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Can I ask a question that might be a little controversial or out of the ordinary? We currently live in TX...there are plenty of areas and people here that are hardcore right wing conservative however there are just as many areas and people who are more on the liberal side. What is the general tolerance level of the people in IN?
When I say tolerance, I mean I have read and heard not so good things about LGBT issues in the state of Indiana - and the tolerance towards that community from it's residents. I've kind of gotten the vibe that a lot of the midwest is this way (again, from what I've read).
I have a teenage daughter who is not LGBT but she is very accepting of everyone, any race, religion, orientation, etc... as long as they are a good person. She has a hard time around those that hold prejudices and that alone could make her last 2 years of high school difficult and depressing. Every piece of info I've received on this board and other research I've done regarding the communities we are considering (Carmel, Fishers, Noblesville, Zionsville) had me pretty much sold on relocating to IN until I started researching the general stance on LGBT issues throughout the Midwest.
As I know it probably varies from city to city and not everyone shares the same opinions, just like here in TX, I guess I'm asking if IN residents drastically feel one way over the other and if it's blatantly obvious?
I mean no disrespect of anyone's opinions or beliefs here on this board, I just would like to hear from those of you who live here, or who might have kids in the high schools around the area.
My perspective (white male, straight) may not be worth much on this one, but i'll go ahead and offer it.
There is a small, but vocal contingent of residents in the state who finally had an ear and an ally in the statehouse the last 4 years for their radical anti-LGBT agenda. Their views were not supported by the majority of Hoosiers. This showed in Pence's plummeting approval ratings after his signing of the controversial RFRA bill that basically set the state on fire. It is worth noting that this bill was subsequently "fixed" after the outcry from around the state, and Indiana currently is leading the nation in passing local non-discrimination ordinances. According to Freedom Indiana, "Indiana is leading the nation in passing local LGBT non-discrimination laws this year—with 18 total municipalities across the state that have secured full, comprehensive LGBT protections! Cheer on this inspiring momentum, and find out more about how Hoosiers are advancing non-discrimination protections in local communities across the state: http://bit.ly/2c4RX13" These protected areas include Indianapolis, Zionsville, and Carmel. The town of Spencer, Indiana (pop 2,400) recently became the smallest community in the whole COUNTRY with an LGBT center. This stuff definitely flies in the face of the perception of Indiana (and the Midwest) but it's important to see that efforts are being made on the ground, even in small towns, to promote tolerance and acceptance.
More specific to your concern, I think the Indy metro area is pretty tolerant, and probably the most tolerant area in the state other than maybe Bloomington. Even the Northside, which is pretty overwhelmingly red, is more-so in the fiscal sense and less-so on social issues. I have an uncle in Carmel who is super republican. His son is gay. My uncle couldn't care less as long as his son being gay doesn't somehow raise his taxes. That's kind of the vibe I get from a lot of northsiders.
As for Indy itself, it's a major city, and in my experiences, very tolerant and accepting. This was evidenced in the wake of RFRA as the city collectively stood together to give a middle finger to Pence and his cronies. This was probably the strongest display of civic like-mindedness I've seen in Indy to date. Even the republican mayor (at the time) of Indy and the Indy Chamber (usually right leaning) came out to publicly fight against the law. Our annual pride festival is embraced by most of the city as well, and has been drawing over 100k attendees the last few years. They are actually moving it to a larger park to accommodate the swelling crowd size.
TL;DR - I have a hard time believing Indiana is any different (or worse) than Texas when it comes to tolerance. Our state may have elected dumber leaders (though Rick Perry, Ted Cruz, and the Bush's haven't exactly been advocates for the LGBT community) and it reflects poorly on all of us, but isn't necessarily indicative of the views of the people of the state - especially Metro Indy. I still maintain that many people who initially voted for Mike Pence thought they were getting another Mitch Daniels, and got something much worse instead. I don't think Pence would have won a re-election in Indiana, and his stance on social issues would have been the biggest factor as to why. Attitudes have shifted nationwide the last few years, and Indiana is no exception - especially among the younger generation, which would include your daughter's potential peers. It sounds like you've taught her right from wrong, and raised her well with regard to respecting and embracing diverse groups of people. Knowing that she's well grounded in her principles, I don't think she'd encounter anything here that would shake her too badly, or that would be different than anything she'd encounter anywhere else - especially Texas.
As I recall, polls repeatedly showed the general public in Indiana was against the same-sex marriage ban amendment to the state constitution that the government tried to push through, though it wasn't by that much. The so-called religious freedom law that was passed, though, had a large majority that was against it in every poll I saw but it still got passed. After the national outcry it was finally watered down which made it a bit better. There is still debate to try to add LGBT as a protected class in Indiana. And there was talk last year of a similar "bathroom" law that North Carolina passed but fortunately that has gotten nowhere, so far.
I feel the bigger cities are more excepting. Indianapolis, Fort Wayne, Bloomington, Evansville, etc. They all have city protections for LGBT. Even Carmel does and mayors of both Carmel and Fishers opposed the religious freedom law, despite both cities being very strong Republican strongholds. And as the previous poster said, Mike Pence was really struggling in his re-election campaign here. I've actually heard some people who were thinking about voting for Trump say he lost their vote by choosing Pence as his running mate. I've read some believe that current Republican nominee for governor Eric Holcomb is just another Mike Pence, though. I do remember going to see a show of Steve Martin and Martin Short at the Murat in downtown Indy last year. The guys were talking about famous people they had met while in Indiana. They mentioned Mike Pence and the whole place erupted in boos. I think even they were a little taken aback at how disliked he is around here.
What an awesome response. I really appreciate that.
I somewhat experienced something similar when I was in 8th grade (a LONG time ago) - my parents moved me from TX to a suburb of Tampa, FL. Going from a Catholic school in TX to a Catholic school in FL...we assumed there wouldn't be much difference. I was shocked by the behavior and comments made by the majority of the kids in my grade. They were extremely racist. I had just left one of my besties back home, who happened to be african american and I can't tell you how upset and sad it made me. After that, I never really felt comfortable around any of them. It's just one of those memories you can't forget. Thankfully, the move only lasted a year and we moved back to TX - where I finished high school with that friend and still talk to her now, 21 years later.
I kept thinking of this and wouldn't want my kid to go thru that.
What an awesome response. I really appreciate that.
I somewhat experienced something similar when I was in 8th grade (a LONG time ago) - my parents moved me from TX to a suburb of Tampa, FL. Going from a Catholic school in TX to a Catholic school in FL...we assumed there wouldn't be much difference. I was shocked by the behavior and comments made by the majority of the kids in my grade. They were extremely racist. I had just left one of my besties back home, who happened to be african american and I can't tell you how upset and sad it made me. After that, I never really felt comfortable around any of them. It's just one of those memories you can't forget. Thankfully, the move only lasted a year and we moved back to TX - where I finished high school with that friend and still talk to her now, 21 years later.
I kept thinking of this and wouldn't want my kid to go thru that.
Being someone who was born and raised in Indianapolis and now lives in Tampa, I can understand your experience.
When I originally moved to Tampa in the mid 90s I was stunned to find a fair amount of what I would consider "residual racism". For that matter, the schools here resisted integration well into the 1980s to the point where there were even separate textbooks for the inner city (black) schools!
Due to the massive influx of outsiders, I can't say there is much, if any, institutional or private discrimination here now. We have a very large gay and LGBT community in the area, and for the most part no one really seems to care one way or another.
Having been back and forth between Tampa and Indianapolis several times for career changes since then, I will say, and I have commented on it here previously, that I was very disappointed to find a fair amount of discrimination in recent years. HOWEVER, and I want to make it very clear that I am NOT painting with a broad brush and emphasize that this seemed to be limited to rural areas and people with minimal education. It was not evident in the general populace in the metro area from my experience.
My point being that unless you interact with these areas and/or people as described, you probably won't see anything.
I did notice some instances of intolerance but they were few and far between, and nothing I wouldn't have expected to see anywhere else for the most part, as there will always be people around who are intolerant for whatever reason.
In a nutshell, don't worry about it. It's not a significant issue.
The city of Indianapolis is solidly blue (but not far left like Seattle/SF) and people are generally understanding and accepting of LGBT, minorities, what have you. It's also pretty common to see "Fire Pence" signs in the urban core.
The more affluent suburbs are more of a "country club Republican" flavor than the Ted Cruz wing of the party. Had he stayed in, I'd say Rubio would have won most of the suburban counties. I wouldn't necessarily say most suburban residents are socially liberal, but they're tolerant.
I went to the same upscale bar most Sundays with the same clientele - mostly a set of white guys in their 50s/60s in Carmel. These guys were pretty open in their dislike for blacks, Obama, the city of Indianapolis, etc. They were all pretty affluent, but the fact that they were so open with these views among people they didn't know that well makes me think they didn't get much pushback on those views.
Granted, this is one establishment, but I can't help thinking there are a lot of folks in suburban Indianapolis with that fairly common background who hold these views privately.
Based on my experience from growing up there, leaving, then coming back, I would say this is a pretty fair assessment.
I suspect there are definitely those who hold their views back as you described. This is far less prevalent when you get outside the area, however. A lot of the smaller towns and rural areas have plenty of people who aren't shy about their attitudes or expressing their intolerance.
At least that's what I found working in and around these areas, as well as having employees with similar demographics. When Obama won his first term, racist remarks/jokes were the subject of the day for some time after. It was pretty scary.
Indianapolis isn't very solidly blue. It leans Blue but Republicans can win if they A aren't extremists, and B actually try to win and are funded.
Mitch Daniels 2008 with 56% of the vote, former Mayor Greg Ballard 2007 51% of the vote and 2011 with 52%. Democrats have a bare 1 seat majority due to 2 weak Republicans that lost. (Ben Hunter and Robert Lutz)
Ballard seemed to be a pretty good mayor and a moderate Republican. I have rarely, if ever, seen Republican leaning signs anywhere in the city, but fire Pence signs are everywhere.
As I recall, polls repeatedly showed the general public in Indiana was against the same-sex marriage ban amendment to the state constitution that the government tried to push through, though it wasn't by that much. The so-called religious freedom law that was passed, though, had a large majority that was against it in every poll I saw but it still got passed. After the national outcry it was finally watered down which made it a bit better. There is still debate to try to add LGBT as a protected class in Indiana. And there was talk last year of a similar "bathroom" law that North Carolina passed but fortunately that has gotten nowhere, so far.
I feel the bigger cities are more excepting. Indianapolis, Fort Wayne, Bloomington, Evansville, etc. They all have city protections for LGBT. Even Carmel does and mayors of both Carmel and Fishers opposed the religious freedom law, despite both cities being very strong Republican strongholds. And as the previous poster said, Mike Pence was really struggling in his re-election campaign here. I've actually heard some people who were thinking about voting for Trump say he lost their vote by choosing Pence as his running mate. I've read some believe that current Republican nominee for governor Eric Holcomb is just another Mike Pence, though. I do remember going to see a show of Steve Martin and Martin Short at the Murat in downtown Indy last year. The guys were talking about famous people they had met while in Indiana. They mentioned Mike Pence and the whole place erupted in boos. I think even they were a little taken aback at how disliked he is around here.
Please keep in mind that, just because someone does not support gay marriage or does support RFRA, it does not mean they are homophobic or anti-LGBT. I, for one, do not support gay marriage but am not homophobic nor do I have any hatred towards the LGBT community at large.
That said, if a gay person (knowing nothing else about me besides me besides my opposition to gay marriage) calls me a homophobe/bigot or what have you, then I may not have a favorable opinion of said person but it's b/c said person is a prick not b/c said person is gay.
That's like pro-choice people being accused of opposing life or childbirth just b/c they're pro choice.
Please keep in mind that, just because someone does not support gay marriage or does support RFRA, it does not mean they are homophobic or anti-LGBT. I, for one, do not support gay marriage but am not homophobic nor do I have any hatred towards the LGBT community at large.
That said, if a gay person (knowing nothing else about me besides me besides my opposition to gay marriage) calls me a homophobe/bigot or what have you, then I may not have a favorable opinion of said person but it's b/c said person is a prick not b/c said person is gay.
That's like pro-choice people being accused of opposing life or childbirth just b/c they're pro choice.
Thank you for your candor and your professional decorum. I'm gay, but I maintain favorable friendships with people who opposed same-sex marriage on religious grounds. These people were raised to believe that, spiritually, marriage should be a sacred ceremony between one man and one woman. While I'm inclined to disagree, since I never see Christians protesting at Atheist opposite-sex weddings (as they should be if marriage is truly reserved as a "Christian" institution, but I digress) I can be mature enough to look past that divergent viewpoint and find other common ground socially.
I live in PA and have for my entire 29 years, sans just under two years spent in Virginia. While people think PA is a "liberal" state it's actually just as socially conservative outside of Philadelphia and Pittsburgh as IN is outside of places like Indianapolis and Bloomington. PA just pulls to the left more than IN because our cities are bigger. I faced bullying growing up in the suburbs of Scranton, PA for being a gay male, and I'm a more masculine gay male, at that. I cringe to think of the bullying my more effeminate gay male counterparts faced growing up in that area. I never understood why heterosexual adolescent males didn't like homosexual adolescent males since the latter obviously helped the former via freeing up more girls for them to choose from, but I digress again.
To the OP, I'd encourage you to move to Indianapolis with an open mind. The VAST MAJORITY of the country is tolerant of the LGBT community now, albeit maybe only ~55% are "accepting" of us. The small minority (maybe 10%) who is uber-homophobic wouldn't risk berating a gay or lesbian couple at a restaurant and throwing a Bible at them or anything for fear that people would film the encounter, and it would go viral on social media, resulting in humiliation, employment termination, etc.
I will say as a Pennsylvanian that it took us a while to "repent" nationally for delivering Rick Santorum (women don't belong outside the home), so it will take Indiana a while, too, to receive national forgiveness for Mike Pence. It will take even longer if he happens to become the vice president for eight years and opts to intertwine his anti-LGBT beliefs with stories of his fondness for his native Indiana. I will say that as a prospective entrepreneur Indianapolis would be near the bottom of my picks for opening my business right now because while many people may have wanted to "fire Pence" that didn't stop a majority of people for voting for that clown, and a majority of Hoosiers voting for Trump is just a continued endorsement of Pence by Hoosiers in my mind.
In any event I think that while our nation at-large is more polarized than ever, the most vocal on either side is being noticeably silent this election. Pittsburgh is almost right up there with Seattle or San Francisco in terms of social liberalness; however, finding a Clinton/Kaine or "I'm With Her" bumper sticker or yard sign here is still like trying to find a needle in a haystack, which indicates many Democrats are ashamed of supporting Hillary Clinton, just as the lack of Trump signs I see in our suburban and rural areas around Pittsburgh tells me many Republicans are ashamed of supporting Donald Trump. We may finally be reaching a tipping point in this country where people watched how comical the most recent debate was (for BOTH sides) and realize we need to reign in the far-right and far-left special interests to return our country to normalcy and heal our fissures.
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