[magellan]

My driver's ed teacher taught us that the amount of distance it takes to stop goes up a power of 2x for every 10mph you go up in speed. So going from 10mph to 20mph, your stopping distance goes up 4X!! 10mph to 30mph it goes up 9X!!! I don't think most people realize this.

Add ice to that and it may take a car a good 200 yards to come to stop on a highway going 50mph. A semi even further than 200 yards. So if visibility is down to 50 yards, half a football field, and you're going 50mph (slower than the speed limit), you still may not make it.

This is a scary video. Visibility is to the point where the guy brakes when he sees dark shadows of cars crashed ahead but ends up sliding past them. The semi that comes through seconds later would have destroyed that mini-van.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FhVGeIgLdlI

And this one. Hold on..


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w7vWVAs5XPU

[TRlaura]

Originally Posted by Retroit

Damn, that sent chills up my spine!

I know it seems ridiculous considering how rare these conditions are, but damn, anyone watching those helpless people slam into those semis would be easily convinced to pay for such an option on their new car.

Helpless people??? Really?? There was over a 1/4 mile of visibility. You can see that in the video. Those helpless people made a very stupid choice and put others lives in danger. Shame on them.

[2nd trick op]

Here's a link to a similar thread in the Automotive forum:

//www.city-data.com/forum/autom...like-such.html

[DTWflyer]

What typically happens in these types of massive pile-ups has less to do with plowing/salting and more to do with a complete loss of visibility and how drivers react.

This isn't just a Michigan thing; this happens in all place that are prone to squalls and sudden drops in visibility. I've seen these in MI, OH, PA, NY, and Ontario.

In fact I was on I-75 in Northern MI yesterday and driving through some of these.

What seems to happen is the following:

People are driving along at a somewhat reasonable speed based on conditions - 50/60 mph maybe in good visibility. They, all of the sudden hit a squall line with clouds/fog/snow and visibility goes to nothing. Some people slow down gradually, other slam on the brakes and go down to 5-10 mph. Now people behind come up on the no visibility and don't see whats ahead of them. All it takes in one minor rear-end collision and now they are stopped; then all of the sudden everyone behind them is running up on the blockage in no visibility and they have no chance. Then it snowballs from there.

Yes, some may be driving too fast for conditions. But it get scary when conditions change than fast. Blame who you want, but its mostly the drivers that cause this.

Granted, I-94 scares the heck out of me, and I hate driving that road just due to the volume of trucks, even in good conditions.

[pokuku]

Originally Posted by dragon_fly_12

The amount of salt being used on the roads is significantly less than what other states use and what Michigan used in the past. Look at the difference between Ohio and Michigan (I was on both yesterday). Ohio's highways were treated and in great shape, Michigan were blowing over, black ice and had build up forming. Also look at the secondary roads compared to highways. Heck, even the ramps are getting neglected.

Counties and MDOT crews are using less to treat the roads and only spreading on major intersections and bridges on the secondary roads. My Nixle alerts tell me that "Lansing is salting intersections and bridges" when I get maintenance alerts. It is not just my imagination that MI roads are going untreated or significantly less treated, and that is resulting in higher accident rates (and higher insurance rates).

Seconded. Have the same exact experience, as the highways are "magically" better maintained during conditions like these on the south side of the border. Come on, Michigan...if Ohio can do it, you sure can.

[westernwilly]

Originally Posted by animatedmartian

http://goo.gl/maps/NRveJ

Looks pretty rural to me. There's still a lot of wide open space that allows snow to drift onto the road no matter how much it's plowed. Widening it wouldn't make a difference in winter weather nor do you really need a whole lot of traffic for a pile up to occur.

The bottom line is people were driving too fast to be able to stop in time once an accident occurred.

It is 5 miles east of Kalamazoo and 5 miles west of Battle Creek. It happened around 9 am with heavy commuter traffic between the two cities. Most of the white collar workers for Kellogg's actually live in Kalamazoo and commute to Battle Creek every day. I travel this stretch of highway often and during the day it is usually bumper to bumper traffic.

[westernwilly]

Originally Posted by snoopygirlmi

Between Climax and Galesburg, it is pretty rural. Let's not pretend otherwise. I grew up in this area, so I know what I'm talking about. Just because a highway (or road) gets "heavy traffic" doesn't mean that it gets plowed (you see this a lot in Metro Detroit). That's just a fantasy because there are only so many snowplows to go around in Kalamazoo County and they can't be everywhere at once. And just because there's no snow on the road doesn't mean it's just wet on the road. Ice is a real hazard. Also, plowing doesn't mean that people are inherently safe from harm either. The weather conditions were just awful yesterday - regardless of how you look at it.

In the end, you really can't be 100% prepared for black ice or snow squalls.

Also, there's plenty of blame to go around for road funding problems. Beginning with Jen Granholm and all those stupid budget crises (that closed down the government) that diverted money from roads to balance the budget. That was a few years before the Tea Party really got started. Both Republicans and Dems have played these games with road funding, so let's not act like this magically started in 2009 with the Tea Party okay? It was going on way before then.

Hope that everyone is staying safe and warm.

I live in Kalamazoo and travel that stretch of road often. Further, years ago, I was a professional driver and would go up and down that stretch of highway several times a day. I can assure that unlike other areas of I-94, MDOT does a very good job of keeping this stretch of road plowed and salted. In my experience with several hours per day on this highway, MDOT has salt trucks constantly running back and forth between Kalamazoo and BC keeping this road clear.

The problem is that people were driving too fast the conditions. They were hurrying in their commute to work and thinking more about how the weather was making them late and less about safety.

PS.Yes, the Climax area is rural, but that stretch of highway is not treated like a rural stretch as it is only a few miles out of each city and the main artery between Kazoo and BC.

[linda814]

Originally Posted by 2nd trick op

Here's a link to a similar thread in the Automotive forum:

//www.city-data.com/forum/autom...like-such.html

Did you read that first post that starts the thread you posted? I would LOVE to see that person drive on this road when this is happening...he stops for nothing. Everyone goes to slow for him. It is rather comical....

[magellan]

They just reopened I-94 this morning. 193 cars total when most of the wreckage was cleared. I don't know that you can blame anyone. White outs sometimes come out of nowhere, like DTWFlyer mentioned, and they snowball.

I do think there is an attitude problem with some drivers, and I've seen and heard it expressed when it comes to winter driving: "C'mon people, this is Michigan, drive faster!!" I think these people need to chill out.

[linda814]

Wow..wonder how long that accident report will take to write.....and I agree Magellan....