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But I am pretty sure that the purges of the 30ies had something to do with Stalin's fear/suspicion of people in the government loyal to Trotsky, (they were not necessarily Jews though,) starting with assassination of Sergey Kirov.
How justified they were ( or not) I can't tell.
If we talk about the theme of “The Great Terror and the Jews” and related two mythological myths that are opposite in meaning: 1) this terror is the apogee of “Jewish-Bolshevik” repressions against the Russian people, and 2) The Great Terror is an instrument used by the “Russian statesman "Stalin to get rid of the" Jewish guard "of Lenin, the first of them, it seems, has nothing to do with the real past. For along with the Great Terror, other peoples of the USSR, including Jews, suffered along with the Russians. As for the second statement, it has a certain actual core, though it has undergone too loose interpretation. The Great Terror is a period of conveyor change of elites, when Stalin actively got rid of those whom he considered waste material, which had to be replaced by nominees personally loyal to him. Since Jews, since 1917, were widely represented in the apparatus of power in the USSR (including the NKVD) and many of them fell under the purge of 1937-1938, it may seem that it was anti-Jewish in nature. But this is fundamentally wrong, because they were persecuted not on an ethnic basis, but on a political basis - as former members of the “counter-revolutionary bourgeois” parties or as oppositionists inside the CPSU (b) who had been maliciously attacking against Stalin. This political phenomenon was superimposed on the replacement of ideological paradigms - Leninist proletarian internationalism, which fell on the second half of the 1930s, with Stalinist Soviet patriotism, in which the Russian people were given the role of "elder brother" and a nation-forming nation. And this also made in 1937 undesirable the presence of Jews in the Soviet leadership, where, as is known, their only representative, Lazar Kaganovich, was left for propaganda purposes.
but most of the good food trace their origins out side of Russia.
Borsht: Ukraine
Pelmeni: Siberia
Plov: Uzbekistan
Oliver Salad: France
Ukha: Cossacks
Lapsha: Tatars
Vinaigrette: France
Vareniki: Ukraine
Shashlik: Caucuses
Kotlety: France
Beef Stroganoff: France
And on top of that many of typical dishes in Russia have a shared history with all of eastern eruope and sometimes all of Europe too, so it's hard to determine the actual origin, such as kholodets which is similar to Aspic in the west, sometimes called jello salad. The only uniquely Russian food is probably herring under a fur coat, which personally is not that great, it's ok, but I never crave for it.
However one thing can be said is that Russia has made these foods more popular and wide spread than they would've been otherwise. But how much of these foods do people eat in the west? The only ones that Americans are aware of and like to eat are probably Peroshki, and even then people confuse them with polish perogies.
Golubtsy, pirog, pirozhki. Bliny (?), blinchiki. Vatrushki. (OK, "cheese Danish" is a European thing, but the Russians do it best, trust me!!)
If beef Stroganoff was invented in France, why did they call it "stroganoff"? HA! I'm going with Zimogor, who reports, that it was invented in Russia by a French chef.
Olivier salad: interestingly, the Romanians call it "Russian salad", so it must have come from Russia. Otherwise, being Latins themselves, they would call it "French salad". lol
Olivier salad: interestingly, the Romanians call it "Russian salad", so it must have come from Russia. Otherwise, being Latins themselves, they would call it "French salad". lol
Don't forget South America. It's a poplar dish there, known as "ensalada rusa". It was probably brought over by Jewish immigrants.
If we talk about the theme of “The Great Terror and the Jews” and related two mythological myths that are opposite in meaning: 1) this terror is the apogee of “Jewish-Bolshevik” repressions against the Russian people, and 2) The Great Terror is an instrument used by the “Russian statesman "Stalin to get rid of the" Jewish guard "of Lenin, the first of them, it seems, has nothing to do with the real past. For along with the Great Terror, other peoples of the USSR, including Jews, suffered along with the Russians. As for the second statement, it has a certain actual core, though it has undergone too loose interpretation. The Great Terror is a period of conveyor change of elites, when Stalin actively got rid of those whom he considered waste material, which had to be replaced by nominees personally loyal to him. Since Jews, since 1917, were widely represented in the apparatus of power in the USSR (including the NKVD) and many of them fell under the purge of 1937-1938, it may seem that it was anti-Jewish in nature. But this is fundamentally wrong, because they were persecuted not on an ethnic basis, but on a political basis - as former members of the “counter-revolutionary bourgeois” parties or as oppositionists inside the CPSU (b) who had been maliciously attacking against Stalin. This political phenomenon was superimposed on the replacement of ideological paradigms - Leninist proletarian internationalism, which fell on the second half of the 1930s, with Stalinist Soviet patriotism, in which the Russian people were given the role of "elder brother" and a nation-forming nation. And this also made in 1937 undesirable the presence of Jews in the Soviet leadership, where, as is known, their only representative, Lazar Kaganovich, was left for propaganda purposes.
"Why the "Great Terror" has been long associated in Russia with "purges of Jews" in the upper echelon of power, and the confidence that they were well-founded?"
I am sorry I feel lost right there.
I had Jews in my family. ( Well Muslims too, to be honest))) )
I had anti-semitic Russians in my family.
I had Russians who couldn't care less ( married to Jews.)
All from Stalin's generation.
Never ever have I heard from any of them, that "great purges" were IN ANY WAY associated with "Jewish question."
It were two completely different matters.
And that's why I didn't quite understand you first time around.
Last edited by PJSaturn; 12-06-2019 at 09:24 PM..
Reason: English only is permitted, per the Terms of Service.
Golubtsy, pirog, pirozhki. Bliny (?), blinchiki. Vatrushki. (OK, "cheese Danish" is a European thing, but the Russians do it best, trust me!!)
If beef Stroganoff was invented in France, why did they call it "stroganoff"? HA! I'm going with Zimogor, who reports, that it was invented in Russia by a French chef.
Olivier salad: interestingly, the Romanians call it "Russian salad", so it must have come from Russia. Otherwise, being Latins themselves, they would call it "French salad". lol
and where did those French chef's come from, and where did they get their inspiration? The Russian peasant food? I doubt it.
But yes I agree, I love Russian cuisine, and of course a lot depends on who is making the dish too. I just wanted to point out that Russian cuisine is a hodgepodge of various European, central Asian and middle eastern food. But I think in the end that is only a strength. I know when my family moved to the US we have incorporated some Mexican and Asian twists to our food ( and vice versa), particularly adding a lot more spices than one would typically find in Russian food, so in the end the only thing that matters really is if the food tastes good.
Golubtsy, pirog, pirozhki. Bliny (?), blinchiki. Vatrushki. (OK, "cheese Danish" is a European thing, but the Russians do it best, trust me!!)
If beef Stroganoff was invented in France, why did they call it "stroganoff"? HA! I'm going with Zimogor, who reports, that it was invented in Russia by a French chef.
Olivier salad: interestingly, the Romanians call it "Russian salad", so it must have come from Russia. Otherwise, being Latins themselves, they would call it "French salad". lol
Quote:
The first recipe for "beef strogonovsky, with mustard" was printed in the book "Gift to young Housewives" Elena Molokhovets in 1871.[1][2][3]. The dish is named after count Alexander Grigoryevich Stroganov (1795-1891).
According to the main version, the dish was created by the French chef Andre DuPont, who served Stroganov.[4].
The salad is named after the chef Lucien Olivier, who worked in Moscow in the early 1860s at the Hermitage restaurant of French cuisine.
Vladimir Gilyarovsky in the book "Moscow and Muscovites" in the Chapter "On the tube" recalled[2]:
It was considered a special chic when dinners were prepared by the French chef Olivier, even then famous for his invented "salad Olivier", without which lunch is not at lunch and the secret of which he did not open. No matter how hard gourmets tried, it did not work out: that, but not that.
and where did those French chef's come from, and where did they get their inspiration? The Russian peasant food? I doubt it.
But yes I agree, I love Russian cuisine, and of course a lot depends on who is making the dish too. I just wanted to point out that Russian cuisine is a hodgepodge of various European, central Asian and middle eastern food. But I think in the end that is only a strength. I know when my family moved to the US we have incorporated some Mexican and Asian twists to our food ( and vice versa), particularly adding a lot more spices than one would typically find in Russian food, so in the end the only thing that matters really is if the food tastes good.
You know, if you go through the Wiki article "Russian cuisine" in RUSSIAN, you get a much better idea what genuinely RUSSIAN cuisine is, ( and not necessarily just "peasant",) vs when you read the article in English.
The amazing amount of game, FISH dishes big time, ( fish stuffed with vegetables including, and ditto - caviar,) variety of RUSSIAN soups, porriges of different kind, MUSHROOMS cooked in different ways, ( other pickled vegetables) BLINY (prepared the ways typical only for Russia,) all kind of pies and pirozhki- big variety of them, prepared in many different ways. Honey and berries based desserts, drinks that are unique only for Russia - with other words original RUSSIAN cuisine was definitely different before the arrival of European chiefs in Moscow and St. Pet in the 18th century. The "European" cuisine was incorporated into Russian cuisine as some dishes from Asian/Caucasian cuisine were incorporated before that, and all now feel like inseparable part of what's considered now "Russian cuisine."
You know, if you go through the article "Russian cuisine" in RUSSIAN, you get a much better idea what genuinely RUSSIAN cuisine is, ( and not necessarily just "peasant",) vs when you read the article in English.
The amazing amount of game, FISH dishes big time, ( fish stuffed with vegetables including, and ditto - caviar,) variety of RUSSIAN soups, porriges of different kind, MUSHROOMS cooked in different ways, ( other pickled vegetables) BLINY (prepared the ways typical only for Russia,) all kind of pies and pirozhki- big variety of them, prepared in many different ways. Drinks that are unique only for Russia - with other words original RUSSIAN cuisine was definitely different before the arrival of European chiefs in Moscow and St. Pet in the 18th century. The "European" cuisine was incorporated into Russian cuisine as some dishes from Asian/Caucasian cuisine were incorporated before that, and all now feel like inseparable part of what's considered now "Russian cuisine."
I feel it is time to create a topic with recipes of Russian cuisine.
I feel it is time to create a topic with recipes of Russian cuisine.
I somehow feel that just "the recipe" won't do - you will need the "Russian oven" ( or whatever it's called in English.)
My early childhood memories - we actually had one of those in the summer house, and my grand-mother ( well one of them) was fixing that traditional Russian cuisine in them. The taste was quite unique, comparably to the regular stove top ( HER parents were still around, so the recipes were going all the way back to Tzarist Russia.)
The other part of the family on another hand was fixing dishes that were mostly of European origin as I realized later, but they never gave it too much thought.
Practically I never have used it or seen in action but I know it better keeps warm than a usual fireplace. But a Russian stove is a potentially very dangerous device. The user must close the gate before going to sleep. The reaction of burning is such that monoxide of carbon appears at some conditions (lack of oxygen). As we know monoxide of carbon is a poison.
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Russian oven
