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My brother died recently of a heart attack. He was also alcoholic. My mother believes alcoholism is a lack of will of the person. She approaches her life like this and if she has a medical issue she does everything by the book. I keep telling her that that is her "normal" and it is not the addicts "normal". She refuses to believe it has anything to do with it being a disease. I just stop talking with her about it at this point.
So, I'm just curious what other people think and how they see it.
I think that real alcoholics are very strong willed.
I know some cancer survivors who are strong-willed too. It's just that cancer survivors, like my mom, and two of my cousins, are much more respected because of their "will".
I think that real alcoholics are very strong willed.
I know some cancer survivors who are strong-willed too. It's just that cancer survivors, like my mom, and two of my cousins, are much more respected because of their "will".
Yes, I can agree with that too. I have told my mother that I believe my brother really didn't want to give up the drink. That would be his will, yes. Only unlike, your mom and cousins, it is a seriously negative will.
I believe that it's correctly called a disease. No, it's not an airborne bug that you catch, but once you're an alcoholic it is a disease. Some people do become dependent on alcohol easier than others too, and they say that is in your genes.
My late wife's mother was an alcoholic, and she was so afraid of it that she refused to drink any alcohol at all. She figured if she never drank any she wouldn't "like it", and if she didn't like it she wouldn't abuse it.
She figured if she never drank any she wouldn't "like it", and if she didn't like it she wouldn't abuse it.
I think that's called a teetotaler or something like that. They just don't drink at all. Non-alcoholics don't have to "not drink." They don't have to hide the booze or play games to be safe from over-indulgence in the stuff.
Brava, condolences to your bro. I think he wanted to drink just the moment before he popped the cap, but he wasn't thinking straight. He didn't think, "I'm gonna get all lit up now and make a wreck of my life. Watch this." No, he probably said something like, "It's not going to get me this time. I'm just gonna have a few and rest the nerves... just a bit of peace, ease and comfort. I can control it this time. I'm not going to black out and I'm not going to get sick or violent." Either that or he didn't think much about the consequences at all.
I can't handle my booze. I've been sober something like 3 months short of 8 years, but who's counting? I tried to quit many times because I was an eff-up when I drank. I hated hurting people, letting people down, being in trouble with the courts, wrecking cars, hurting myself, darn near dying of acute alcohol poisoning, fighting people and being dangerous, etc. I was horrified. I damn well quit many a time. But it didn't last long.
Every time drink day came again, I couldn't "bring into mind with sufficient force the suffering or humiliation of even a week ago."
You could just say alcohol had to do something for me before it did something to me. Once I crossed that line, there was no human force that would keep me from my elixir of life.
If I could have just decided away from that first drink, I'd have something like 27 years of sobriety or longer. I simply could not nor do I believe I can keep myself from the first drink.
But whatever works, right?
I don't know what to say about your mom's position, but I'm glad that she is aware that there was nothing she could have done to save your bro. He should have found a sufficient reason to stop or get help from somewhere to get and stay sober. I know only one path. There are many paths now. But alcoholics still die every day. Alcoholism is an industry... unfortunately. DM me if you want to talk.
Alcohol and drugs are spirits, negative spirits. Abusers ususually tip me off by "telling me" they're searching for a better spiritual world, spiritual experiences.
And being that we live in a spiritually bankrupt country (Capitalism and Spirituality make for very poor bed partners) I can see how easy it would be to enter the negative spiritual world.
I disagree with your assessment of a spiritual experience, America, and your political agenda.
All spiritual experiences are wonderful... whether by meditation, discipline, alcohol abuse, or meth or cocaine abuse. All drugs and alcohol do is remove the clouds blocking you from who you really are. But they are a stolen and a temporary experience. You dont need drugs to get there.
America has a collective consciousness of about 380. We are in the realm of neutrality, arts, sciences, etc. Go to a third world country where women cannot feed their children and know that tomorrow will be worse.
If you want to help the world out, put the crack pipe down, get your wallets out, and open your heart to someone I'm need. Don't villify a country for doing it right... imo of course.
I'm sorry that you lost your brother recently !! But, I tend to lean toward 'lack of will'. There are to many things in our society that lean people toward not blaming theirselves and a general "It's not my fault" type of attitude. We make our own choices everyday, and they do to. We all have our faults, some are visible and some are not. -- On another note, so many times ,we try to convince others of what 'we' think... . Perhaps. even though I disagree, there are countless others who will agree with you, Instead of you talking with your mother, give her scientific studies to read at her own leisure, that support your beliefs and maybe that will help open the discussion a bit between the two of you? Just a thought?
Shaming the alcoholic is a wonderful thing... which sits right below guilt at a level of conscious awareness of 20. This is just above the level of death at zero, and suicide which is at about -20.
Being that this is the Mental Health subforum, I don't see the virtue in shaming. But if that works for you, have at it. We should have a "shamers" subforum. What? You have cancer AND diabetes? You pig! Get away from me!
I spent 27 years just trying to have a good time with booze, socialize, enjoy the lack of ambition. But I didn't drink like you. I overshot the mark... more often than not. Once I had booze in me, there simply was no choice. But sober, I make a choice, right? Then after I get two down, I change my mind. Then before you know it, oblivion.
This is an internal condition folks. This is the way it is for me. I'm not interested in your opinion of my direct experience.
If you can drink two and stop, do it. If you can keep yourself from the first drink, do it. Problem solved.
But if you fail at either or, DM me. We'll talk about it.
Probably the most revealing thing I will say on this site...but I have spent over 250k to get treated for drug abuse and this specific disease...Once some one is significantly detoxed it's a question of whether they are done.You wanna talk hard core alcoholism. that said I'm drunk at the moment..self will.....what's that...For those twelve steppers..God's will..and maybe.............................................
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