Possible Move to Jacksonville - Pros and Cons PLEASE :) (Miami: rental car, rental)

[SaintCabbage]

Originally Posted by fsu813

Schools in St. Johns County are so highly rated because they lack the socioeconomic diversity typical of larger cities. Not because they found the magic teaching formula.

Wow, is that a loaded statement... how many misplaced inferences and hidden meanings can we get out of that one?

[Robyn55]

Originally Posted by sheree202

We actually do have a 5 year old - so I am very concerned with school districts. It's what led me to look into the St. Johns county. I understand the benefit of renting for a year. Since we're not getting any younger (35 and 44) we feel a little rushed to purchase our first house. We also know that interest rates will soon be rising. It's definitely something to think about though.

I don't think interest rates are going to go up a whole lot in a big hurry. Nor should age be a consideration in terms of rushing things. Heck - at age 44 - one age consideration might be what you're going to want to do when your child is ready to go to college in about 10 years and you'll be closer to empty nest/retirement age than "people with young children" age. That kind of assumes you're not planning to have more kids over the years (but I don't know your life plans - and they may not be set in stone yet on your end).

There are lots of possible scenarios. But - if you only plan on having one child - you may be better off living "closer to town" - possibly in Duval County. Perhaps exploring magnet schools in Duval County with private schools as a fall-back position.

Keep in mind that fsu813's statement about lack of socio-economic diversity (although written in PC code) is pretty true. And - since the 210 corridor area is still pretty much a "work in progress" - no one knows what it will be like when it's finished. In terms of the housing mix - where schools will be located - possible congestion as a result of overbuilding - who knows? Also - in terms of Nocatee - I don't think it will be 100% built out in 10 years. So - if you plan to buy in that area now for only the period of time when your child is in school - and sell when your child goes to college - you may wind up in competition with builders when you try to sell.

Another consideration in terms of Florida real estate is the potential resiliency of particular areas when we get our next real estate bust. Bboom/bust real estate cycles are just part of the landscape here. Like tropical storms - it's a question of "when" and "how bad" - not if. This most recent one was the third big one we've been through.

There are lots of things to consider. But - most important - it's really hard to get a feel for this area in a few quick trips. It's too big. We spent weeks exploring different parts of town while we were renting. We ruled out some pretty fast - but it took us a lot longer to make a final decision that seemed the best for us. Even then - there were many changes we didn't anticipate. Like more traffic . The growth of the Mayo Clinic . The Town Center (which didn't exist when we moved here) . All the false starts in terms of downtown revitalization . The Jaguars' lousy performances . We liked some of the changes - and disliked others. And hope that the things we dislike will change in the future.

Also - when one looks at a new area that is a "work in progress" - you have to have a vision of what it might be like 10-20+ years down the road. When it comes to the 210 corridor - I think at best it will wind up looking like western Broward and Palm Beach Counties. Not everyone's cup of tea. Robyn

[fsu813]

Originally Posted by SaintCabbage

Wow, is that a loaded statement... how many misplaced inferences and hidden meanings can we get out of that one?

Zero.


Socioeconomic diversity is how one measures the variety of people, lifetsyles, and values in an area.

Thus, the more different kinds of people, lifestyles, and values in an area, the more variety you'll see in standardized testing scores and graduation rates, which are the 2 criteria used on rating schools & counties.

Typically an A school is the same as a C school, just with different students. Thus, a C school can educate perfectly well for a child and family that values education and prioritizes it. As seen by the hundreds of college scholarships and great students at C rated high schools every year. But, that school also has children that or families that don't prioritze education, and flunk out.

In summary, the A student and F student average out to a C, thus the rating.

Currently, the vast majority moving to north St. Johns County share the same lifestyle, ethnicity, and rough income level. So do their kids. And, they prioritize education.

Thus the high rating.

If, for example, 100 new families that prioritize education enrolled their kids at a C rated school, that rating would sky rocket the next year.

It's typically not the school that makes a rating high or low, it's the make up of the student body.

[sheree202]

fsu813, that's an interesting statement that you made. We are a mixed race family and in the Washington DC area it tends to be something that we don't think about. I've always hoped that education brings acceptance, but I also love the idea of my son being exposed to many different types of people.

[Robyn55]

In terms of mixed race - in my HOA - it is not a big deal (or any deal at all). Because the income levels are pretty high.

In general - here in the south - the lower you go in terms of income - the more likely you are to encounter racism (except perhaps in the most liberal areas - of which there aren't many).

If I had to guess - my HOA (with about 1000 houses) has about 3-4% black/mixed raced families. Some professional athletes - doctors - lawyers - etc. And I guess mostly on the basis of the kids who show up at my door at Halloween (I live on the biggest Halloween block in my HOA and see tons of kids and their parents every year). I can always tell who the football players are - they're huge . I'm 5'0" - 125 pounds and 66. No one would ever confuse me with an NFL player! Robyn

[sheree202]

Robyn, great info, do you think the same would be said for neighborhoods in the $300k price range down south? I've also noticed up north there are more race issues in the lower income levels.

[StreetSmarts]

Originally Posted by MiamiRob

Prepare yourself for random Suburban bland bored "ism" full of strip malls and the great cultural experience called "Monster truck "rallies"!

Yer damn right!

[StreetSmarts]

Originally Posted by Robyn55

In terms of mixed race - in my HOA - it is not a big deal (or any deal at all). Because the income levels are pretty high.

In general - here in the south - the lower you go in terms of income - the more likely you are to encounter racism (except perhaps in the most liberal areas - of which there aren't many).

If I had to guess - my HOA (with about 1000 houses) has about 3-4% black/mixed raced families. Some professional athletes - doctors - lawyers - etc. And I guess mostly on the basis of the kids who show up at my door at Halloween (I live on the biggest Halloween block in my HOA and see tons of kids and their parents every year). I can always tell who the football players are - they're huge . I'm 5'0" - 125 pounds and 66. No one would ever confuse me with an NFL player! Robyn

You live in a massive subdivision with 1000+ houses (sounds like a huge subdivison very typical of FL) and you have professional athletes in your neighborhood? Not being rude, I'm just kind of shocked. I wouldn't expect that in my area, which is kind of what you are describing. Again, n0t being rude, just think it's a little odd.

[Robyn55]

Originally Posted by ComSense

You live in a massive subdivision with 1000+ houses (sounds like a huge subdivison very typical of FL) and you have professional athletes in your neighborhood? Not being rude, I'm just kind of shocked. I wouldn't expect that in my area, which is kind of what you are describing. Again, n0t being rude, just think it's a little odd.

No problem. This is my HOA:

Marsh Landing Master Association. A residential community in Ponte Vedra Beach, Florida

The houses range from medium (like 3000 sf) to huge (like 10000+ sf). Lot sizes range from perhaps 1/4 acre to 5 acres. Price range is low $400s to over $4 million. There's a golf course/country club - some waterfront lots (on or adjacent to the ICW). It's a gated community - so private. The professional athletes are mostly Jacksonville Jaguars and golfers.

FWIW - this is probably the most famous "professional athlete" HOA in Florida:

- Isleworth Golf & Country Club : Official Website

Makes our HOA look like a dump . Robyn

[Robyn55]

Originally Posted by sheree202

Robyn, great info, do you think the same would be said for neighborhoods in the $300k price range down south? I've also noticed up north there are more race issues in the lower income levels.

It's obviously impossible for me to say. In part because the 210 area in SJC is still - like I've said - a work in progress. Hard to know what it will be like when it's finished. However - just some thoughts off the top of my head.

First - make no mistake about it. Parts of St. Johns County are definitely "white flight" areas. Both for people who already live in the general area - and people moving in from out of town. Parents don't want their kids to go to public schools that have more than a small black/Hispanic presence. Which is why praise is heaped only on certain schools in SJC (I don't see much cheerleading for the few schools in SJC that are more diverse both racially and economically - and yes - we have them).

Now I'm sure no white parents will admit to this. That they're picking particular parts of SJC so their kids don't have to go to school with black kids in Duval County. But - it's kind of obvious to anyone who's lived here for a while. I don't hear anyone touting Pedro Menendez High School (it's 15% black/Hispanic - which is "diverse" by SJC standards). OTOH - I'm sure everyone will be very polite to you (you're not going to wind up with a cross burning on your lawn - which could happen in certain rednecky parts of Florida).

But there's another factor. I would think that if I were X (fill in the blank) - I'd want to go to school with at least some people like me. Where I wasn't the only one. How does your child feel about this? That's an important thing for you to consider.

FWIW - schools like Bolles (private) and Stanton (magnet) in Duval County are both excellent and more diverse than what you'll find in the 210 corridor in SJC. Also - high schools in SJC tend to be more diverse than elementary and middle schools because they're bigger and draw from wider geographical areas than elementary and middle schools.

Anyway - this is perhaps another reason to rent and give the area a "test drive". Robyn