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To me, pro-illegal is wanting a) opening of the borders, b)supporting illegal immigration.
I havent made any posts that suggest either. But I defend illegal immigrants against lots of accusations and stereotypes, and I clearly sympathize for most of them. And thats why I've been called pro-illegal.
And mostly because I defend them in an argumentative way, which gets people mad and want to call me a Pro-Illegal.
I don't consider myself one anyways. My feelings go beyond the politics of it.
Can you relate to how difficult it is for us to understand how you can “defend” something you don’t “support.” It’s incongruent to defend, yet not support, with the possible exception of the job of a defense attorney.
Personally, I don’t think I could defend behavior I don’t support. It would be too much of an internal conflict. This is precisely why I knew I could never become a defense attorney. I knew there were certain criminals my conscience would never permit me to defend.
Can you relate to how difficult it is for us to understand how you can “defend” something you don’t “support.” It’s incongruent to defend, yet not support, with the possible exception of the job of a defense attorney.
Personally, I don’t think I could defend behavior I don’t support. It would be too much of an internal conflict. This is precisely why I knew I could never become a defense attorney. I knew there were certain criminals my conscience would never permit me to defend.
Like I said, my feelings go beyond the politics of the issue.
If your brother's a car thief, youre going to love him, and not necessarily love what he's doing.
And I'm not renouncing my citizenship or anything, or being less American, by seeing these people as my own. I literally have cousins and aunts, and brothers and sisters of my grandparents, who are Mexican living in Mexico. The connection is strong. My grandmother immigrated her herself.
I resent the use of the word "invasion", "war", "reconquista", "illegal alien menace". As if its some kind of orchestrated plan to invade America and rob it of its resources.
My family came here, but they worked their way. They pulled their own weight. And I see a lot of these people here doing the same thing. I refuse to have bad feeligns against the immigrants themselves.
Go against the employers, tighten the border, whatever.
I'm against the developing hatred of illegal immigrants, which isn't too far from extending towards Mexicans in general, with this post as an example.
Can you relate to how difficult it is for us to understand how you can “defend” something you don’t “support.” It’s incongruent to defend, yet not support, with the possible exception of the job of a defense attorney.
Personally, I don’t think I could defend behavior I don’t support. It would be too much of an internal conflict. This is precisely why I knew I could never become a defense attorney. I knew there were certain criminals my conscience would never permit me to defend.
BRILLIANT point....and goes a long way in explaining why some defense attorneys are held in such low regard out here in the 'real world'. Defending the indefensible ALWAYS takes a lot of explaining.
(Some years back, there was actually a move here in California to ban "lawyer jokes" as hate crimes (!)...it didn't get very far, but there was some validity in the sentimrents that led up to it....some people really DO hate lawyers. Wonder why?)
Being Latino is not something you just leave at the gates of entering the USA, AZBear. There is no choosing to be Latino first, one is both, simultaneously.
The true measure of loyalty would be war, let's hope it doesn't come to that, that is why I refuse to call this an "invasion" or "war"
As per another thread: with the growing numbers of Mexican nationals fleeing to the US escaping the Zeta's, etc. (your uncle comes to mind)--------that may be the real impetus for the USA to close/lock the southern border.
Then it will be 'are you with us or against us'----------> most Hispanics.
The hammer is coming down; and barring a last minute reprieve-------it could be very ugly near Sonora, Nuevo Leon, etc.
Like I said, my feelings go beyond the politics of the issue.
If your brother's a car thief, youre going to love him, and not necessarily love what he's doing. And I'm not renouncing my citizenship or anything, or being less American, by seeing these people as my own. I literally have cousins and aunts, and brothers and sisters of my grandparents, who are Mexican living in Mexico. The connection is strong. My grandmother immigrated her herself.
I resent the use of the word "invasion", "war", "reconquista", "illegal alien menace". As if its some kind of orchestrated plan to invade America and rob it of its resources.
I have a brother who has been in trouble. Although I didn't stop loving him, I didn't defend him either.
If 20 million foreigners entered our country during the course of a weekend, what would you consider it? I realize illegals have entered over a period of time, but the end result is the same. Likewise, if someone enters your home without your permission, would you not consider it a home invasion?
Like I said, my feelings go beyond the politics of the issue.
If your brother's a car thief, youre going to love him, and not necessarily love what he's doing.
And I'm not renouncing my citizenship or anything, or being less American, by seeing these people as my own. I literally have cousins and aunts, and brothers and sisters of my grandparents, who are Mexican living in Mexico. The connection is strong. My grandmother immigrated her herself.
I resent the use of the word "invasion", "war", "reconquista", "illegal alien menace". As if its some kind of orchestrated plan to invade America and rob it of its resources.
My family came here, but they worked their way. They pulled their own weight. And I see a lot of these people here doing the same thing. I refuse to have bad feeligns against the immigrants themselves.
Go against the employers, tighten the border, whatever.
I'm against the developing hatred of illegal immigrants, which isn't too far from extending towards Mexicans in general, with this post as an example.
For the record: I had my own mother picked up by the police, went to court and had her butt committed to a mental hospital--------the woman was a danger to society and had to be stopped. BTW: I was age 19 when still in the Wash DC area.
For the record: I had my own mother picked up by the police, went to court and had her butt committed to a mental hospital--------the woman was a danger to society and had to be stopped. BTW: I was age 19 when still in the Wash DC area.
Blood ain't thicker than water to me.
Wow! You are certainly to be commended. If only we had more people like you, countless victims would probably still be alive.
I have a brother who has been in trouble. Although I didn't stop loving him, I didn't defend him either.
If 20 million foreigners entered our country during the course of a weekend, what would you consider it? I realize illegals have entered over a period of time, but the end result is the same. Likewise, if someone enters your home without your permission, would you not consider it a home invasion?
I think the shock of 20 million in a weekend would be a much different matter.
To take your metaphor extremely literally, theyr'e not entering my home. They're minding their own business, and I'm minding mine. They're not bothering me.
Its up to the government to handle it. I'm not going to go out and harass people trying to work.
If they are threatening my family or friends, thats a whole other thing.
But I dont believe very many of the illegal population are cold blooded criminals like the ones that pop out on the news all the time.
I know my attitude comes off of apathetic, but as a person surrounded by Mexican culture all my life, the change or whatever hasn't been as abrupt and traumatizing for me. I don't notice "more mexicans around" or anything. I have less to be angry about I guess.
The things that do anger me are things like gas prices, rising food prices, so much being spent on wars adding to our debt leading to our economic downturn. Those are things I feel angry about because some rich people are getting richer off of us. THOSE issues are affecting me.
I just don't have anger against people trying to work and make a living. If anything , I respect them more than the legal people living off welfare. Living in 20 bucks/month projects with brand new cars.
Maybe your'e right. Maybe if these people were "alien" to me, I would be more angry about the situation. But theyre not "alien" to me, and its easy for me to relate to them.
I acknowledge the problem of mass illegal immigration, but I think thats due to some flaws that need to be worked out. I'm not going to pin it on the people taking advantage of it to make a modest living that they couldnt have had otherwise.
For the record: I had my own mother picked up by the police, went to court and had her butt committed to a mental hospital--------the woman was a danger to society and had to be stopped. BTW: I was age 19 when still in the Wash DC area.
Blood ain't thicker than water to me.
Not to 'sermonize' any more than I usually do, but this is a textbook illustration of what it means to see ones' self as part of a "First World" society. As painful as this was for you, it was still just a case of your "doing the right thing"....yet, for much of the world's population, your effort wouldn't be understood. You put your 'society' over your family ties....and this is as it must be, if we're to survive as a modern society. It isn't 'human nature' to do so, and it goes against instinct. But that's what we have to do..ALL of us, if this is to 'work'.
Recall if you will that even infamous "Unabomber" Ted Kacyzynski was first 'ratted out' by his own brother...the brother saw "Ted's" writing style in the famous 'manifesto' the Bomber insisted be published...and his suspicions were relayed to the "Feds".
Congratulations to you, AB, and to David (?) Kacyzinski...both of you have made that extra effort that places our society above the 'petty', and has made a First World society possible. It CAN be done....
One common axiom I see in all of your comments is that you think Hispanics should rise up and congenially move against illegals that are a majority Hispanics. This goes against nature and definitely against culture of Latinos. Sure there are some, but if you are expecting this en masse, I doubt it will happen.
Thus we are left with the conundrum we are in.
It should have been fixed along time ago, now we must all get a long IMO while we fix the problem slowly ourselves. My guess is that free enterprise will cure it all, in the meantime have patience, maybe try not to be so angry, life will be better that way.
ITA, it should have been fixed a long time ago, and if it matters, we are just as ticked off with those in our government who for all intents and purposes are traitors who should be removed from office and prosecuted for treason, beginning with Geo. Bush.
I am hoping you can answer this question candidly and without hostility.
Apparently there are far more poverty stricken Mexicans than there are wealthy members of the oligarchy's who also benefit from the fruits of illegal alien labor, the remittances and the American taxpayers.
If Mexicans love Mexico and each other so much why not overthrow them? You definitely have the masses to do so? Why allow the oligarchies to perpetually encourage your fellow countrymen to risk life and limb to cross our borders for basic needs?
Even if it were allowed (which we all know we'd be gunned down in the streets if we attempted it) I can't imagine parading down the streets of Mexico waiving the American flag, demanding amnesty, jobs, human rights, civil rights, free education and healthcare while calling its citizens racist names, burning the Mexican flag and giving Mexico the finger.
Why such pride in and loyalty to a country that obviously devalues it's poor and doesn't love you back?
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