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I'm not sure what difference it makes that your neighbor who voiced this complaint went to one of the 'premier high schools' in the country with a great college placement rate. I went to a very well-respected university consistently ranked in the top tier of all rankings -- I certainly don't think that qualifies me as an expert an all subjects -- I wasn't trained as a teacher, am NOT a teacher and am pretty certain that it's a lot harder than it looks.
Also, even as adults let's be realistic that we've all worked in jobs where we've been rewarded for a job well done -- whether it be thru bonuses, maybe a staff lunch paid for by the bosses, an extra vacation day etc. It's just human nature, good psychology and good management to reward people when they've done a good job. I've personally never had a problem with my kids having pizza or ice cream parties (of course, some will frown on the nutritional aspects of this), pajama days etc.
Everyone is so quick to criticize.....maybe we should ask questions first, get the facts and also remember that we're not all experts on all subjects -- sometimes there are people who truly do know more than we do!
I'm not sure what difference it makes that your neighbor who voiced this complaint went to one of the 'premier high schools' in the country with a great college placement rate. I went to a very well-respected university consistently ranked in the top tier of all rankings -- I certainly don't think that qualifies me as an expert an all subjects -- I wasn't trained as a teacher, am NOT a teacher and am pretty certain that it's a lot harder than it looks.
Also, even as adults let's be realistic that we've all worked in jobs where we've been rewarded for a job well done -- whether it be thru bonuses, maybe a staff lunch paid for by the bosses, an extra vacation day etc. It's just human nature, good psychology and good management to reward people when they've done a good job. I've personally never had a problem with my kids having pizza or ice cream parties (of course, some will frown on the nutritional aspects of this), pajama days etc.
Everyone is so quick to criticize.....maybe we should ask questions first, get the facts and also remember that we're not all experts on all subjects -- sometimes there are people who truly do know more than we do!
My post made pretty clear that it was a response to my neighbor being called a "moron."
Me thinks the OP is just playing cuckoo and wants to argue.
The merit is that in 2010, film is as valid a form of artistic expression as literature and music. Is it ok to listen to Beethoven in class? Is it Ok to study Micehangelo? Everything is not about math and science. Is it ok to read Aesop's fables (quite violent by the way)? In the 20th century, Cinderella is a classic tale. Sometimes seeing the movie is a catalyst to reading the book and learning how much different (and usually better) the book can be. Either way, there are pertinent themes in the movie that can be discussed amongst the class. You keep slighting it as just a "cartoon" as a way of bolstering your argument. Many would argue Cinderella is a classic piece of American cinema and a cornerstone of feature animation. Honestly, I am as OK with my kid getting a chance to see that as much as any other school endeavor. I'd rather a well rounded kid who can learn to think critically than one forced to learn rote information for a standardized test all day long. Plus, a movie is fun and engaging. Something we can all use in the workplace from time to time.
I mentioned seeing cartoons in school in the 70's. Another poster mentioned Duck Soup. Those experiences changed my life. For one, it allowed us to like school for a few moments. For another, we learned great vocabulary (anyone my age who says they didn't learn the words "despicable" or "magnanimous" from Daffy Duck is probably lying)! Seeing the Marx Brothers opened up a whole world of comedy and history. Much more than "just a movie." It created an APPRECIATION for things and a yearning to make similar and greater discoveries.
We get your indignation. You're entitled to it. You're argument seems to bounce from the teacher not doing her job to the benefits of seeing a movie in school as a general problem depending on the responses. I disagree on both points. It's a non-issue. It's also hearsay. It's also petty and annoying. I hope the teacher can defend herself from the knee-jerk alarmist parents who are going to raise a stink.
Yes, I do argue. No, I don't attach negative connotations to argument. I do attach negative connotations to verbal aggression, however (e.g., "cuckoo").
Still, yours is a pretty good argument. If the teacher were showing Duck Soup to 3rd graders, I'd be ecstatic - provided there was an accompanying lesson attached. Cinderella, I'm much more skeptical about because kids see this film on their own. They don't need a teacher for it. Moreover, the neighbor learned that the film was shown as a reward, not as a lesson.
My wife used to teach elementary and middle school. She is national board certified and was well-respected when she taught. She knows of no pedagogical method that has kids watching Disney films in class. She doesn't believe in "teaching to the test," nor do I. That's a non sequitur.
My wife also knows teachers who put movies on, and they did it regularly. She tried to report them, but the unions didn't allow the administration to address it unless parents griped. The Florida system forced teachers to sign agreements NOT to express school-related issues outside of the schools, so it wasn't like my wife was going to go public. And, for your information, the movies were shown so the teachers COULD text, grade, snack, and chat in the hallway.
I don't doubt that there are people who have more expertise than I do, but I also don't believe that possessing a degree precludes a person from criticism. This doesn't pass the sniff test. This was not an instance of good instruction.
Yes, I do argue. No, I don't attach negative connotations to argument. I do attach negative connotations to verbal aggression, however (e.g., "cuckoo").
Still, yours is a pretty good argument. If the teacher were showing Duck Soup to 3rd graders, I'd be ecstatic - provided there was an accompanying lesson attached. Cinderella, I'm much more skeptical about because kids see this film on their own. They don't need a teacher for it. Moreover, the neighbor learned that the film was shown as a reward, not as a lesson.
My wife used to teach elementary and middle school. She is national board certified and was well-respected when she taught. She knows of no pedagogical method that has kids watching Disney films in class. She doesn't believe in "teaching to the test," nor do I. That's a non sequitur.
My wife also knows teachers who put movies on, and they did it regularly. She tried to report them, but the unions didn't allow the administration to address it unless parents griped. The Florida system forced teachers to sign agreements NOT to express school-related issues outside of the schools, so it wasn't like my wife was going to go public. And, for your information, the movies were shown so the teachers COULD text, grade, snack, and chat in the hallway.
I don't doubt that there are people who have more expertise than I do, but I also don't believe that possessing a degree precludes a person from criticism. This doesn't pass the sniff test. This was not an instance of good instruction.
Whatever, it was hearsay so your last point is a tough (judgement call). The rest of your points are fair and valid. It's a matter of motive and actual intent. If she did it to free up time, that's not reasonable. If she did it as a reward, I think that's ok but maybe not the best reason. If it was a reward AND part of a lesson plan, I'm fine with that. I do have a little trouble when you say "possessing a degree doesn't preclude a person from criticism" but yet you repeatedly cite that there is "no pedagogical method" for watching the film. That is sort of contradictory. I am more cynical and non-conforming. I don't whole-heartedly trust the "degree" OR the "pedagogical method!"
As for "cuckoo," that's about as G-rated as I get. I'm proud to be cuckoo. Think you are taking yourself waayyy too seriously if that is "verbal aggression" in your book. However, we all all have our own level of sensitivity so if that bugged you, I respect that and offer apologies.
I heard today that Dickinson Avenue School 3rd graders are watching Disney films in class. They get to watch movies for being good. They get to watch movies to help celebrate holidays.
Evidently, doing what you aren't supposed to like (learning) is rewarded with what you are expected to like (sitting slack-jawed, watching cartoons). This tells me a lot about the teacher's approach to and attitude about learning.
I'll remember this next time I vote for a school budget proposal. This teacher is likely paid about $80k, and is no more creative than a reel-changer at the Odeon 6.
And keep in mind when I say this, I'm no tea sipper. I don't drink Kool-Aid either.
I do not have enough infomation to say whether this is "bad" or not. If it happens only once in awhile, I do not see this as being a problem. If every Tuesday and Thursday afternoon are "cartoon time" rewards for good behavior I see a hole in the curriculum that needs addressing.
My son does not attend public school. He does attend parochial school. There isn't a television in the facility. On Fridays the kids get rewarded. It's called "Free Friday." On Friday they get to play science, chess, or music.
I have no problem with continuing to pay for the state schools while paying my last few shekels for my son's education. I do think there is a problem with separating people like me, who care about the performance of schools, out of the management of my community's schools. You don't care if teachers show kids cartoons. I think it's comically nuts that both not care, and be willing to pay that much for such a service. Maybe I should join the PTA.
If you hired someone to cut your lawn, would you mind if they took an hour out to watch TV? I sure as hell would. What if they were responsible for your kids and not your lawn?
Looks like there is a pretty major gaping hole in the curriculum at that school if every Friday is "free."
I never argued that teachers shouldn't be paid well. I'm known in this forum for backing teacher pay, and raises - for the most part. I've been accused of having a closet teacher for a spouse, and even being a teacher myself! (Gasp!). The reason we moved to Long Island was because of the quality of the schools. I'm happy with the quality of the schools, relatively.
I have listed problems here with police, also. I explained that drug dealers were operating across the street from my house and I named the Sargeant who never did anything about it. I've explained to others how to have these problems addressed.
I don't think the only way to address a problem is to go to the teacher. My neighbor went to the teacher. She's going to the principal. She recently attended the PTA meeting. But I also believe in journalists being watch-dogs. I merely questioned the pedagogical soundness of showing 90 minute cartoons in class. I argued that situating TV as a reward for good work suggests that good word isn't the norm, that learning isn't fun and engaging, and reinforces the idea that kids want to watch television. I think it is a harmful, and I have no problem making the specific school responsible for allowing it in this quasi-journalistic forum.
I say, remove this teacher and bring someone else in and pay him/her more.
Bolded #1: Why ***gasp***? The only reason anyone has said either of these things is because you, yourself, posted it on here first. For example:
Quote:
I'm as liberal as they come, and I have a wife who is a public school teacher. Still, I think that teacher salaries should be linked to the median salary in the district, or some other calculus that doesn't presuppose that incomes are increasing at 6% annually.
I'm also a bleeding heart union advocate, but I think that the teacher's union is making a mistake by pushing for their typical increases when the economy is in the crapper.
I would have rented into subsidized housing when I arrived on Long Island. I'm a professor at a Long Island university. I would have been the "free loader." Most universities in expensive locations MUST provide subsidized housing to their lazy free loading professors, or else the professors wouldn't be able to afford to live there. Certainly, we aren't the kinds of people you'd want in your neighborhood. We'd get all book-readin' at you!
Bolded #2: I do not understand this comment. Why did you move to LI because of the quality of the public schools, yet instead choose to pay tuition to send your child to Montessori and then parochial school? Sorry it doesn't make any sense. Very confusing.
I do not have enough infomation to say whether this is "bad" or not. If it happens only once in awhile, I do not see this as being a problem. If every Tuesday and Thursday afternoon are "cartoon time" rewards for good behavior I see a hole in the curriculum that needs addressing.
Thanks for weighing in to say that you have nothing to say.
Bolded #2: I do not understand this comment. Why did you move to LI because of the quality of the public schools, yet instead choose to pay tuition to send your child to Montessori and then parochial school? Sorry it doesn't make any sense. Very confusing.
1) I also posted that she never received a full-time position and that she is back at school earning a new degree.
2) Do you suspect that there are advantages to be gained from having good public schools besides the direct benefit of sending your child to those schools? Beyond that, I won't patronize you by responding.
Looks like there is a pretty major gaping hole in the curriculum at that school if every Friday is "free."
Do you honestly suspect that this meant that the kids are left to run wild? Overall, I appreciate the effort to be snarky. Still, the execution isn't that good.
Besides, I'd rather a group of kids be allowed to run and play than sit and watch TV.
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