Los Angeles finally about to crack down on homeless camps (association, kids)

[AmorphicDN]

Originally Posted by MordinSolus

I pay taxes to maintain the city. I am not society, I am a member of it. And so are the homeless, but they're a burden on society. Society is always failing someone. Some people always fall through the cracks. It's not my responsibility to clean up after bums or keep dangerous people off the streets.

Fine. Then you will endure them.

Each individual's responsibility in our society goes beyond paying taxes. Our system is a republic in which the people enact, energize and engage the machinery. If you don't like the homeless on the streets, as I certainly don't, you have two options. You can complain and condemn endlessly with others who do nothing but flap their lips on forums and barstools. Or you can support solutions to get them off the street. Which are you doing here?

[MordinSolus]

What are you doing so save these poor victims of society? Just complaining online about people who have a problem with them?

[AmorphicDN]

Originally Posted by MordinSolus

What are you doing so save these poor victims of society? Just complaining online about people who have a problem with them?

First, you'll note I never complained about the homeless being on the streets.

Second, I would support the Housing First approach to removing them from the streets. After all, it would both relieve the problem there for all, plus it would save us a lot of money.

Third, I contribute to the solution by voicing solution rather than engage in obsessive obloquy thatonly serves to vilify sick and helpless individuals.

I have also never referred to them as victims of society.

[MordinSolus]

Originally Posted by AmorphicDN

First, you'll note I never complained about the homeless being on the streets.

So you're fine with them languishing on the streets?

Second, I would support the Housing First approach to removing them from the streets. After all, it would both relieve the problem there for all, plus it would save us a lot of money.

That only helps the ones who want to be housed and the ones who can behave themselves in the housing. It's also not a permanent solution since more and more people are becoming homeless all the time, meaning more and more housing will have to be built to accommodate them. The housing could be tied to certain requirements that can lead to getting the homeless back in the workforce and providing for themselves, but the bleeding hearts don't think the homeless should do anything but live in free apartments and go to food banks.

Third, I contribute to the solution by voicing solution rather than engage in obsessive obloquy thatonly serves to vilify sick and helpless individuals.

You're contributing to the solution by posting on this forum? You already said that posting about the homeless here is pointless.

I have also never referred to them as victims of society.

You said that the reason these people are on the streets is society failing them.

[AmorphicDN]

Originally Posted by MordinSolus

So you're fine with them languishing on the streets?



That only helps the ones who want to be housed and the ones who can behave themselves in the housing. It's also not a permanent solution since more and more people are becoming homeless all the time, meaning more and more housing will have to be built to accommodate them. The housing could be tied to certain requirements that can lead to getting the homeless back in the workforce and providing for themselves, but the bleeding hearts don't think the homeless should do anything but live in free apartments and go to food banks.



You're contributing to the solution by posting on this forum? You already said that posting about the homeless here is pointless.



You said that the reason these people are on the streets is society failing them.

Never said I was "fine with them languishing on the streets". Quote me otherwise. Simply said I wasn't the one complaining here.

Not sure anything in life is "permanent" as a solution. Other posters in this thread pointed out that there really isn't "A Solution" to homelessness, only management. The best, most cost efficient management today is something along the lines of Housing First. Nothing else has proven to compare.. The best outcome for the greatest number at the lowest cost. No brainer. Tying housing to conditions as you suggest is proven to not work. That's why the program is called "Housing First." Best outcomes follow housing without conditions - other than basic safety for all.

Haven't read any bleeding hearts here. Pretty much just complainers and proponents of practical solutions. Hyperbole doesn't serve the issue.

I did not say posting to a forum is pointless. Quote me otherwise. I did point out that incessant vilification and complaints is destructive as such perpetuates the anti-homeless memes. Expressing support whenever and wherever possible for successful management options can have a positive effect on the public dialogue.

To your final accusation, I did not say the reason the homeless are homeless is because society has failed them. There are many reasons for homelessness. SOme have been failed by quirtks and injustices of society. Many more have made poor choices that came back to bite them. Others have fallen victim to actions of persons in their lives more powerful than them. Others are simply sick or disabled. Many reasons.

What I said is it is society's failure to deal with the problem that we trip over them on the street. Not society's failure they have become homeless.

[Sunflowr]

Rather than turning all these older buildings into ritzy places that only the very well-to-do can afford, gentrifying everything in sight, how about renovating some of these buildings into shelters and providing resources.

Its scary how easy it can be to become homeless and all of a sudden be in that situation.

[MItoBH]

Originally Posted by Sunflowr

Rather than turning all these older buildings into ritzy places that only the very well-to-do can afford, gentrifying everything in sight, how about renovating some of these buildings into shelters and providing resources.

Its scary how easy it can be to become homeless and all of a sudden be in that situation.

I agree with you. But it's the greedy developers who would prefer to raze these buildings and build new fancy condos. There's no financial incentive for developers, or the city's politicians to rehabilitate older hotels and other derelict buildings for the homeless. Also, it'll be a catch-22 - if you build it, they will come, more of these 'undesirable' types. More homeless people who already gravitate to CA because of the weather, will be even more compelled to come to LA/CA because of these homes being developed just for them. The city will be sending out a homing beacon and a welcome sign encouraging those subject to the homeless lifestyle to come to the city of sun and beaches, and, it's nearly free or at little cost to you.

Sigh... the homeless situation is just too big to fix with one idea.

[jm1982]

There are many SRO (Single Room Occupancy) buildings/hotels in downtown L.A
As far as I know these buildings can't be repurposed or redeveloped for fancy housing. There are agencies that own and manage these SRO buildings.

There would be a lot more development/redevelopment in L.A if the city was not so anti-development.

The main reason that developers build luxury housing is because land in L.A is very expensive and they are also restricted in terms of how many units they can build.

Developers also create many jobs by hiring people to work on building these buildings.

Also while nowadays it is likely wealthier or higher income people that are living in that new development, we have seen that over time housing that was once considered luxury becomes more middle class or even lower income housing. Bottom line these developers are adding to the housing supply in a city that has a lack of housing.

I agree with MITOBH that building a bunch of new housing for the homeless would backfire and set downtown's growth backwards.
Nobody wants to say it but a higher concentration of homeless in an area creates more problems for police and others than a high concentration of working people that are focused on working and being responsible citizens.
Even in the words of LAPD :
"Beck also singled out L.A.'s major increase in people living on the streets. He pointed to the stats in LAPD's Central Bureau, which includes Skid Row, downtown and other core neighborhoods. Major crime there is up about 18 percent.

Homelessness, he said, "drives almost all the crime" in the bureau's downtown Central Division."

Turns out the homeless often aren't the peaceful, nice guy or gal down on their luck that many of these homeless advocates would like you to believe.
Crime Is on the Increase in Los Angeles | L.A. Weekly

This also was a big mistake too ..
"Part of that property crime increase, Garcetti said, may be linked to Proposition 47, the ballot measure that downgraded felony drug possession and thefts and resulted in the release of about 3,700 inmates from state prison."

More criminals on the street...surprise turns into more crime!

[2sleepy]

Originally Posted by jm1982

This also was a big mistake too ..
"Part of that property crime increase, Garcetti said, may be linked to Proposition 47, the ballot measure that downgraded felony drug possession and thefts and resulted in the release of about 3,700 inmates from state prison." More criminals on the street...surprise turns into more crime!

Actually, if you do a little research, the reason that prop 47 is failing in LA is because the Police Dept. decided to 'make it fail' by not booking people who commit crimes that are misdemeanors that were formerly felonies. Those offenses are punishable by up to one year in jail and 3 years on probation- not an insignificant penalty. Jurisdictions which are properly managing those offenders are NOT having the same problem as LA with prop 47 recidivism.

[Tulemutt]

Originally Posted by jm1982

Nobody wants to say it but a higher concentration of homeless in an area creates more problems for police and others than a high concentration of working people that are focused on working and being responsible citizens.


Turns out the homeless often aren't the peaceful, nice guy or gal down on their luck that many of these homeless advocates would like you to believe.

More criminals on the street...surprise turns into more crime!

Well, jm, if they were housed, then they wouldn't be "on the street creating more problems" now would they?

And which "homeless advocates" have been telling you the homeless are overwhelmingly "the peaceful, nice guy or gal down on their luck"?

More hyperbolic drivel from you to support the destructive memes of those who have no grasp of the issues of crime and homelessness.