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We see this kind all the time. Their owners generally think paying extra dough for more doors and space makes them somehow better than others, but that bigger vehicle won't go near the places, the longer wheelbase alone has them bottoming out in deep holes and rocking out at the top of hills and climbs. It's a farce.
I personally am a fan of four door vehicles, given the type of vehicle it is. I like the new four door wranglers, I don't own on, or a vehicle at all, outside a few bicycles. I'm sure it'll go where other larger suvs can go. I'm not saying it's better than a two door model, when honestly two or four, I don't like how big in general they've gotten- like a swollen Liberty. My point I was trying to stammer to was; I've seen more jeep(more like wrangler, maybe tudor xj) diehards complain about the two extra doors than those who own them act like wrangler gods. Think of them both as the last real jeep, cause if you've seen the last few Cherokee generations- it makes a damn good replacement. I don't see the 2014 cherokee making it out of a wet lawn, much less a repurposed mining trail.
It doesn't matter if you're on your favorite 4x4 trail, ski area, or hiking trail. There are just exponentially MORE people out there these days. This is new to America but not to the old world. France has had problems controlling crowds in the alps for decades. You are just noticing because outdoor recreation has become mainstream, instead of being done by a small minority of people like it was in the past.
In the US though, there are more people out in the woods because ATV's make it easier to carry the typical fat American heinie off the couch and onto the trail. Some quality outdoor experience there!
On the other hand my BIL has a broken foot that will not heal and he needs his four wheeler to tend to his wooded property. He has an arrangement with the local snowmobile group. They tend the trails and he uses them in the summer and sometimes in the winter.
I once was able to hike anywhere but age has taken its toll. It is even worse for my lady. Should we be denied the experience of the National Park back areas because of our physical disability? Think about it kids. With a bit of luck you will get old enough that your body will not do what you want it to. Why should we not be able to rent an electric four wheeler to take us around. Hell, we pay taxes too, ya know.
On the other hand my BIL has a broken foot that will not heal and he needs his four wheeler to tend to his wooded property. He has an arrangement with the local snowmobile group. They tend the trails and he uses them in the summer and sometimes in the winter.
I once was able to hike anywhere but age has taken its toll. It is even worse for my lady. Should we be denied the experience of the National Park back areas because of our physical disability? Think about it kids. With a bit of luck you will get old enough that your body will not do what you want it to. Why should we not be able to rent an electric four wheeler to take us around. Hell, we pay taxes too, ya know.
But there's a difference between that and playing Drunken ATV Warrior all over the desert.
It's like the gun control argument, I suppose. When used responsibly and kept on the trail, an ATV is not really that destructive. The problem is that it makes it too easy for lazy, destructive people to get deeper into the bush and do their thing, to the detriment of everyone else.
But there's a difference between that and playing Drunken ATV Warrior all over the desert.
It's like the gun control argument, I suppose. When used responsibly and kept on the trail, an ATV is not really that destructive. The problem is that it makes it too easy for lazy, destructive people to get deeper into the bush and do their thing, to the detriment of everyone else.
ATVs and ATVers are no different than Jeepers, motorcyclists, horseback riders, mountain bikers or hikers for that matter. There are good, responsible people in every group. And there are some that are "not so good". In regard to your case, did you have a MVUM (Motor Vehicle Use Map) for your area? Were you on a trail designated for full-size vehicles, and not ATVs or 50" max? We have issues with "Jeepers" on designated ATV trails from time to time. They are wider than the trail and tear things up, giving the FS an excuse to close the trail for everyone. Plus they tend to play in mudholes and churn up "mud bogs" from time to time. They also go extremely slowly, holding up other riders...and are so wide that ATVers must often back up till a wide spot is found to allow them to pass. In spite of that, at least they are getting out and enjoying the backcountry.
Our ATV club promotes responsible operation on designated trails and works actively with the FS to maintain trails and keep them open. We routinely pack out other people's garbage; I always carry a couple garbage bags on my quad. I find most of the trash and beer cans left on trails/roads open to full size vehicles, not quads or bikes. No saying who actually dumped it though. It's one thing I miss on my adventure bike-it's a lot more work to stop and pick up junk and harder to pack it out. Honestly, some of the worst messes I have found have been at horse camps. Other than the obvious (horse crap everywhere, trails a stinky mess) they left a lot of trash at campsites. Not necessarily indicitive of all horseback riders though.
All of which doesn't really matter. We need to work to keep the forests (and deserts) open to all responsible motorized user groups, prompote responsible operation and keep our "play areas" clean. Even those that take their stock, shiny new cars and want to drive around on "trails". Otherwise we all lose out. Far too many of those that complain about any form of motorized backcountry recreation never actually get off pavement and form their opinions from biased blogs or exagerated "news" reports.
Last edited by Toyman at Jewel Lake; 06-23-2014 at 03:26 PM..
ATVs and ATVers are no different than Jeepers, motorcyclists, horseback riders, mountain bikers or hikers for that matter. There are good, responsible people in every group. And there are some that are "not so good". In regard to your case, did you have a MVUM (Motor Vehicle Use Map) for your area? Were you on a trail designated for full-size vehicles, and not ATVs or 50" max? We have issues with "Jeepers" on designated ATV trails from time to time. They are wider than the trail and tear things up, giving the FS an excuse to close the trail for everyone. Plus they tend to play in mudholes and churn up "mud bogs" from time to time. They also go extremely slowly, holding up other riders...and are so wide that ATVers must often back up till a wide spot is found to allow them to pass. In spite of that, at least they are getting out and enjoying the backcountry.
Our ATV club promotes responsible operation on designated trails and works actively with the FS to maintain trails and keep them open. We routinely pack out other people's garbage; I always carry a couple garbage bags on my quad. I find most of the trash and beer cans left on trails/roads open to full size vehicles, not quads or bikes. No saying who actually dumped it though. It's one thing I miss on my adventure bike-it's a lot more work to stop and pick up junk and harder to pack it out. Honestly, some of the worst messes I have found have been at horse camps. Other than the obvious (horse crap everywhere, trails a stinky mess) they left a lot of trash at campsites. Not necessarily indicitive of all horseback riders though.
All of which doesn't really matter. We need to work to keep the forests (and deserts) open to all responsible motorized user groups, prompote responsible operation and keep our "play areas" clean. Even those that take their stock, shiny new cars and want to drive around on "trails". Otherwise we all lose out. Far too many of those that complain about any form of motorized backcountry recreation never actually get off pavement and form their opinions from biased blogs or exagerated "news" reports.
Kudos for making a club effort to be responsible ATVers.
There are no ATV only rules in this area; it's remote BLM land near Dugway that has only become popular to ATVers in the last 10 years or so. There are ATV only areas nearby (Little Sarah and 5 Mile Pass) but this is a different area (Simpson Springs).
Anyway, what made me mad about the whole thing were the trashed campsites and arrogant ATVers who acted like the trail (Spring Canyon) was theirs.
Kudos for making a club effort to be responsible ATVers.
There are no ATV only rules in this area; it's remote BLM land near Dugway that has only become popular to ATVers in the last 10 years or so. There are ATV only areas nearby (Little Sarah and 5 Mile Pass) but this is a different area (Simpson Springs).
Anyway, what made me mad about the whole thing were the trashed campsites and arrogant ATVers who acted like the trail (Spring Canyon) was theirs.
I'm sorry to see that you ran into a bad batch. Were there that many camping off their quads that were tearing up the campsites? I try to do a weekend or two camping from the quad every hear, and have a week long backcountry trip that will be nearly all dirt roads planned on the bike. Now if only the snow would get out of the high country!
The worst places (other than horse-crap camps) that we run into is any FS road good enough for some kids to take mommies Subaru. Usually lots of beer cans and trash left.
I ride dirtbikes offroad and in my opinion it seems like quads are the easiest and cheap way for beer bellied idiots to get out and have some fun. Ive seen the destruction on many of our trails. They get stuck then dig holes trying to get freed..
I cant say they theyre the only ones littering. Thats definitely a mentality issue..
It could be an age thing. Younger people tend to not care about others and the land. (Not always though)
Realize that things change. You havent been to that area in years. Sounds like they have taken it over as an atv area..
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