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Where I live, this work would require a permit, but you can do the work yourself and there are no inspections required by the regional building department.
so i asked our rep who said , yep , that is their out in case they don't want to cover it .
i have not been a distributor for years now , being retired so not sure if it still reads like that
If a warranty said anything about quality, then GM cars have long been superior to Honda and Toyota. Their warranties also had plenty of outs that included dropping the entire cost of a warranty on dealers.
Plug-in protector warranties always have plenty of fine print exemptions. These change with different products. For example, one APC warranty said a protector from any other manufacturer anywhere in the house voided their warranty. Warranty is rarely if ever honored.
Only relevant parameter is current. Lightning can be 20,000 amps. So a minimal 'whole house' protector is 50,000 amps. Because an effective protector never does protection. It is simply a connecting device to what harmlessly absorbs hundreds of thousands of joules.
50,000 amps defined protector life expectancy over *many* decades and *many* direct lightning strikes.
That 'hundreds of thousands' defines plug-in protectors as grossly undersized - sacrificial and ineffective protection. Those should be used only if a 'whole house' protector exists. And more important is 'properly installed'.
A 'whole house' protector is effective during *each* surge when it makes a low impedance (ie less than 10 foot) connection to single point earth ground. Only earth ground harmlessly absorbs that energy. All wires in every incoming cable (phone, TV, satellite) also must make that low impedance (ie less than 10 foot) connection to those same electrodes.
Does not appear to be any slots for a dual breaker. A 'whole house' protector might share breakers with other circuits only if that breaker is designed (rated) for two wires.
Just as critical is how a quarter inch, bare copper wire connects that breaker box to earth ground. If that wire goes up over the foundation and down to electrodes, then impedance is excessive due to sharp bends over the foundation and too long. Better is to route through a foundation and down to electrodes. Shorter, no bends, and also separated from non-grounding wires. Because that earth ground (not the protector) actually defines protection during *each* surge.
Never disconnect that earth ground wire to install another. That earth ground connection must always exist even if the main breaker is off - for human safety.
the one i installed said to install it at the very top or very bottom right next to the main hot wires coming into the breaker box. that way, it will absorb the surge before it gets to any other circuit. or at least that's the idea.
the one i installed said to install it at the very top or very bottom right next to the main hot wires coming into the breaker box.
Again, 'whole house' protectors do not absorb surges. A 'whole house' protector that absorbs less energy is a better protector. Numbers that also define that can be found in charts in datasheets. A plug-in protector must somehow 'block' or 'absorb' a surge. A 'whole house' protector must become a most conductive path for a surge (absorb least amount of energy).
Apply an impulse to a long wire. Where on that wire is the impulse first detected? At the end where that impulse is applied? Of course not. That impulse is first detected at the farthest end.
Inches difference between top and bottom of a breaker box is little relevant (due to the above paragraph and for other reasons). But every foot shorter that hardwire from breaker box to earth electrodes does increase protection. Removing sharp bends in that hardwire also increases protection.
Increasing separation between protector and appliances / electronics also increases protection.
The use of the layered units is the best way to do it ...the thinking that people have that the lowly outlet strip is all they need is crazy ...you need to knock these spikes down with each stage before passing it on
I have the Type 2 Eaton Ultras covering the panels, then Type 3 (either strips, plug in single appliance, UPS units and/or surge 120V outlets) protecting electronics and some expensive appliances.
For my computer stuff that's really important I use Liebert GXT2 double-conversion UPS units (all bought refurbished or used on eBay for peanuts and I then swapped the internal fans to make them quiet). They'll take just about anything coming in (sagging utility power or on a generator) and produce nice clean 120V @ 60 Hz.
They'll take just about anything coming in (sagging utility power or on a generator) and produce nice clean 120V @ 60 Hz.
UPS manufacturers recommend no motorized appliances or strip protectors powered from a UPS. Because UPS power, that is ideal for all electronics, is often too 'dirty' for those other appliances.
Voltage can drop so low that incandescent bulbs dim to 40% intensity. Even a voltage a that must be just fine for any ATX computer. As even defined in the original ATX specifications. 'Dirty' power, that can be harmful to motorized appliances and protectors, is also ideal for electronics. Due to what is required and exists in power supplies.
If that UPS power is so clean, then a %THD number (or something equivalent) says how much.
UPS is temporary and 'dirty' power so that unsaved data is saved and reboots averted. It's specification numbers demonstrate why it does nothing to protect saved data or hardware.
Sagging utility voltage is not harmful to electronics. But can be problematic to less robust motorized appliances (ie refrigerator, furnace, dishwasher, central air). So what needs protection from sags?
UPS manufacturers recommend no motorized appliances or strip protectors powered from a UPS. Because UPS power, that is ideal for all electronics, is often too 'dirty' for those other appliances.
Voltage can drop so low that incandescent bulbs dim to 40% intensity. Even a voltage a that must be just fine for any ATX computer. As even defined in the original ATX specifications. 'Dirty' power, that can be harmful to motorized appliances and protectors, is also ideal for electronics. Due to what is required and exists in power supplies.
If that UPS power is so clean, then a %THD number (or something equivalent) says how much.
UPS is temporary and 'dirty' power so that unsaved data is saved and reboots averted. It's specification numbers demonstrate why it does nothing to protect saved data or hardware.
Sagging utility voltage is not harmful to electronics. But can be problematic to less robust motorized appliances (ie refrigerator, furnace, dishwasher, central air). So what needs protection from sags?
A true online/double conversion UPS is going to have less than 5% THD, or essentially utility grade. My generator has a Mecc Alte head and produces less than 6% THD, a lot better than the typical Generac stuff which I’ve heard can be 20%+.
Note that an online UPS is NOT temporary. It is ALWAYS in use (a downside of these is inefficiency due to conversion loss). It takes in AC power of a range of voltages and frequencies, converts it to DC, and then back to AC at 120V/60Hz in a true sine wave. If the incoming AC is interrupted then the batteries aren’t being charged. These UPS units also run fine on a generator where line-interactive or standby/offline UPS units may switch to/from battery depending on how sensitive they are to incoming voltage and frequency.
Your reference to “dirty” is for backup UPS units that produce stepped sine waves. I agree that for most computer power supplies these days it really doesn’t matter.
Last edited by markjames68; 10-22-2019 at 06:46 PM..
I have the Type 2 Eaton Ultras covering the panels, then Type 3 (either strips, plug in single appliance, UPS units and/or surge 120V outlets) protecting electronics and some expensive appliances.
For my computer stuff that's really important I use Liebert GXT2 double-conversion UPS units (all bought refurbished or used on eBay for peanuts and I then swapped the internal fans to make them quiet). They'll take just about anything coming in (sagging utility power or on a generator) and produce nice clean 120V @ 60 Hz.
I need to install the Eaton type 2. Does it have to be mounted inside the box or outside? Did you end up buying the flush mount kit?
I need to install the Eaton type 2. Does it have to be mounted inside the box or outside? Did you end up buying the flush mount kit?
Mine are mounted outside (and literally outdoors as well) and didn’t need a flush mount kit. Mounted through a knockout on the panel.
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