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The 12M illegals do not really exist in isolation from "good" Americans and legal immigrants. Most importanly, a lot of them have family members who are perfectly legal. Unfortunately, the US immigration system does not value family ties other than immediate ones (spouses and minor children), requiring either a very long wait or not giving any chance at all. But even in the case of an immediate relative, if their sponsor in the US is "only" a green card holder, the wait is at least three or four years. To complicate matters further, if an illegal border crossing is involved (no border inspection), even a marriage to an American citizen will not help the illegal. To summarize, with regards to family ties, illegal immigration is the only route open to quite a few families out there who want to be together.
In no way am I justifying what these people did by violating the border-- however, the fact is that a lot of the illegals have close legal relatives in the US. How they got to that point is not very important. The simple truth is that for most people (especially Latin Americans!), family is the most important thing in their lives. If one has a spouse, child, parent, sibling or even a grandparent living with them and someone wants to deport that relative, it is going to be very traumatic. Especially if they've lived together for many years, which also happens a lot, since a lot of illegals have been in the US for quite a while.
I mean seriously, imagine: you are a green card holder and you've got a spouse who crossed the border illegally as a child. You fell in love and you married-- worrying about status was not probably what you were thinking about then. You've been living together for ten years, you've got a couple of kids, a house, a car and a regular vacation. Until recently nobody has been giving you much trouble. Probably you didn't even know the immigration law too well, because most people have only a very vague notion about it. Since you only have a greencard (and also because the spouse crossed the border illegally), there's little hope for legalizing the spouse. Then suddenly you realize that a couple of guys in uniform can rush into your house in the middle of the night and take the most important thing in your life-- your spouse-- away, to Mexico or whatever. Forever. You realize that any moment you may be left alone with the kids and the kids may be left without their mother or father. Yes, there is a real possibility that your very life, all your dreams, will be destroyed. If I, God forbid, was ever faced with that situation I would be so scared and pissed off that I'd vote for anyone that would avert the tragedy, regardless of their stand on any other issues and I'd probably start a very loud and angry campaign for my cause. I think most normal people would do the same. It is not hard to imagine a serious separatist movement by Mexicans and Central Americans in Southern California, should there be enough people in such situations!
While what I described is an extreme (but not uncommon!) scenario, I think we can safely say that the 12M illegals have 10, 20 or 30 million LEGAL relatives who'd do absolutely ANYTHING to keep their loved ones in the country. That includes, of course, the American-born children of illegals. That is the situation NOW and let's forget about our notions of how things should have been. The fact is that, in addition to the illegals themselves there are millions and millions of people who love them and depend on them. In a democratic system breaking so many hearts would not only be immoral but also politically unfeasible. Yes, we can throw out 3,4, maybe 5, maybe 7 million people. However, there are also millions that are tightly integrated into America, most importantly through family ties and these are the tricky ones. A limited and carefully-crafted amnesty is necessary, pardoning those who have strong ties to the land and no criminal record. Changing the citizenship law to require legal status of parents for the child to get citizenship would also be great. However, the children born here until then will need to be granted citizenship because currently the birth certificate does not state the parents' immigration status so figuring out who was born to legal parents would not be possible.
When the illegals say "we are America" during their marches, often times they are quite simply right. "Deport them all" approach is a non-starter, stealing valuable time from finding a solution that can actually work. We have an illness and we must learn to live with it and manage it, rather than deny it.
Well, they made an effort to manage it, but that would mean.....hide the kids!! Amnesty!! So now we are back to doing nothing. Maybe once Bush is carted out of the White House the next President will be in a better position to keep the ditto heads at bay and pass an immigration bill that deals with this reality.
Well, they made an effort to manage it, but that would mean.....hide the kids!! Amnesty!! So now we are back to doing nothing. Maybe once Bush is carted out of the White House the next President will be in a better position to keep the ditto heads at bay and pass an immigration bill that deals with this reality.
That bill would essentially have granted complete amnesty to most people who've been here for over half a year. Even to many violent criminals. That was a terrible bill.
I think "amnesty" should be much more descriminating-- being tough on criminals and requiring long residence period in the US plus family ties.
Well, they made an effort to manage it, but that would mean.....hide the kids!! Amnesty!! So now we are back to doing nothing. Maybe once Bush is carted out of the White House the next President will be in a better position to keep the ditto heads at bay and pass an immigration bill that deals with this reality.
Where have you been? BUSH said he wanted that bill and would have signed it. Bush definately kisses illegal immigrants back sides.
Do you really think I care about their (illegal immigrants) feelings??? NOPE! Deport em!
You can afford not to care about their feelings, but you cannot ignore the feelings of their legal relatives, including their American-born children.
In some parts of California, Arizona, New Mexico or Florida there are a so many illegals (and their relatives) that hurting their feelings might cause all hell break loose! They might just elect radical leaders (or overthrow the local government) and a strong separatist movement could follow. Even if you are right morally, you have to be sure that you don't anger too many. That's life.
Where have you been? BUSH said he wanted that bill and would have signed it. Bush definately kisses illegal immigrants back sides.
Right, Bush is such a lame duck he could not pass anything at this point in his presidency. If by "kissing illegal immigrant's backsides" as you so eloquently state, you mean getting them into the sytem to pay their fair dues, then yes, I guess that is what he was doing. But you are right, better to just leave things as they are...
I agree with you sergyen. However, I'm not so concerned about anyone who is not an IR.
Yeah, IRs of USCs and LPRs should be allowed to stay, period. Unless they are felons, that is.
However, parents of American-born children also present a bit of an issue. Deporting Mommy and Daddy is pretty darn contraversial! I bet there are quite a few cities where MOST people are either illegals or their children. I smell some rioting if ICE starts showing up over there consistently. If we were China, we'd just use the Army but since we aren't....
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