'd try fixing my diet and waiting a few months, re-taking that test before blindly rushing into a colonoscopy.

Tetracyclines and Quinolones block iron absorption.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/7317...n%20absorption.

But so do NSAIDs, many cardiac medications (ACE2 inhibs), as well as Levothyroxine which Crazy Cat Lady is probably on.

All of those modalities may have a minor differential impact, but combined with poor diet and some recent lifestyle stressors (like illness) may tip her into a temporary anemic state that she can remedy through diet.
Colon soon, the most important.
Very few are on these antibiotics longer term. And even then I can't remember one significant case of secondary anemia.
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Old 02-12-2023, 09:39 AM
 
Location: San Diego, California
1,147 posts, read 862,798 times
Reputation: 3503
Quote:
Originally Posted by FlBeachIguana View Post
If I were her, I'd try fixing my diet and waiting a few months, re-taking that test before blindly rushing into a colonoscopy.

Tetracyclines and Quinolones block iron absorption.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/7317...n%20absorption.

But so do NSAIDs, many cardiac medications (ACE2 inhibs), as well as Levothyroxine which Crazy Cat Lady is probably on.

All of those modalities may have a minor differential impact, but combined with poor diet and some recent lifestyle stressors (like illness) may tip her into a temporary anemic state that she can remedy through diet.
What a weird take. I thought that you had made it clear your healthcare philosophy that is one would do nothing until one came down with symptoms and then do a diagnostic workup. A person came down with iron deficiency anemia which is a symptom and not a diagnosis. You treat it as a final diagnosis and potentially let a cancer go unabated by simply treating the symptom rather than the disease with iron supplements.

People go to doctors because they believe that doctors will provide a certain standard of care that they are legally required to provide. If they do not agree with those standards then they wouldn't go to doctors. They would go somewhere else. They would go to somebody who has a minimalistic approach to medicine of practically doing nothing but waiting until serious conditions arise and then provide them with supplements.

You aren't her and I don't see any similarities there with you.
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Old 02-12-2023, 09:45 AM
 
574 posts, read 267,563 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Medical Lab Guy View Post
What a weird take. I thought that you had made it clear your healthcare philosophy that is one would do nothing until one came down with symptoms and then do a diagnostic workup. A person came down with iron deficiency anemia which is a symptom and not a diagnosis. You treat it as a final diagnosis and potentially let a cancer go unabated by simply treating the symptom rather than the disease with iron supplements.
I don't think anyone considers abnormal laboratory readings as symptoms. Symptoms are what you notice, not what a lab result needs to tell you. She hasn't made it clear if this was a routine blood exam or she was suffering symptoms and asked for blood work.

Cancer is unlikely in general, and even more unlikely given her admission she had anemia before and just came off a bout of illness + hypothyroidism.

She can take my advice or disregard it. But I think doing a colonoscopy without trying to correct the problem through diet and examining medications she's taking or been taking is medical overreach and does more harm than good to her. But it does more good to the clinic carrying out the exam.

And then there is the NordICC trial which calls into questions the benefits of colonoscopies in general for reducing CRC mortality.
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Old 02-12-2023, 09:54 AM
 
18,802 posts, read 8,471,648 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FlBeachIguana View Post
I don't think anyone considers abnormal laboratory readings as symptoms. Symptoms are what you notice, not what a lab result needs to tell you. She hasn't made it clear if this was a routine blood exam or she was suffering symptoms and asked for blood work.

Cancer is unlikely in general, and even more unlikely given her admission she had anemia before and just came off a bout of illness + hypothyroidism.

She can take my advice or disregard it. But I think doing a colonoscopy without trying to correct the problem through diet and examining medications she's taking or been taking is medical overreach and does more harm than good to her. But it does more good to the clinic carrying out the exam.

And then there is the NordICC trial which calls into questions the benefits of colonoscopies in general for reducing CRC mortality.
Take almost any older patient presenting with fe deficient anemia, and the first order of business should be to set up a colonoscopy. You do not wait months. The other stuff can be worked on in the meantime. It typically takes a few weeks to set up and then do a colon. An older person presenting with fe deficient anemia is no longer on your 'general' list
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Old 02-12-2023, 09:57 AM
 
Location: Georgia, USA
37,102 posts, read 41,267,704 times
Reputation: 45136
Quote:
Originally Posted by FlBeachIguana View Post
There are many many reasons for malabsorption of iron besides colorectal cancer. Most temporary and resolve on their own with proper diet, and no need for medical intervention.

Regular use of antibiotics, NSAIDs, some infections are common cause for temporary gastrointestinal distress that make absorption of iron difficult.

Antibiotics and NSAIDs being a forced error by the medical community.
Blood loss rather than malabsorption is the more likely culprit, with the GI tract the most likely source.

While the anemia is treated the source of the blood loss must be evaluated.

https://www.merckmanuals.com/profess...iciency-anemia

"Blood loss is the major cause of iron deficiency. In men and postmenopausal women, the most frequent cause is chronic occult bleeding, usually from the gastrointestinal tract (eg, due to peptic ulcer disease, malignancy, hemorrhoids, or vascular ectasias)."
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Old 02-12-2023, 10:02 AM
 
574 posts, read 267,563 times
Reputation: 395
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoonose View Post
Take almost any older patient presenting with fe deficient anemia, and the first order of business should be to set up a colonoscopy. You do not wait months. The other stuff can be worked on in the meantime. It typically takes a few weeks to set up and then do a colon. An older person presenting with fe deficient anemia is no longer on your 'general' list
According to her, she had this before (reoccurring) and just came off a bout of illness. Is your first order of business going to give someone with that history a colonoscopy? So everytime they develop anemia you're going to send them in for a colonoscopy?
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Old 02-12-2023, 10:08 AM
 
Location: San Diego, California
1,147 posts, read 862,798 times
Reputation: 3503
Quote:
Originally Posted by FlBeachIguana View Post
I don't think anyone considers abnormal laboratory readings as symptoms. Symptoms are what you notice, not what a lab result needs to tell you. She hasn't made it clear if this was a routine blood exam or she was suffering symptoms and asked for blood work.

Cancer is unlikely in general, and even more unlikely given her admission she had anemia before and just came off a bout of illness + hypothyroidism.

She can take my advice or disregard it. But I think doing a colonoscopy without trying to correct the problem through diet and examining medications she's taking or been taking is medical overreach and does more harm than good to her. But it does more good to the clinic carrying out the exam.

And then there is the NordICC trial which calls into questions the benefits of colonoscopies in general for reducing CRC mortality.
Your whole take including labs is minimalistic by nature. People don't post in health forums for which I post to several who are minimalist. They post lab results all day and want people to interpret them. They have symptoms and want doctors attention based on symptoms and on labs.

If people had no concerns about medical aspects they would not be posting here and other forums wanting insight into their health. The minimalist ignore doctors and health concerns and allow symptoms to progress until they can't be ignored. We have the hypochondriacs on the other extreme but most people are in the middle.

This is the standard of care in reference to iron deficiency in someone over 50,

“anemia is colon cancer until proven otherwise,” said one expert, Dr. Thomas Weber, who serves on the steering committee of the National Colorectal Cancer Roundtable. In general, he said, worrisome symptoms that persist should be investigated, and doctors should consider ordering a colonoscopy.

“I kept making excuses for my symptoms,” said Ms. DeBord, until “it got so bad I knew something was wrong.”

Most cases of colon and rectal cancer are indeed found in people 50 and over. But there has been a sharp increase of colorectal cancer in adults as young as their 20s and 30s, with the proportion of cases found in adults under 50 increasing to 11 percent in 2013, up from 6 percent in 1990, according to the American Cancer Society. A recent study from the group that analyzed colon and rectal cancer incidence by birth year found that rates dropped steadily for people born between 1890 and 1950, but have been increasing for every generation born since 1950.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/03/16/w...on-cancer.html
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