South Coast Rail to New Bedford & Fall River...

[WestieWhitie]

Originally Posted by mdovell

I can tell you that having lived on the south shore in the late 90's that when a commuter rail comes in it will have an impact. I'd expect housing and rents to go up maybe 20-30%. Having said that though you also have to keep in mind that TOD and rentals are now the law if you get transit service.

https://www.boston.com/news/the-bost...w-enforcement/

Uh yeah. Housing authorities have nothing to do with zoning. In Kingston the Town Manager has argued that he might actually close the station which I don't think technically he can do.

Anyways transit will help more if connected. In Mass and Ct one of the reasons why the Acela isn't that much faster is old lyme blocks the speed increase. Springfield will be connected to Worcester as everything lined up (finance, staff, authority etc) Pittsfield is connect to the route to NYC and I'd argue this could go to Newport.

building a rail line where there is none takes more time. I'm awaiting the Palmer platform/station. It will be a few years but could be interesting.

It’s an ad*otic law - inclusionary zoning means any new apartment building can potentially turn into a mini bromley-heath, of course towns will it tooth and nail. Get rid of that, allow developers to build 100% market-rate and there would be a lot less opposition.

[lrfox]

Originally Posted by wanderer34

The primary objective of the South Coast Rail is to restore rail service to Fall River and New Bedford. Once that's completed, then the MBTA can think of extending to Newport.

The MBTA/MassDOT is secondary in terms of the initial evaluation of the want/need for service to Newport. That really falls on RIDOT and RI taxpayers to decide. RI will be on the hook for the vast majority of the project, so until RIDOT approaches MA and says "let's get something done," the MBTA/MassDOT won't be thinking about it much at all. Even after service is fully restored to Fall River. Similarly, there have been discussions about Extending the commuter rail from Lowell to Nashua/Manchester (and even Concord), but until NH says "let's do it!," it's not on the radar for Massachusetts.

[mdovell]

Originally Posted by lrfox

The MBTA/MassDOT is secondary in terms of the initial evaluation of the want/need for service to Newport. That really falls on RIDOT and RI taxpayers to decide. RI will be on the hook for the vast majority of the project, so until RIDOT approaches MA and says "let's get something done," the MBTA/MassDOT won't be thinking about it much at all. Even after service is fully restored to Fall River. Similarly, there have been discussions about Extending the commuter rail from Lowell to Nashua/Manchester (and even Concord), but until NH says "let's do it!," it's not on the radar for Massachusetts.

That's kinda it. When we talk about going from point A to point B we don't assume routes technically. The difference between public and private transit is private has destinations and public has routes. You can get private to reroute as long as there isn't a stop. To reroute public requires a public hearing (you can move a bus stop).


So technically speaking you can have multiple lines get people to places but it doesn't specifically mean it's one company or entity. Vermont pays for the Vermonter. Is someone really going to go from Burlington to DC on a constant basis (outside of sanders?) probably not. But it opens up the other areas as stops. So ridership might not be A to B but in the middle. The whole thing of Boston to Springfield or vice versa isn't exactly just that but when you connect two terminal ends it adds up. We should have loops and circles with transit systems, not dead ends.

Transit planning isn't easy. Often times the boards are made up of yes men/women that are elected that might not know everything there is so they sign off. I've also seen paratransit representation as empty. Heck not all boards have a rider representative.

[wanderer34]

Originally Posted by lrfox

The MBTA/MassDOT is secondary in terms of the initial evaluation of the want/need for service to Newport. That really falls on RIDOT and RI taxpayers to decide. RI will be on the hook for the vast majority of the project, so until RIDOT approaches MA and says "let's get something done," the MBTA/MassDOT won't be thinking about it much at all. Even after service is fully restored to Fall River. Similarly, there have been discussions about Extending the commuter rail from Lowell to Nashua/Manchester (and even Concord), but until NH says "let's do it!," it's not on the radar for Massachusetts.

Since RI already has MBTA commuter rail service, it's still a pretty good chance rail service can reach Newport sometime in our lives. It's also a golden opportunity for NH to reconsider allowing commuter rail to serve Southern NH. Extending the Lowell and Lawrence lines to Manchester and Concord is actually doable, and it's surprising that NH has as of yet not allowed commuter rail to pass by Southern NH. Hopefully Gov Sununu and NH voters can see the benefits of having commuter rail in Southern NH.

[doubleu1117]

Extending to Fall River to Newport could make a lot of sense. It's a shame the Fall River to Providence ROW has been built over with a few homes. Rhode Island has decent potential to build out a good rail network, but unfortunately wouldn't be able to connect to Fall River/ Newport anymore.

A few lines with in tact ROWs you could hypothetically build out:

- Providence- Woonsocket- Worcester line

- Providence- College Hill (existing tunnel)- East Providence- North to Pawtucket/ South to Bristol

- Fall River- Newport


Connecting Providence to Fall River would be the cherry on top to fill out this mini transit system. But even without there's a lot of potential to invest in.

[GeoffD]

Originally Posted by doubleu1117

Extending to Fall River to Newport could make a lot of sense. It's a shame the Fall River to Providence ROW has been built over with a few homes. Rhode Island has decent potential to build out a good rail network, but unfortunately wouldn't be able to connect to Fall River/ Newport anymore.

It would make more sense to finish Route 24 so it doesn't dead end in Portsmouth. Not that finishing Route 24 would ever happen.

[yesmaybe]

Originally Posted by doubleu1117

Extending to Fall River to Newport could make a lot of sense. It's a shame the Fall River to Providence ROW has been built over with a few homes. Rhode Island has decent potential to build out a good rail network, but unfortunately wouldn't be able to connect to Fall River/ Newport anymore.

There aren't any jobs in Providence so there really isn't a point.

[robr2]

Originally Posted by GeoffD

It would make more sense to finish Route 24 so it doesn't dead end in Portsmouth. Not that finishing Route 24 would ever happen.

I'm down there for work regularly. What is the reason for 24 not going to the bridge?

[lrfox]

Originally Posted by GeoffD

It would make more sense to finish Route 24 so it doesn't dead end in Portsmouth. Not that finishing Route 24 would ever happen.

Agreed. I believe the plan was to originally have it link in to the Pell Bridge (you can even see on Satellite views where the roadway was supposed to continue North). Not sure why it never happened. I'm assuming local opposition or lack of money (or some combination of the two). It'll never happen now. There was a lot more free land for an extension when both 24 and the bridge opened in the 60s. They'd never be able to push it through now.

I'm actually all for a rail extension to Newport so I'd be happy for both the 24 extension and rail extension (though I wouldn't bet on either happening). It's something I'd love to be able to use. But the vast majority of people heading to/from Newport will arrive in cars and East/West Main on Aquidneck Island are an inadequate roadways for the volume heading north/south. Rail's great, but it wouldn't pull many of those cars off the road.

[GeoffD]

Originally Posted by robr2

I'm down there for work regularly. What is the reason for 24 not going to the bridge?

For the same reason I-84 doesn’t go from Hartford to Providence. Rhode Island NIMBY stopped both projects. What is now I-384 in Connecticut also dead ends. Connecticut started building their part before RI NIMBYs in Scituate killed the project.

I also get the pleasure of driving the Southeast Expressway for the same reason.