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The only other place i lived in he US besides NY was a small town in Texas. So thats how it feels here-exactly the same as in Texas-suburban life, drive everywhere, quiet, boring, except in Texas it was CHEAP, and it actually made sense. over here-you get similar life to any other suburbia, just with a more beautiful background and very expensive. thats why i dont understand people who more here from other states-why would you want to do it? it is a small island, you can see everything in a month or two and then what? unless you are in to some kind of activity like diving, surfing, etc-there is really no point at all. if you want to go anywhere else-i is $1000 round trip. whats the point? when you are n mainland, you can buy $200-$400 ticket and go skiing, Florida, Canada, you can fly to Europe for $500. there is so much more you can afford to do.
Fun is where you find it and generally around here you have to make it yourself especially if you are on a budget. We took a bamboo trebuchet (sling catapult) to the park today and tried to fling things a long distance but it needs more work. Our medieval calculations must have been off. We did manage to fling a pink elephant about thirty meters. That was our anti-Republican statement and we were going to fling a blue donkey but the dogs were playing with it and wouldn't give it back so we didn't manage the reciprocative anti-Democratic statement. Otherwise it was pretty quiet in the park. With the economy going sour, there seems to be less people out and about.
glad you are pointing these things out-people dont think about this. unless you have tons of money to throw around, once you move there, you maybe "stuck" there. one has to really think about whether they are content living the island life. and can handle island fever. and willing to sacrifice alot of things, and pay the price.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JuliaHuff
The only other place i lived in he US besides NY was a small town in Texas. So thats how it feels here-exactly the same as in Texas-suburban life, drive everywhere, quiet, boring, except in Texas it was CHEAP, and it actually made sense. over here-you get similar life to any other suburbia, just with a more beautiful background and very expensive. thats why i dont understand people who more here from other states-why would you want to do it? it is a small island, you can see everything in a month or two and then what? unless you are in to some kind of activity like diving, surfing, etc-there is really no point at all. if you want to go anywhere else-i is $1000 round trip. whats the point? when you are n mainland, you can buy $200-$400 ticket and go skiing, Florida, Canada, you can fly to Europe for $500. there is so much more you can afford to do.
I just dont think it is worth it-staying here. My husband can always go to the Carribean to dive if he wants to. I just cant see our money melt away-completely not worth it. you can buy a nice place in New Jersey or Brooklyn for $250K, and spend $100 a week on groceries, not $300.
1. It's almost impossible to buy anything good in NJ for $250K. May be some small condo. Same in Brooklyn.
2. Be ready to pay property tax around $5K - $15K a year. NJ has highest property tax in US.
3. If you buy house in NJ you will have to buy 2 cars. Can't avoid it, there is no public transportation.
With the exception of Oahu, public transportation is either meager or non-existent. You would need a car (or two) on any of the other islands. Oahu's bus system is good enough that not having a car is easier than having one. Especially with Oahu's traffic and parking.
With property taxes, the trade off isn't so much how much the taxes are as it is what you get or rather don't get for them. There are a lot of services mainland folks are used to having that we don't have so even though the property taxes are lower the amount of services are also much lower. The school budget is funded out of the statewide general excise tax of 4% which is on everything, food and medicine included. So even renters pay into the school systems. Also, since the schools are funded on a state level all the schools are the same. (Well, that's the theory, anyway) so you can't move to a different township (we don't have those, either) and get a better school.
The major difficulty of the housing prices here is the lack of employment to support the prices. We have folks coming in from outside our economic system who can afford to pay a lot more than the folks working around here can. Which drives the prices up higher than the local folks can afford. When you have a limited supply of housing in an area of limited income and allow outsiders with more income access to the same resources the prices will be higher than can be supported by the local incomes. It works for the outsiders if they don't expect to relocate and support themselves in the area of limited income. When they do, they then become aware of exactly what sacrifices it takes.
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And i really dont understand what for? why would anyone want to move here? Yes, it is beautiful, so what-come visit. but to live here-it is not worth it. ...
Look, we all get it OK? You're unhappy here. But here's the thing: None of us are trying to *convince* you that you should feel otherwise. Yet you feel compelled to convince us that we should all be unhappy here.
Why would I want to move here:
1. I'd rather swim (for free!) in the ocean than get a manicure any day. I've had exactly one manicure in my life, and it was a boring and unpleasant experience. So $45 manis or whatever don't bother me at all.
2. I'd rather be warm and in the sun and on the beach year-round, rather than bundled up and cold 5 months out of the year.
3. I'd rather live somewhere where the people are friendly and warm than someplace where you're crazy if you talk to a stranger on the subway.
4. There are (lots of) things a lot more important to me than money. If I'm making enough to pay my rent & buy my food, then I'm OK.
5. But even so, I understand how to budget and live pretty cheaply. I love shopping at farmers' markets. I go two or three times per week, and get almost all the food I need for cheap. They know me know, and toss extra stuff in my bag for free on each visit. I don't buy (or like) much prepared food. I rarely buy meat. When I do, it's expensive, but it's gooooood.
6. I'm actually spending less money here and saving more, because I don't drive nearly as much as I used to, and everything I really like to do is free or cheap. I don't have to go out to fancy restaurants just to have something to do... there's lots of outdoorsy stuff to do which is way more fun and cheaper.
7. I have a very good job here, which I love. I couldn't have quite this job anywhere else.
8. I don't need money to travel all the time. I'm already where I want to be. On weekends, I'll go on hikes or to the beach. My family comes to see me.
Very well said NewUHProf....those are pretty much the reasons(among others) anyone who is happy living in Hawaii..lives in Hawaii...I can't wait to get there in January!!!
...one has to really think about whether they are content living the island life. and can handle island fever. and willing to sacrifice alot of things, and pay the price.
We were - my husband and I lived in Honolulu for almost nine years - and right now we're not, but we might be again in the future (willing to do whatever it takes to live in Hawaii). I wrote about our experience moving to Oahu in this thread (look for the post by freebird):
It's all tradeoffs - right now we live in southern California and there is a ton of stuff we can do that we couldn't do when we lived on Oahu. We like being able to drive to Las Vegas instead of having to fly - we are crazy about snowboarding and can drive to the mountains all winter long - we like being able to fly to see our parents in Florida without having to fly redeye flights, or to get to the Cayman Islands or Cancun for way less airfare - we like having the stores we didn't have when we lived in Hawaii - we like being able to drive 80-90mph on wide open freeways - we like not having palmetto bugs - it's great to be able to buy whatever we want to eat and not look at the price tag. . .BUT when we lived there we weren't focusing on expensive airfare and gnarly flight times, bugs everywhere, the high cost of food (especially fruit) and 25-30mph speed limits - we were surfing almost every day, running on the beach, riding the bus so we didn't have to contend with the traffic as much, walking out at night to dinner and eating foods we would never get to eat again until we returned there, taking advantage of multiple other islands to explore, watching the Triple Crown of Surfing live and in person (stuff we had only seen in magazines when we lived in Florida). It was about actually just ignoring and working around all the stuff that was inconvenient or that we didn't like, thinking it was totally worth putting up with ANYTHING to have the chance to live out there. And it completely, definitely was worth it, for almost nine years. . .what we loved about it so completely outweighed the things we didn't like as much - those things we didn't like were just annoyances we tolerated for the privilege of living around all the rest of the things we were crazy about.
We moved away from Hawaii in 2006 but were just in Honolulu for two weeks straight - Tim was there for work, but working just the weekdays so on the weekends and at night it was sort of like living there all over again - so familiar but almost brand-new as well. We stayed in Waikiki - surfed as much as we could both in the mornings before work and in the late afternoons, watched surfing at Pipeline (first waves of the winter maybe?) and a contest at Sunset, ate local food that we miss and can't acquire in California, and thought that we would like to have this lifestyle back again for sure at some point in time. When we were out in the waves one morning we were all but ready to trade everything we like about where we live now JUST to get to surf every day. Now that we are back in California, we know we aren't ready - realistically we knew it even while we were there. We will know when or if the time is right. IF we did ever move back, it would be with our eyes wide open and knowing the tradeoffs and whether it would be worth it to us or not - we wouldn't come back wishing for what we left behind - the difference is that we have experienced both sides now and JuliaHuff didn't get the chance to do that before making the jump. Right now we know we're still not finished with experiences on the mainland - make no mistake, we know if we moved back right now we would feel caged. There will most likely come a time, though, when nothing else we could do, eat, acquire or experience while living on the mainland compares to just being able to walk out from our apartment to the beach in the afternoon after work with our boards and surf until we can't see the waves coming in anymore.
I think what happened to JuliaHuff is that she wanted to be with her husband on Maui - it sounded exotic and fun or neat to give it a shot - she sought information on the forums and was advised to carefully consider everything - knew it would be different but perhaps not SO very different and that it would be worth the tradeoffs - but it turned out to be not even remotely like the lifestyle she loves and isn't worth it in her mind - and she is now focused on what's bad and what she doesn't have instead of the amazing place that Maui is. Of course Maui has problems. Absolutely, it isn't like New York and especially Manhattan - but focusing on the things you don't like is a sure way to exist in misery no matter where you live. I'm sure even in Manhattan there were negatives or things she didn't like as much as others, but the positives far outweighed whatever negatives were perceived or existed and thus it was "worthwhile" to live there. I am really happy if she has decided to move back to the mainland and feels peaceful and good about it - there is no glory in living somewhere you hate and seriously no shame whatsoever in admitting somewhere isn't for you. It's ok to hate living on Maui, especially being dropped into the situation as she was and with the medical problems (I am so sorry about that) - alot of us might hate living on Manhattan Island as well - you never know until you are actually in the situation. The problem comes when someone tries to change the views of others on the island and/or points out the negatives (which might be total positives for another person) in an attempt to make others feel the same way or agree with their point.
I love what newUHprof wrote - it really does seem, Julia, that you're trying to convince those who love it on Maui and are insanely happy (or even just content) to live there that their thinking is flawed and how in the world could they like it? Happiness is defined differently by almost everyone and there are a ton of reasons to love living in the islands - we loved it when we lived there - I know for sure why anyone would love it there and I can also see where someone would be absolutely miserable there if it wasn't what they expected and if they didn't turn the situation around to take advantage of the opportunities that are there - there are so many opportunities that really can be found nowhere else. Then again, as hotcatz wrote, "for many folks Hawaii is better defined by what we don't have than what we do have" - the lifestyles truly are just so completely different. When you want something enough (whether it's experiences you can get in Hawaii or anything else), you are willing to give up or change so many things in order to have those experiences every day of your life. If you want things that Hawaii cannot offer - and if the amazing things it does offer will never be able to make up for what you miss about somewhere else, your choice is sort of obvious.
This whole thread is another really compelling argument for visiting and spending time on an island first before uprooting everything and moving out there. It also proves that, if you're moving "for someone" and aren't totally sure about it yourself, to be extremely careful. When we moved to Oahu we went out there totally intending to fit in and do whatever was necessary to live there and work around whatever we might not like - it worked out incredibly for us. Now that we live in California - with icy cold ocean water, surfing with thick wetsuits on and not nearly as often as we would like - even though this is a major, huge negative thing for us - we aren't concentrating on that or trying to convince others that the water is way too cold and how could they like it here - - we're thinking about all the stuff we love about living here, experiencing as much of it as we can right now because we know we won't always live here, and at the same time sorting out where we want to end up in the future.
JuliaHuff, please understand that those of us who lived in Hawaii before, or who currently live there, found a place that was right for us at whatever point in our lives and that we will never feel exactly the way you feel right now.... that it's either worth living with what isn't there in order to live around what IS there - or else that we might have agreed with some of your points and decided to move away from the islands for some of those very reasons when the right time arrived for us. The point is that we acted instead of wishing for what we didn't have or thinking we would enjoy living somewhere else - we decided and acted. Figure out the place that's right for you, that has the things you want in your life right now (because what we want in life definitely changes - it did for us - it will again), and go there. Follow your heart and be true to yourself and what you really want.
I apologize for the long post but I have been following this thread since it started. JuliaHuff, I'm not sure if you really want to move for sure or are just having trouble with the initial shock and are rethinking things right now. Hawaii isn't for everyone for sure (neither is New York - and if you dropped me into Manhattan right now, never having been there, I would be wigged beyond words and would miss California and Hawaii both, more than I could ever explain). List the things you do like about Maui, figure out if there are any substitutes or ways to replace some of what you miss about Manhattan, decide if you can embrace the island and focus on the good - if you want to fit into the lifestyle and make compromises and not comparisons - - and if not then you will know what to do. I truly wish for you to find peace and I wish you all the best as you are sorting out what to do and making your future plans.
MadRussian-dont forget that you are in a fully air conditioned hotel right now. you dont have to worry about $700 electricity bill. i am sitting in my house drenched in sweat, i cant even watch tv-too freaking hot, everywhere. this heat gets old pretty quick, if you ask me, there is no way o escape it.
Unoproof-you are obviously young and have no children, and dont plan to have any. because if you did, you would start worrying about money, air conditioning, expensive food, crappy hospital, etc.
As for pedicures-you dont have to sacrifice pedicures in order to be able to go to the beach-i was on the beach every weekend in NY, and also enjoyed cheap manicures. Hawaii is not the only place with a beach! there is both East and west coast, there is Carribean, Florida, it is not like you have to move to Hawaii and pay all this money to live here, because you can go to the beach! move to Florida, it will be MUCH cheaper, and the beach is probably nicer-no waves. So is Carribean
Farmers markets in NY are 5 times cheaper then here, with much bigger selection-like fresh berries and peaches. In NY, I did not care about how much AC cost-electricity is cheap there. I also enjoyed going skiing in the winter, white water rafting, hiking in the beautiful fall mountains, how is it worse then here?
I am from Siberia, so I'd rather be cold, then living in the constant heat worrying about how much AC costs-I am locked in the house all day today, it is just too hot, I cant even breathe, the beach is not any better, as soon as you get out of the water, it is hot.
I strongly advice everyone who is planning their move to Hawaii to think it through. We spent thousands of dollars on relocation, hawaian licences, we left our cat in NY, we got rid of our furniture and winter clothes. it was a complete waste of money.
We all understand you are unhappy, and we hope you will return quickly to New York.
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