Why doesn’t Springfield downtown have more a happening downtown (Boston: insurance, crime rates)

[timberline742]

Originally Posted by mdovell

Right and Amherst and Northampton ARE gone now because the students aren't really coming back. .

Please. You really damage your credibility even more with this crud.

[mdovell]

Originally Posted by timberline742

Please. You really damage your credibility even more with this crud.

Crud? Amherst is nearly 100% dependent on umass Amherst.

The valley advocate isn't even publishing anymore. The gazette has had layoffs.

https://www.westernmassnews.com/news...e97c30261.html

"Paxton told Western Mass News that part of the reason why Amherst is at a 39 percent unemployment rate is because of the type of jobs college students get."

39% is a huge number. Focusing an economy primarily on bars and restaurants in Little Shop might sound nice but if the customers aren't there to actually use those then they shut down.

Northampton same thing.
https://www.masslive.com/business/20...t-traffic.html

So wait they are making an online shop... Now?!? What retailers don't do that?

If an economy is based off of one big thing in that one big thing declines it usually brings down everything with it. This can easily be seen is that happen with Gateway cities. Holyoke had paper, Springfield had the Armory, Brockton had shoes, Lowell Lawrence and lynn had textiles, Fall River and New Bedford had whale oil and then fishing, Pittsfield had General Electric. You can also see it in many communities that have lost a military base or in some cases a power plant.

Northampton is like a Cambridge of the West which is fine if classes were in session and everybody came back but the likelihood of that happening along with an umass is very small. How can they want students to come back but they really don't want them to venture outside of the area and they don't want them to have parties or Gatherings and there's no Sports and there's no activities there's no clubs, no guests etc

Why would anybody pay for online classes at the prices of in person if they can just stay at home? Why would any potential immigrant jump through all the Hoops of all the student visas and pay exorbitant amounts of money to get them show up at Amherst and Northampton and then be told they have to take the classes online!

This isn't just me saying this. It's the NYT.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/28/u...ege-towns.html
"Reliant on institutions that once seemed impervious to recession, “town and gown” communities that have evolved around rural campuses — Cornell, Amherst College, Penn State — are confronting not only Covid-19 but also major losses in population, revenue and jobs".

"Local governments are bracing, too. Amherst, Mass., is scheduled to vote this week on a proposal to increase annual water and sewer fees by an average of $100 per household, a result of a precipitous drop in water use as students have abandoned Hampshire College, Amherst College and the University of Massachusetts in that New England college town."

[timberline742]

Originally Posted by mdovell

Crud? Amherst is nearly 100% dependent on umass Amherst.

Yes, and it isn't going anywhere. All this other stuff you're rattling on about is very temporary. Just a blip in time.

[mdovell]

Originally Posted by timberline742

Yes, and it isn't going anywhere. All this other stuff you're rattling on about is very temporary. Just a blip in time.

Right but that's what you said months ago. First it was pax east and it went from there. I remember March when all of a sudden it was a hundred people and then 25 people and then 10 people for the limit.

The thing is this isn't temporary this is gradually being normalized. If the faculty isn't safe or feels safe will they come back. Does this qualify for a termination or not?
https://www.chicagotribune.com/coron...kkq-story.html

So someone jumps through hoops to get to campus and then the classroom might be the same webstream you could see at home? If professors aren't there it's a hard argument that the students should be there.

[timberline742]

Months is nothing. A year or two is nothing.
We've had pandemics before. We will have them again.
Every time you post its like the sky is falling.
It isn't.

[mdovell]

Originally Posted by timberline742

Months is nothing. A year or two is nothing.
We've had pandemics before. We will have them again.
Every time you post its like the sky is falling.
It isn't.

I'm not saying the sky is falling. Things already fell. A year or two is just nothing? This is the biggest pandemic since 1918. I don't remember 1918 neither do my parents and even if they were alive none of my grandparents you have to go back to great grandparents. You can say that something is "nothing" but when there's bills to pay and the economy is much faster it demands that things happen faster. Back in 1918 I don't even think an airplane could go more than 150mph. There was no internet let alone tv. Academia has gradually moved much of it online either to appease the students, teachers or administrators. Not all small businesses can deal with such a decline in population. It's also a census year so if the numbers drop from that it means aid going well beyond two years will shift. Housing, roads, bridges, academic funding etc.

Moving the goalposts isn't exactly winning an argument. When things change they don't always change back. It's been nearly 19 years since 9/11 and we still have the scans at the airport. Could they drop it? Maybe but would they feel safer doing so? Probably not. Safety is nearly open ended. Now apparently 100 school districts are telling the state (actual committees not committee members) that the state should pay for covid related protections.

https://www.bostonglobe.com/2020/07/...covid-supplies

It's like a scene from a movie with a guy out of gas at a station.
"How much is your gas"

"How much you got?"

If the towns and the state can't come to an agreement to anything other than online schools then that's the default until it is settled. I can see this going on for months easily. Again it's not the world ending but you have to understand that if boston is supposed to be propping up the state then the state is deciding it doesn't need it. If work from home and online education is the default then what's next ?

[timberline742]

No one is moving any goalposts. Your hyperbole is next level. Things are always changing, pandemic or not, but as a species we have both an extremely short memory and are extremely resilient. Some businesses will close, new ones will open. This is a temporary blip, nothing more. Schools will once again be populated. Concerts will once again happen. People will go out to eat and drink. This hiccup won't change that. It's ludicrous to think it will. Global wars haven't changed that, other pandemics haven't changed that. Nothing has ever changed that.

[Lampert]

Originally Posted by timberline742

No one is moving any goalposts. Your hyperbole is next level. Things are always changing, pandemic or not, but as a species we have both an extremely short memory and are extremely resilient. Some businesses will close, new ones will open. This is a temporary blip, nothing more. Schools will once again be populated. Concerts will once again happen. People will go out to eat and drink. This hiccup won't change that. It's ludicrous to think it will. Global wars haven't changed that, other pandemics haven't changed that. Nothing has ever changed that.

Some schools may realize they could make more money by using much more online teaching, thus reducing their footprint. This would be a side effect of covid but it could be a serious one.

[timberline742]

Originally Posted by Lampert

Some schools may realize they could make more money by using much more online teaching, thus reducing their footprint. This would be a side effect of covid but it could be a serious one.

May. Could. If those things were going to happen, they'd happen anyway, over time. Things do change over time, but people are still going to be going to college. Lots of things can't be done online. Lots of jobs can't be done at home.

[GeoffD]

Originally Posted by timberline742

May. Could. If those things were going to happen, they'd happen anyway, over time. Things do change over time, but people are still going to be going to college. Lots of things can't be done online. Lots of jobs can't be done at home.

Besides, a big slice of college is having a controlled environment to practice adulting for four years. Zoom video in your parent’s basement doesn’t achieve that.