Why doesn’t Springfield downtown have more a happening downtown (Boston: sales, apartments)

[id77]

Originally Posted by Shrewsburried

Demographics are also currently favoring cities.

The oldest millenials are now entering house buying and child making en masse, which is why suburban open houses and city streets are flooded with young families. Obviously some percentage will stay in the city, but only the ones with the capital and desire to do so. What will be more interesting to see is whether demand sustains past this decade ... the working force of this country will be significantly older than it currently is now. There's a massive population chasm between gen Z and Millenial offspring.

IMO, the scale-tippers right now are the Baby Boomer(ang)s. In my house hunting (that's now thankfully over at last), it was the empty-nesters from a Wellesley or Newton cashing out their homes, along with other Gen X'ers like myself, that I was competing against on offers more often on than it was the Millennials. There were a few to be sure, but from what I can see most of the younger crowd is fighting over the rental market more than the purchase market (as it's financially out of reach for 80% of them).

[Boston Shudra]

Originally Posted by Shrewsburried

It can't happen again due to current zoning. The leafy 'burbs will fight (legally speaking) to remain leafy 'burbs.

Exactly. Maybe the whitest of collars will continue to move to the suburbs, but we won’t see a mass, middle-class exodus to the Boston burbs anytime soon without major changes to those very same burbs.

[wror]

Re
For at least 10 years there was always this rant about 'getting out of the cities' because of coming social unrest and food shortages if food supplies were ever cut in this country.
It has materialized and come true to be reality in 2020.
Add suburbs to the new rant---which suburbanites already know it is something they already know now.

Springfield like Brockton,New Bedford have been hampering for FOUR decades how their downtowns are coming back. They never did, never will.
Now it is Boston and every city in the country that has started the dying process.

Get out of the cities and suburbs. Be at least one hour away from any major city in the country.

[GeoffD]

Originally Posted by Boston Shudra

Exactly. Maybe the whitest of collars will continue to move to the suburbs, but we won’t see a mass, middle-class exodus to the Boston burbs anytime soon without major changes to those very same burbs.

The middle class exodus is to points south of the Mason-Dixon line.

[Boston Shudra]

Originally Posted by wror

For at least 10 years there was always this rant about 'getting out of the cities' because of coming social unrest and food shortages if food supplies were ever cut in this country.

Oh please.

Originally Posted by GeoffD

The middle class exodus is to points south of the Mason-Dixon line.

Which is a problem.

[massnative71]

Originally Posted by GeoffD

The middle class exodus is to points south of the Mason-Dixon line.

And NH.

[Boston Shudra]

Originally Posted by massnative71

And NH.

Same thing.

But jokes aside, I do think that NH has been doing better for its middle class than MA. The catch is that only southern NH can support middle class growth because the jobs are largely in eastern MA.

But [to get back in topic] Springfield can’t rely on Boston for economic growth. It needs something else, but I’m not sure what.

[Shrewsburried]

Originally Posted by GeoffD

The middle class exodus is to points south of the Mason-Dixon line.

Boomers, yes, but Millenials, Gen X, and immigrants are happily buying their suburban properties despite the "suburbs dying".

The uncomfortable fact no one heavily invested in this "urban renaissance" ever likes to acknowledge is that a large portion of the private sectors best paying jobs still remain outside of Boston proper. There's a reason Lexington remains a premier blue chip in this "urban renaissance" environment - 95/128 houses a ton of high paying jobs.

For every 30-100 person office in Kendall, there is another 300+ person office in Burlington or Bedford. It's a reality which is not going away so long as key leadership remains in the desirable 'burbs. Hell, even the 'boroughs continue to land large relevant R&D sites despite no city in sight.

[Shrewsburried]

Originally Posted by Boston Shudra

Same thing.

But jokes aside, I do think that NH has been doing better for its middle class than MA. The catch is that only southern NH can support middle class growth because the jobs are largely in eastern MA.

But [to get back in topic] Springfield can’t rely on Boston for economic growth. It needs something else, but I’m not sure what.

I'd disagree. The working class in NH see fairly suppressed wages compared to greater Boston as employers can pull workers from much lower COL areas. This is okay if you live somewhere like Milford NH, but not so great if living in Nashua where a house costs the same as West Bridgewater but some of the trades earn 30%+ less than they would in a Boston market, which includes the southshore.

The best thing which could happen for Springfield is for Worcester and Hartford to grow and ride that growth. Be were talking generations in timeline.

[GeoffD]

Originally Posted by Shrewsburried

Boomers, yes, but Millenials, Gen X, and immigrants are happily buying their suburban properties despite the "suburbs dying".

The uncomfortable fact no one heavily invested in this "urban renaissance" ever likes to acknowledge is that a large portion of the private sectors best paying jobs still remain outside of Boston proper. There's a reason Lexington remains a premier blue chip in this "urban renaissance" environment - 95/128 houses a ton of high paying jobs.

For every 30-100 person office in Kendall, there is another 300+ person office in Burlington or Bedford. It's a reality which is not going away so long as key leadership remains in the desirable 'burbs. Hell, even the 'boroughs continue to land large relevant R&D sites despite no city in sight.

I think it depends on how you define the middle class. Someone making $50k isn’t buying housing in metro Boston. There are lots of places where they can take the pay cut and afford housing in the South. I think the Boston view of middle class is quite different from red state middle class.