The French Connection: Maine and Canada

[Mad Kent]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Are many Americans getting EDLs to cross the border? Here in Canada they are available but I do not know anyone who has gotten one. Most people who didn't already have a passport went to get one once the requirement to enter the U.S. went into force.

It's difficult for me to tell how many US citizens apply for EDL's since they are are not available in this state but according to an article I have read recently Customs employees working at the Champlain, NY port of entry say their use is rising. This may be because NY and Quebec were the first two administrations to issue the EDL. It is likely that once their current passport expires many people will opt for the EDL instead.

[Mad Kent]

Originally Posted by Acajack

This is especially true if you can speak French, which I assume you guys could. Then you can more or less pass for a local. It is harder to get in when underage in Quebec if you don't speak French and therefore the bouncers assume you are from Ontario or the States.

This was in Degelis, QC and the bouncers knew where we were from because in summertime they would stand outside the door and see the tags on the cars. Because Degelis is located near the spot where NB, QC and ME converge they more or less considered people from all three places as locals. Lots of truckers stopped there as well, it was quite unique.

[Bydand]

Originally Posted by Mad Kent

This was in Degelis, QC and the bouncers knew where we were from because in summertime they would stand outside the door and see the tags on the cars.

Ahhh, good ol' "Mon Copain" I would presume? Not that I would ever set foot in the place but the bouncers there were pretty cool about everything........... so I hear. There was also the ever classy 185 up that direction as well, but that was a long time ago and may have been long gone by the time you were going up across.

Knowing some French helped when you were there, but not to get in the place usually.

To keep the post somewhere even close to being on topic though... Living and working up in that area for decades, it did help to know some French. I never did get the accent right or even pronunciation right for most of it, but could understand a LOT of it and 90% of the people (even the old timers) could understand enough English that between my limited French speaking and their limited English speaking, the communication was decent. It had to look odd to an outsider of the area to see me speaking 85% English and the other person speaking 85% French, but still talking and holding a conversation. One of the guys I worked with sometimes spoke English, but not too fluently. He would switch between English and French in the same sentence (sometimes several switches were made in a sentence) depending on what language had the best word for what he was trying to say. After a bit, I didn't even notice when he would switch. When he got excited though it was 100% French and machine-gun speed, so I had to remind him I couldn't keep up when he was "jabbering." LOL, I haven't thought of that in a long time... good memory of a good person.

[Mad Kent]

Originally Posted by Bydand

Ahhh, good ol' "Mon Copain" I would presume? Not that I would ever set foot in the place

Yeah, sure

I vaguely remember the joints you mention but can't recall if they were still in business around 1979-1980. The one we usually went to was called Monaco, it was near that restaurant that went by the odd and somewhat irrelevant name of "Kiboutz" which had a parking lot for 18-wheelers. There were like 8 strip bars in Degelis which is a lot for a town roughly the size of Fort Kent. But location is everything, Degelis is on a major highway, Fort Kent is definitely not.

[Northern Maine Land Man]

bydand reports:
"He would switch between English and French in the same sentence (sometimes several switches were made in a sentence) depending on what language had the best word for what he was trying to say."

That is called "Valley French" and is spoken all up and down the St. John Valley.

I knew a guide who used to say, "I non speak Francais et I non speak Anglais too either." His friend had a 20 foot canoe. One side was painted barn red. The other side was painted spruce green. He said, "Dey see me go up. Dey see me go doun. Dey don know wedder I comin' or goin'.

[green_mariner]

Originally Posted by Northern Maine Land Man

bydand reports:
"He would switch between English and French in the same sentence (sometimes several switches were made in a sentence) depending on what language had the best word for what he was trying to say."

That is called "Valley French" and is spoken all up and down the St. John Valley.

I knew a guide who used to say, "I non speak Francais et I non speak Anglais too either." His friend had a 20 foot canoe. One side was painted barn red. The other side was painted spruce green. He said, "Dey see me go up. Dey see me go doun. Dey don know wedder I comin' or goin'.

I think about Chiac when I hear this, which is Acadian French mixed with English.

[Mad Kent]

Originally Posted by Bydand

Ahhh, good ol' "Mon Copain" I would presume? Not that I would ever set foot in the place but the bouncers there were pretty cool about everything........... so I hear. There was also the ever classy 185 up that direction as well, but that was a long time ago and may have been long gone by the time you were going up across.

Knowing some French helped when you were there, but not to get in the place usually.

Right, business has no language and in those days in Degelis the scarce police patrols had other priorities than raiding bars for underage drinking. Maybe a bit of explanation about police structure in Qubec would help understand why this was allowed to go on. In Quebec just like in the rest of Canada there is no county structure like here, and only two levels of uniformed police: municipal or metro (in large cities) and provincial (equivalent to State Troopers) in Ontario, Quebec and Newfoundland. The other 7 provinces have no provincial police so there the Mounties (federal police) fill that role. Most towns under 10,000 like Degelis have no local police so they rely on the provincial police but back then the nearest QPP station was 25 miles away and understaffed, with most officers assigned to traffic duty on the heavily travelled Highway 185, so they never bothered bar operators. Things have changed though, I am told there is a QPP station in Degelis now.

To keep the post somewhere even close to being on topic though... Living and working up in that area for decades, it did help to know some French. I never did get the accent right or even pronunciation right for most of it, but could understand a LOT of it and 90% of the people (even the old timers) could understand enough English that between my limited French speaking and their limited English speaking, the communication was decent. It had to look odd to an outsider of the area to see me speaking 85% English and the other person speaking 85% French, but still talking and holding a conversation. One of the guys I worked with sometimes spoke English, but not too fluently. He would switch between English and French in the same sentence (sometimes several switches were made in a sentence) depending on what language had the best word for what he was trying to say. After a bit, I didn't even notice when he would switch. When he got excited though it was 100% French and machine-gun speed, so I had to remind him I couldn't keep up when he was "jabbering." LOL, I haven't thought of that in a long time... good memory of a good person.

Ah apparently those types are becoming a rarity up there now. People raised there are still bilingual but perhaps too much so, in the sense that they have no accent in either language so it's not as colorful even when they speak 'frenglish'. But one thing remains, even young people tend to speak french among themselves, not just older people. But last Fall when I went to Fort Kent as soon as I walked into a store people inside would switch to english because to them someone they don't know cannot possibly be speaking anything but english. In my case they were right