Bartram subdivisions? (Southchase: bank owned, for sale, apartments)

[The Sandman]

I started a thread a few weeks ago trying to figure out what part of Jax I should move to this summer. You can go to the that thread here.
I've decided to look for homes on the Southside and Mandarin. I've noticed tons of homes for sale in the Bartram subdivisions. I like the location and the homes that I've looked at look like what I'm looking for. But the abundance of homes for sale makes me skeptical. My concern is that with so many sales and short sales in the neighborhoods, their may be a lack of "owner pride" in the neighborhood. If there is anyone that knows any of the below neighborhoods, I'd love to hear about them. What's their current condition? Are the empty homes well kept? I'm interested in any comments you have about the Bartram subdivisions.

Some of the neighborhoods I've looked at...

Bartram Springs
Sumerlin at Bartram
Bartram Park
Stonefield at Bartram Park
Verano at Bartram Park

[FLPL75]

The following applies not only to this neighborhood but to any you will be looking at.

You are going to want to do your research with your Realtor. What are the prices now compared to what they were when they were built 3 or 4 years ago. This could explain the number of short sales, which if not sold could become Foreclosures.
The housing market peaked around the spring of 2006 with values coming down since. Many home buyers took advantage of the interest only adjustable rate mortgages. Many of these started "resetting" 2008.
Combine the lower value of the home with minimal down payments many folks have found themselves "upside down" and not been able to refinance. Also in the past 9 months there have been many layoffs. Faced with mortgage payments that have in some cases significantly increased or incomes that have been lost or reduced folks have turned to looking into trying to sell the property for less than they owe. The short sale.

What some folks may not realize is in order for the Mortgage company to "approve" a home being put up for short sale a short sale the mortgage 99 % of the time is in arrears. Buying a short sale can also take quite a bit longer than a non short sale home.
So the concern would be, if there isn't money to make the now increased mortgage payment or the loss of income to make the mortgage payment, there probably isn't money for general upkeep and repairs. You are going to want a very thorough home inspection on a short sale or bank owned property.

Also check to see what the annual HOA & CDD fees are. I though I read that at B.S. the HOA is close to $1400 a year with CDD fees around $500 this averages around $160 a month, in a lower HOA fee neighborhood this amount would get you $10k to $15k more house.

[stevebxl]

Bartram Park is a nice new area. As an EX-realtor I would recommend that you rent for the next year or two and watch waht happens to home values. They are still on their way down. That's why so many short sales!

Tired of the rat race - so I retired

[EricBoyd]

Sandman,

I have several listings in the Bartram Springs area, so I can say it definitely is a popular area for people. What Karla said is very true regarding the state of the market in this area. Many of those selling homes in that neighborhood were speculative buyers, with hopes of making a quick buck in a few years. Well, they failed, and now they're paying the price, in addition to their neighbors. I keep tabs on that neighborhood, just to see what's happening, and the amount of inventory is going down. Either the banks are finally getting to responding to the short sale requests, or they are moving fast on selling the foreclosures. I know they're pricing the REO properties VERY competitvely, too. I believe things in "that" neighborhood are gonna hold up fine.

You'll have to judge for yourself whether you find value in the extra cost (CDD) of the amenities these communities offer. If you would normally pay for a gym membership and swimming pool, then you may find value in what is offered. It's also a saleability thing, too, because others will want those amenities when they are looking to buy for themselves. Also, you may have seen the elementary school being built in there, too. That will attract buyers, as well. I don't think you can go wrong with Bartram Springs.

[The Sandman]

Originally Posted by EricBoyd

Sandman,

I have several listings in the Bartram Springs area, so I can say it definitely is a popular area for people. What Karla said is very true regarding the state of the market in this area. Many of those selling homes in that neighborhood were speculative buyers, with hopes of making a quick buck in a few years. Well, they failed, and now they're paying the price, in addition to their neighbors. I keep tabs on that neighborhood, just to see what's happening, and the amount of inventory is going down. Either the banks are finally getting to responding to the short sale requests, or they are moving fast on selling the foreclosures. I know they're pricing the REO properties VERY competitvely, too. I believe things in "that" neighborhood are gonna hold up fine.

You'll have to judge for yourself whether you find value in the extra cost (CDD) of the amenities these communities offer. If you would normally pay for a gym membership and swimming pool, then you may find value in what is offered. It's also a saleability thing, too, because others will want those amenities when they are looking to buy for themselves. Also, you may have seen the elementary school being built in there, too. That will attract buyers, as well. I don't think you can go wrong with Bartram Springs.

Thanks, I appreciate the information. So is Bartram Springs the only one of the subdivisions that you'd recommend? I want to narrow down my potential homes to about 10 or so within the next few weeks. I'm flying down to Jax in the end of March to meet with my realtor to take a look at these homes. Thanks again for the info.

[EricBoyd]

Well, of the ones listed in your original post, only Bartram Springs has both SF-detached and SF-attached properties. From what I know about the builders in all of the communities, the ones along Bartram Parkway (not Bartram Springs) rate higher than the builders in B.S. The Bartram Parkway builders are Beazer and Pulte. In B.S., you have Ryland and KB Home building the townhouses, and Ryland, Mattamy, and Taylor-Morrison building the SF-detached homes. (I'm not suggesting that the latter 3 aren't good builders, though.)

For the "community" aspect, I do know that B.S. seems to have a more active HOA and puts on events for residents. I can't say with certainty whether the Bartram Park communities are doing that, though. When you come down, do your best to talk to the neighbors you happen to meet and ask their opinion of things.

[mkgolfer]

Hi,
Bartram Springs is a great neighborhood....just ALOT of homes!! And it is one of the nicest community ammenities with pool, tennis, kids playground, etc. Some of my clients LOVE It because of so many kids in the neighborhood, and some don't like the feel of it. The CDD and HOA fees combined are around $1,600-1,800 a year.
The other communities you asked about are Condo and townhomes on bartram Park blvd. There are MANY condos on the market here in JAX.
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MKGOlfer

[Florabama]

My opinion is many of these "developments" are the reason we are in the shape we are in.

Cookie cutter homes, large but still most of the plans are similar with little variety, builders who were lenders as well, arms, intrest only, ballons, houses built to quick with little supervision.

Many of the "national" builders are in big trouble. Any development with empty lots could go either way, hold value when the next builder comes in or transform to a cheaper product hurting the existing homes values even more. It happened in the early 90's.

I think you are better of in an older neighborhood. Where what you see is what you get.

Either way good luck

[The Sandman]

Originally Posted by Florabama

My opinion is many of these "developments" are the reason we are in the shape we are in.

Cookie cutter homes, large but still most of the plans are similar with little variety, builders who were lenders as well, arms, intrest only, ballons, houses built to quick with little supervision.

Many of the "national" builders are in big trouble. Any development with empty lots could go either way, hold value when the next builder comes in or transform to a cheaper product hurting the existing homes values even more. It happened in the early 90's.

I think you are better of in an older neighborhood. Where what you see is what you get.

Either way good luck

Thanks everyone for your input. I think I'm starting to shy away from the Bartram areas. I'm starting to look at a few other neighborhoods without the CDD fees. I just don't think my girlfriend and I will benefit much from them. I understand that there are people that like the benefits of them and that this may limit my potential renters in the future, but I figure it's not likely I would be able to include those fees in the rental price anyway, if I want to keep the rental price comparable to area apartments.

I'm seriously considering homes in the Greenland Chase, Grand Lakes, Ironwood, and Southchase neighborhoods.

[EricBoyd]

Originally Posted by The Sandman

I'm seriously considering homes in the Greenland Chase, Grand Lakes, Ironwood, and Southchase neighborhoods.

I actually live in Grand Lakes and we're trying to sell our house.