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I hear this quit often, and I just saw this in another thread again. Although he said "if it wasn't for the U.S. and Britain, France would be speaking German". I hear this mostly in response to criticism of the U.S. ,though.
I think Britain did successfully defend itself and counterattacked on its own. Maybe if Hitler hadn't invaded Russia and completely focused on the U.K., they would have been able to defeat them. But since he did invade Russia fought too many wars, I think they could have continued this without any help. Of course, France is a different story. They were probably completely lost on their own. I don't think many Americans give the British enough credit.
What's your take on this or what do you think about those statements?
I visited some of the WWII museums in London recently, and there was an absence of anything "American" in these museums. As an American I was just there to look, but I did want to see the British perspective on America entering the war.
Growing up in America I was always told how "We saved their asses," et cetera, and I guess I just took it on faith that they agreed. It was a surprise to me the measures taken to avoid talking about the US's role.
I know that doesn't answer your question, exactly, but frankly I don't have a clue what would've happened if what had happened had not happened. On my trip there I got the impression that things weren't going so hot for Britain during its WWII defense, and that Germany would have won. I'm no history expert, though.
Last edited by Cletus Awreetus-Awrightus; 01-03-2012 at 05:13 PM..
British were safe as soon as Hitler attacked the Soviet Union.
I have to wonder about that. If the Japenese had not attacked the US and we had not got into WWII then Germany would not have had a 2 front war and may have been able to defeat Russia before they mobilized enough. Germany could have had her full might on the Russian front. Britian would have been in big trouble if that had happened as without the US they may not even have won in North Africa and there is no way they could have opened the second front in France without the US. Not to mention how many war materials we supplied them with.
The other senerio is if Japn had attacked Russia instead of the US. Ron
I visited some of the WWII museums in London recently, and there was an absence of anything "American" in these museums. As an American I was just there to look, but I did want to see the British perspective on America entering the war.
Which one? "Britain at War"? I wouldn't read too much into it.
Growing up in America I was always told how "We saved their asses," et cetera, and I guess I just took it on faith that they agreed.
Yes, that's exactly what I was talking about. They? Who? The British? lol. Why would they? They were very organized and bravely counterattacked themselves even before the U.S got into WW2.
It was a surprise to me the measures taken to avoid talking about the US's role.
Again, I wouldn't read too much into it. I don't even know which museum you went to, so I can't really comment on that. Nothing that would upset me make me think about it.
I know that doesn't answer your question, exactly, but frankly I don't have a clue what would've happened if what had happened had not happened. On my trip there I got the impression that things weren't going so hot for Britain during its WWII defense, and that Germany would have won. I'm no history expert, though.
Well, of course it wasn't going "so hot". They were heavily bombed. Lots of people were killed, cities were leveled etc. Well, you know the story.
And I agree with prettyvacant. When Hitler took on the SU, he didn't know what he was doing. I also think that was the reason they were "safe" then. too many resources had to be moved and relocated. Maybe he would have won if he had tried harder to knock them down.
Anyway, I am just surprised at the fact that so many people think this way. Like I said, I do not agree at all and have no idea how this claim became "mainstream".
I have to wonder about that. If the Japenese had not attacked the US and we had not got into WWII then Germany would not have had a 2 front war and may have been able to defeat Russia before they mobilized enough. Germany could have had her full might on the Russian front. Britian would have been in big trouble if that had happened as without the US they may not even have won in North Africa and there is no way they could have opened the second front in France without the US. Not to mention how many war materials we supplied them with.
The other senerio is if Japn had attacked Russia instead of the US. Ron
Japan did attack Russia. Japan and Russia fought over Manchuria. The war wad fought in the cold of winter like Stalingrad. Soviets along side Chinese and mongols fought the Japanese. Japanese and the Soviet union signed a neutrality pact which would be broken by Stalin near the end of world war 2. With seberis and the Russian far east secured many red army soldiers boarded trains on the worlds longest railway ready to tight Japan's ally Nazi Germany . The experience fighting the Japanese in winter warfare proved to be important factor in pushing back the Germans for the red army.
Japan did attack Russia. Japan and Russia fought over Manchuria. The war wad fought in the cold of winter like Stalingrad.
This war was in May-August, 1939, in Eastern Mongolia. Japanese forces were surrounded and destroyed by Zhukov's troops.
Except of the lesson learned, Japan had no goals to pursue if it attacked Russia along with Hitler. The Far East is too difficult area to advance into and then to hold.
The reason why Japan attacked the USA is the oil embargo announced by Roosevelt. Japan needed oil for it's war machine, and had no own resources.
Japan did attack Russia. Japan and Russia fought over Manchuria. The war wad fought in the cold of winter like Stalingrad.
Yes, that's exactly what I was talking about. They? Who? The British? lol. Why would they? They were very organized and bravely counterattacked themselves even before the U.S got into WW2.
If you look into most battles the British were pretty much loosing everywhere until we got into the war and fought along side them. The first campaign they won was in North Africa and that was not until we got into the North African battle with them. Not taking anything away from Britian but they started finally winning battles after the US entered the war and fought every battle with them such as North Africa , Sicily and then Italy and so on. They were basically defeated everywhere up until North Africa including getting kicked out of France by the Germans. Ron
Japan did attack Russia. Japan and Russia fought over Manchuria. The war wad fought in the cold of winter like Stalingrad. Soviets along side Chinese and mongols fought the Japanese. Japanese and the Soviet union signed a neutrality pact which would be broken by Stalin near the end of world war 2. With seberis and the Russian far east secured many red army soldiers boarded trains on the worlds longest railway ready to tight Japan's ally Nazi Germany . The experience fighting the Japanese in winter warfare proved to be important factor in pushing back the Germans for the red army
What I meant was if Japan had attacked Russia in late 1941 when Hitler had them on their knees and they were at their weekest. If Japan had attacked Russia then in late 1941 instead of attacking the US. Then the US may not have got in the war and thats what I mean as it would have been very bad for Britian. They needed the US for alot of reasons and its no fault of their own as they fought the entire war very bravely but as the US they also were not prepared for war but Hitler was and thats why Germany was so strong in the first few years of the war. Ron
Japan did attack Russia. Japan and Russia fought over Manchuria. The war wad fought in the cold of winter like Stalingrad.
Yes, that's exactly what I was talking about. They? Who? The British? lol. Why would they? They were very organized and bravely counterattacked themselves even before the U.S got into WW2.
If you look into most battles the British were pretty much loosing everywhere until we got into the war and fought along side them. The first campaign they won was in North Africa and that was not until we got into the North African battle with them. Not taking anything away from Britian but they started finally winning battles after the US entered the war and fought every battle with them such as North Africa , Sicily and then Italy and so on. They were basically defeated everywhere up until North Africa including getting kicked out of France by the Germans. Ron
I wasn't talking about things that happened outside of the U.K. Their primary goal was to keep Hitler from marching in. What you said might be true, but it's just not what I meant. I am talking about the things the British did to defend the U.K. without any help.. for quite some time.
I hear this quit often, and I just saw this in another thread again. Although he said "if it wasn't for the U.S. and Britain, France would be speaking German". I hear this mostly in response to criticism of the U.S. ,though.
I think Britain did successfully defend itself and counterattacked on its own. Maybe if Hitler hadn't invaded Russia and completely focused on the U.K., they would have been able to defeat them. But since he did invade Russia fought too many wars, I think they could have continued this without any help. Of course, France is a different story. They were probably completely lost on their own. I don't think many Americans give the British enough credit.
What's your take on this or what do you think about those statements?
That's a stupid statement. The US was reluctant to join the war for a long time, and the British held the fort against superior force and overwhelming odds.
Allies should not disparage the contributions each other have made. I have a lot of respect for the British; their conduct during the 1940-41 period alone proves they're worthy of the title of a great people.
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