Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
So in a way, the famine was a government-imposed one, like the Ukrainian Famine, that Stalin created.
The blight was felt world wide, and devistated potatoes crops all over, but was an act of nature. So the British government didn't create the conditions, but in exporting what could be harvested instead of using it to feed those who were starving it could be said to be imposed.
But look back. For two hundred years, the British had been working on elimination of this excess population, from outright murder, to capture and enslavement, to taking land which would support them. The 'Modest Proposal' on the Irish problem was satire, but reflected the view the powerful took of the powerless. They were in the way. If more dissapeared, if America would take ship after ship of immigrants, all the better.
In essense, it was a combination of nature, greed, and a long tradition of abusive practices.
I know this guy (currently in the U.S.)from Ireland, and when that happened, he says they view the Queen the same as Americans viewed Bin Laden. I found this both enlightening and hilarious.
Right on!
I’m Irish and I can clarify that most Irish are fond of the Queen and saw her visit as a very positive thing. There are a few (mostly the uneducated) who have the same view as the guy you know. It’s true that as a nation we are still wary of the British as a nation but the Queen is just a figurehead and certainly not an evil dictator like Bin Laden (what a stupid comparison)
The fact that Britain didn't have universal voting at the time and only a small percentage of males who owned property were allowed to vote, meant the vast majority of the people in Britain didn't have a say in helping the Irish. In terms of preventing the Irish from receiving aid, this is more the stuff of urban myth and legend.
Secondly times were very tough in England as well, the average male life expectancy in a city such as Liverpool was 26 years old in 1851. Whilst the slum conditions in many British cities were appauling with hunger, malnutrition and disease common place in Victorian cities.
Finally a lot of Irish people did emigrate from Ireland, many to mainland Great Britain, which is only 12 miles away at the narrowest point. Many British Cities saw a massive Irish Influx, with one in three of the population of cities such as Manchester believed to have Irish Ancestory.
Of course the ordinary British men and women were not responsible for the neglect of the Irish when they were under British rule. The fact is the British decided to colonise Ireland but when things got tough they completely neglected the people and let them starve. Yes Irish people emigrated to Britain as they did to the USA, but I fail to see the significance in that???? The British Government still let the Irish starve .
I decided to do research on why the Irish Catholics didn't grow other crops, eat sheep, bread or fish. The simple answer is they couldn't. The more complicated answer is due to several laws enacted by the British Parliament, prohibiting the Irish from thriving on anything other than potatoes. Penal Laws of 1697 prohibited the Irish Catholics from practicing their religion, language, owning land, voting, holding office, and serving in the military. They also had to pay high rents on the meager 5 acres of land they were allowed to farm. Irish Catholics were prohibited from owning livestock that produced revenue. Horses were also prohibited to the Irish Catholic if it was worth a certain price. They were also prohibited from living within 5 miles of town or within the landlord’s estate. Houses were small in order to make the best use of land for farming. Potatoes were chosen because they were easy to grow, rich in vitamin C, protein, and carbohydrates and their gain/acre was abundant. Other grains required many acres to produce a sufficient output of which the peasant was denied. Livestock was not owned by the Irish Catholic but rather the property of the landlord. Sharecrop farmers were forced at gun point by the increased British military presence to turn over any byproducts from livestock and crops for export to Great Britain. The Corn Laws of 1814 were imposed on lower priced grain from foreign countries resulting in artificially high cost of grain for flour and cereals. In order to make bread, the Irish had to have money to buy the refined grain and cereal. Due to the high rents on their land, they did not have money to purchase the necessary ingredients. Great Britain finally eased these laws in a 3 stage process beginning in 1846 but by then the plight of the Irish Catholic was already in a downward spiral. The Poor Laws of 1838 was Great Britain's feeble attempt to do something about the great poverty in Ireland and the rest of the British Empire. Initially, able bodied people could work in exchange for food and shelter. Admitted families were separated into 3 groups; men, women and children. They could not co-mingle and were not permitted to talk and visit their families. With the onset of the potato blight these work houses were rapidly taken over by the sick, elderly and the extremely malnourished. Conditions quickly deteriorated in these workhouses. There were rats, mortal disease and severe malnourishment resulting in massive amounts of people dying.
Landlords were required to support these workhouses in the form of taxes to England. Landlords made their money off the rents of their tenants and any money gain from their sharecropping. Tenants who were behind in their rent were evicted quickly with the aid of hired "crowbar" thugs who destroyed the mud / stone dwellings of the poor Catholics. Once evicted, the Catholics either entered the workhouse or lived in hiding off the land often resulting in eating grass or weeds. It was unlawful for Irish Catholics to be out past dark, so those who were evicted and homeless were arrested and put in prison. Prison was not a welcomed relief. Like the workhouses, living conditions were deplorable. Consequently, landlords quickly realized that it was cheaper to book passage for their delinquent tenants on emigrating "coffin ships" rather than pay higher taxes to support the overcrowded workhouses.
In regards to fishing, again these laws played an integral role in preventing the Irish Catholic from thriving in their land. First and foremost, the Irish Catholics did not consider a fish suitable food as their main diet consisted on potatoes and a small amount of buttermilk. Those who did fish did so at the behest of the landlords who hired them. Due to the extreme weather conditions of the Irish Sea and Atlantic Ocean, fishermen needed heavy, well geared boats to withstand the winds and rocky coastline. Curraghs, the small traditional Irish boats were too fragile to withstand the typical Irish weather and waters. These boats were more suitable for lakes and bays. However, lakes and bays were the property of landlords and anything caught was confiscated by the British Military. The heavier boats were usually owned by wealthy Irish Protestants and landowners and therefore the catch belonged to them not the fishermen. The fishermen were required to purchase their own gear. Prior to the blight, the fishermen did not struggle with gear purchases. Once the blight occurred however, the fishermen did not have enough money to feed their families, abandoned the boats, and sold their gear to feed their families. The Irish did not lack initiative, and were not stupid. They had to make desperate choices to survive. They were a oppressed society at the hand of the richest, most powerful country of the 19th century.
Another lesson learned by the world from the potato famine was to not grow only 1 type of potato. A disease that affects 1 type may not affect another type. Therefore assuring you will at least have some crop.
Another lesson learned by the world from the potato famine was to not grow only 1 type of potato. A disease that affects 1 type may not affect another type. Therefore assuring you will at least have some crop.
Yes, they grew what were known as "lumpers." A potato of great size, and one which produced the max crop for the land that was used.
Adding to your previous post, by the time of the famine Irish Catholics who had the means to pay the rent could hold far more than 5 acres. My ancestors did. However, cereal crops grown on the tenant's land were sold to pay the rents and to provide a small income for those goods that these people needed to purchase. Flour was purchased for the most part. Thus, the potato was still the main crop planted on the land that the family used to provide their own food supply.
Another lesson learned by the world from the potato famine was to not grow only 1 type of potato. A disease that affects 1 type may not affect another type. Therefore assuring you will at least have some crop.
It wasn't that they didn't know, it was the only option for many. The potato blight effected not just Ireland but worldwide, and hit very hard in England. Many other places the circumstances were different and there was more which could be grown, so they were not hit as hard. For Irish tenant farmers the options were very few.
Famines are often created by politics, not always by natural disaster. The current tendency to encourage developing countries to produce export crops (flowers, artichokes in the case of Ecuador, broccoli (which no locals eat) in the case of Guatemala, is setting countries up for famine.
For some good background on the famine and its causes and effects, I recommend The Reason Why by Cecil Woodham-Smith. Ostensibly a book dealing with the infamous Charge of the Light Brigade during the Crimean War, its chapters concerning British policies in Ireland -- and specifically the role of Lord Lucan in his treatment of Irish tenant farmers -- are informative and highly readable.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
why the Irish starved
