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OP, you are not responsible for your depression, nor will white-knuckling, pull yourself up by your bootstraps attitude mitigate your depression.
Go back to your doctor. That you had success is hopeful. Perhaps you need a higher dose of what you're on. It can take a long while to get your meds right.
Other changes can help--better eating, more exercise, meditation. But I know how impossible those activities are when you're in the depths.
Good luck.
Thats not what I said. He isn't responsible for getting depression, but yes, he is responsible for dealing with it.
White knuckling isn't going to work also, I never said that. He needs to take charge, identify when his depression is lying to him, tell himself what is happening, and then make the choice to do the right thing instead of following what his depression is telling him.
Do all those things they say, therapy, exercise, meditation, journaling, meds etc.... they will give you a very temporary reprieve from time to time, but they will not be the ultimate answer. When those things give you that temporary reprieve, that is when you will make progress, but only if you take responsibility, get into action and put in the effort.
A second and third reading brings some of what you wrote into better focus and maybe I'll write about that some later. But I feel this is kinda a dangerous notion. I don't believe it is entirely within our control. There's a lot of evidence to suggest otherwise, actually. A lot of folks need help. Maybe not everyone needs meds, but they may need therapy. Nevermind that some people wrongly think drinking to excess or using drugs is the way they can control it. Others think ignoring the problem is the way to go.
My last doctor was very progressive in that meds alone won't solve most peoples problems. Most people need to change their way of thinking, he said. the meds helps. Therapy helps. He never used the term that it was "in our control" because, I suspect, he realizes how dangerous that can be.
I absolutely encourage you to go to therapy, try meds, exercise, meditate etc... do all those things, but if you aren't ultimately in control of your actions how will you ever get better? You need to teach yourself to identify when your depression is talking to you, realize what is happening and that it is a lie, and make the correct decision.
For example:
Something awful happened to you in the past. You sit there and start talking negative about it, over and over. My life is over, I might as well be dead etc.... When that happens you need to be able to first recognize that it is happening, recognize that it is your depression doing that to you, recognize that the smart thing to do is stop blaming the past, because there is nothing you can do to change it, it is 100% out of your control, and instead do what it needed today to get what you want because that is in your control.
Identify, tell yourself out loud, "I am starting to think negative and blaming the past that I have no control over, it is my depression telling me this and isn't the right thing to do." "Instead, I am going to .........." then talk about how you will solve the issue, work towards your goal etc...... and then do it.
A friend asks you to go do something. Your immediate response is to say no, I don't feel like it, won't be fun, I will hate it etc...... STOP - recognize that I use to love going out and doing this, I had fun doing it, it is my depression telling me to say no and it is lie that I won't have fun, then you conjure up all your might and GO.
Start doing this and you will retrain your brain. It will get easier and easier as you do it more and more. As you start to enjoy time out you will train your brain to once again desire to have fun and you will become more motivated to do things as your brain desires it more.
If you just sit there and play the victim game, I have depression, my brain is broke (and it is, but you can retrain it), I am hopeless and there is nothing I can do because it is all out of my control and I have tried everything, meds, therapy, exercise etc... and I am still depressed, it doesn't work etc.... you will never get better long term.
You will just enjoy very brief moments of positivity, but you will always dive right back into depression and it will get worse and worse over time.
The only thing that works long term is when you take responsibility and start fighting back yourself.
Just putting all your eggs in the meds or therapy or exercise basket and then sitting on the sidelines waiting for the miracle to happen is not going to work.
Last edited by High Altitude; 01-30-2018 at 04:04 PM..
Joe, have you considered using a light-therapy lamp or light box? It can't hurt to add it to your arsenal.
Depression can have many causes and just as many solutions. Usually a combo. Don't dismiss all of High Altitude's suggestions, just add the ones you like to what you are already doing. Like with your diabetes, you're not trying just one treatment are you?
Please be good to yourself. I lost my first-born to depression a few years ago. I wish she had tried more things to help herself.
Thats not what I said. He isn't responsible for getting depression, but yes, he is responsible for dealing with it.
White knuckling isn't going to work also, I never said that. He needs to take charge, identify when his depression is lying to him, tell himself what is happening, and then make the choice to do the right thing instead of following what his depression is telling him.
Do all those things they say, therapy, exercise, meditation, journaling, meds etc.... they will give you a very temporary reprieve from time to time, but they will not be the ultimate answer. When those things give you that temporary reprieve, that is when you will make progress, but only if you take responsibility, get into action and put in the effort.
You clearly have no actual experience with clinical depression. The things you are asking are impossible for most people when they're truly depressed. You can't out-think it. You can't just "try harder" and outmuscle it.
You clearly have no actual experience with clinical depression. The things you are asking are impossible for most people when they're truly depressed. You can't out-think it. You can't just "try harder" and outmuscle it.
I probably have more experience as a patient dealing with treatment resistant depression than most people on this forum.
If you just sit back and hope that by taking some pill or just because you exercised, you will magically all of a sudden never have depression and your life is going to be all unicorns and rainbows, you are setting yourself up for major failure and disappointment.
It takes active participation and responsibility to fight back what your brain is telling you.
It is not impossible to do, it just takes someone to be willing to do it once they accept what is going on with them and how they need to approach it. It takes some time to accomplish, but over time you get better at it, your brain becomes more receptive of receiving and sending all those good chemicals you need and things will change.
And you don't just will it out of nothing. You identify what is happening, recognize that it is your depression talking, telling you what to do, and then react accordingly because instead of just relying on a pill to cure you, you have become educated, conscious of what is happening, experienced in identifying your different behaviors and what will happen to you if you listen to it, and then you reach into your bag of tricks and beat it.
Lots of other mood disorders and addictions are treated in a similar way.
And yes, some will does play in it, and it is possible, otherwise so many depressed people would never leave their bed, but yet, they conjure up the will to get out of it.
Last edited by High Altitude; 01-30-2018 at 07:24 PM..
You know, it might help to add some of what I've been through in the last three plus years --
burst appendix which led to two surgeries
wife left and took the kids
rubbed a cyst on my big right toe
big right toe, fourth right toe amputated
then half of right foot amputated
then right leg below knee amputated
first two toes off left foot amputated
became septic and was in hospital from Halloween 2015 to May 2, 2016
13 total surgeries
300 total days in hospital, two stays for depression after suicide attempts
Out of all of that, the separation and divorce were the worse things to happen. I don't mention this to pat myself on the back, but then maybe I do. I've been through some ish, but one thing I have learned... Well, two things really. 1.) There's always someone who has it worse than you. I was back in the ER one time sitting there with my prosthetic on and chatting with a dude about my age (I'm 47 now) and he was telling me the doctors were telling him his fingers if not hands would eventually have to be amputated. And he said, "Don't take this the wrong way, but I'd rather be in your shape than in mine." And I said, "Don't take tis the wrong way, but I'd rather be in my shape than yours, too."
The other thing I have learned is that we each react to our own situations differently and it's not fair to ourselves or others to compare our situations.
I probably have more experience as a patient dealing with treatment resistant depression than most people on this forum.
If you just sit back and hope that by taking some pill or just because you exercised, you will magically all of a sudden never have depression and your life is going to be all unicorns and rainbows, you are setting yourself up for major failure and disappointment.
It takes active participation and responsibility to fight back what your brain is telling you.
It is not impossible to do, it just takes someone to be willing to do it once they accept what is going on with them and how they need to approach it. It takes some time to accomplish, but over time you get better at it, your brain becomes more receptive of receiving and sending all those good chemicals you need and things will change.
And you don't just will it out of nothing. You identify what is happening, recognize that it is your depression talking, telling you what to do, and then react accordingly because instead of just relying on a pill to cure you, you have become educated, conscious of what is happening, experienced in identifying your different behaviors and what will happen to you if you listen to it, and then you reach into your bag of tricks and beat it.
Lots of other mood disorders and addictions are treated in a similar way.
And yes, some will does play in it, and it is possible, otherwise so many depressed people would never leave their bed, but yet, they conjure up the will to get out of it.
You're giving with one hand and taking away with the other.
You say no one's responsible for their depression, yet the "solutions" you recommend clearly place the burden of success on the OP's willingness to engage as dictated, with an underlying attitude of, "you're just not trying hard enough." You're assuming a level of functionality many depressed people simply can't muster until some brain chemistry issues have been addressed.
I concede that not everyone's depression presents similarly, and certainly coping mechanisms play a part in managing depression. But your dismissal of medication as a major factor in improving depression undermines your other worthwhile suggestions.
I apologize for my comment about you having no experience with clinical depression. That was uncalled for and snarky. I don't know your situation. At the same time, you also have no idea what other people have been through with their depression.
This concludes my participation in the thread. Joe, best of luck to you. You've been through a lot and I hope you find some peace.
I am not assuming a level of functionality at all. I did encourage therapy, meds, exercise etc. and I said that meds and exercise will give you a temporary reprieve (i.e. Functionality to do the things you need to do) and that is when you need to put in your most work of reprogramming your brain, but those meds and exercise are temporary for a large majority.
There are always levels of functionality. If you aren't at the point of being able to catch your behaviors at the time it is happening, then keep a log and write it in a journal after. As you keep that log you will one day catch that big troll depression telling you something that isn't true and you will have a light bulb moment.
Joe, have you considered using a light-therapy lamp or light box? It can't hurt to add it to your arsenal.
Depression can have many causes and just as many solutions. Usually a combo. Don't dismiss all of High Altitude's suggestions, just add the ones you like to what you are already doing. Like with your diabetes, you're not trying just one treatment are you?
Please be good to yourself. I lost my first-born to depression a few years ago. I wish she had tried more things to help herself.
Depression runs in my family quite strongly. Different meds worked differently in all of us. Makes sense, as we are not identical in thought, emotional response, or in other health aspects even if we do share some heredity. I have tried several but eventually found one that helped the most; and it has done so for probably 25 years. The dosage was what varied, probably because of other things going on in life at the time. Things that affected me physically such as cancer chemo, hormonal change, work stress and added anxiety, etc.
I find that having a "go to tool box" of things that lift my mood helps me quite a bit. Make a list of the things that are pretty much guaranteed to make me feel better, and keep it someplace easy to refer to, like the fridge. Sometimes when you are really in the dark you need an easy way to remind yourself. Sometimes one trick will appeal to you and other times it won't. Its OK to pick and choose! In the middle of a sub-zero winter I'm less likely to count on that breezy outdoor walk, no matter how "good" it would be for me! If you don't know if something new might help, try it....note the results, add it to the box or discard it. Often you can't predict how well something will work. It may be very simple stuff that doesn't take a lot of energy; a favorite easy read book, a change in lighting, photo collection, flipping through favorite art books, a movie, tv re-runs, tasty snack, little craft or hobby, writing (I have a lifelong novel I've been playing around with. Everything can be exactly as I want it. It will probably never be read by anyone other than me), a friend to chat with, a scented lotion, music, bath, going online to learn something, searching for a specific item on ebay, all sorts of stuff.
OK, for the special benefit of a fellow sufferer, I'll swallow my embarrassment and fess up that one of mine is watching recorded America's Funniest Home Videos episodes (with the annoying host muted). There is such a hodge podge of these clips there's almost always a few in each episode that crack my armor, and I end up giggling helplessly. Next thing I know, I'm howling. I feel better. Pet and stupid human trick types tend to work the best for me.
The mere thought that you even HAVE a tool box lightens a down moment because it reminds you that you can get some relief. Even for a couple of hours. But it was something YOU SELECTED, something YOU DID. That gives you a little control, and loss of control is a big part of the dismal dark misery.
Dear Joe, you are not alone. We may not be taking off our coats in your front hall and handing you a totally decadent plate of cookies, but we understand and hope you find some peace. We're rooting for ya!
Last edited by Parnassia; 02-01-2018 at 03:57 PM..
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Just look at what you've gone thru and made it through. 
