Any septic experts here? (Derry, Candia: sale, how much, house)
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I'm trying to purchase an antique house which currently has a cesspool (rock lined well, no tank) style septic system which was more common decades ago but not so much now with stricter EPA guidelines and what not. At the time of inspection the well level was at the top and there was seepage from overflow in the surrounding soil. My inspector gave the system a failing grade because of the seepage.
The seller admittedly not pumped the system for a number of years but just had it pumped and is now getting a second inspection done. My guess is that it may pass this time since the level will be lower and the surrounding soil is likely to have dried up.
I have no intention of getting nasty about the whole thing although I suppose that we could get a third opinion on the system from the State of NH in order to settle things once and for all. Chances are that I would walk away from the deal before getting to that point anyway, I just don't need the hassle and since cesspool septic systems while legal under some circumstances, appear to be of dubious acceptance in this day and age I don't want to take on a large potential liability like that.
I am wondering if anyone had any comments or ideas on this situation and how they might choose to handle it if they were in my shoes. Thanks in advance.
similar sort of question:
suppose a septic tank is just fine, but the field has failed... what is involved in putting in a new leach field?
the bad field may have contaminated the well, how expensive is it to treat the well and see if it can be recovered... vs digging a new well? The bank has already knocked $20k off the price because of the septic situation, my agent feels its much less in this area to replace just the field (more like $6k) since her boss just had it done.
Yes, I would get a written estimate on replacing the entire system and use that as a factor in negotiations. The seller won't want to hear it, but the reality is that any smart buyer (and there are only so many in this market) is going to do the same thing. I was told a new septic system could be 30k so I wouldn't take any chances, and I don't think getting a third opinion is "nasty" in any way. It's not personal.
Wanna, similar thing: I would get a written estimate on replacing the leach field and to confirm that the system itself is in good condition. It may sound cynical, but you don't know your agent's boss's situation, so the cost to replace your field might be totally different than the cost to replace his field, and the septic system people don't have any vested interest in seeing the sale go through, unlike your realtor (not casting aspersions on him/her, just pointing out that it's always wise to get estimates from a disinterested third party.)
Our well was contaminated when we moved in (from groundwater, not the septic.) It wouldn't have cost much to treat it with chlorine and re-sealed any cracks around the perimeter, but we were told that the reason we had contamination in the first place was that it was so shallow. It was the original dug well which didn't go below the bedrock. New wells go much deeper and are much less likely to get contaminated with ecoli, etc. I think you said you said you were looking at an antique house, so you might want to check the well out as well to see if it's an older dug well. Ultimately, we had a new well drilled and this cost a fortune and was a big pain. (We knew we would replace it going in so we had factored it into the price.) All of our neighbors have also drilled new wells or given up on drinking their water as the dug wells either keep getting contaminated (not just bacteria, but chloride from salt run-off, etc) or don't supply enough water over time.
Wanna, similar thing: I would get a written estimate on replacing the leach field and to confirm that the system itself is in good condition. It may sound cynical, but you don't know your agent's boss's situation, so the cost to replace your field might be totally different than the cost to replace his field, and the septic system people don't have any vested interest in seeing the sale go through, unlike your realtor (not casting aspersions on him/her, just pointing out that it's always wise to get estimates from a disinterested third party.)
I understand. There are a number of variables in this situation.
Quote:
Our well was contaminated when we moved in (from groundwater, not the septic.) It wouldn't have cost much to treat it with chlorine and re-sealed any cracks around the perimeter, but we were told that the reason we had contamination in the first place was that it was so shallow. It was the original dug well which didn't go below the bedrock. New wells go much deeper and are much less likely to get contaminated with ecoli, etc. I think you said you said you were looking at an antique house, so you might want to check the well out as well to see if it's an older dug well.
that's one of the variables. We've seen a water report that was done last march. there's no ecoli - but there is coliform, and so much particulate that it sounds like you could cut it! We do need to find out where the well is (pretty darn sure it's too close to the septic), and how deep it is. But we can't go about doing all that stuff without a contract to hold it for inspecting. So.... Oh: there was also a septic inspection done last March. The tank came out fine, but there was pooling in the leach field (though things were snow covered) which is why it failed. It's also been vacant for a while now.
yeah, it's an old farm: built in 1750! BTW, when you say it 'wouldn't cost much' to bleach it and seal it, mind if I ask how much 'not much' was in your case?
I love old farms - a pre-Revolutionary farm must be amazing!
I didn't get a quote on treating the water and sealing the cracks because the company was pretty up-front that they wouldn't expect that to work long-term. We also had chloride from salt run-off which chlorine wouldn't have helped. We could have done that AND installed a filter, but I figured as long as we lowered our offer accordingly, we'd be better off just having a new well with clean water. The seller had had the water tested already and specified on the sheet that the well was the original dug well and that the water wasn't potable. (We had coliform too - ick.)
What I did was call a well-drilling co. to describe the situation and ask for their recommendation (new well vs. treatment) and get a ballpark on drilling a new well. They obviously have an incentive to tell you you'll need a new well, but most people I've met (in our neighborhood, at least, which is near a parking lot) has had to drill new, deeper wells so this seems to be true. Then we had a worst-case scenario going into negotiations.
The price to drill a new well is by the foot so they won't be able to tell you an exact price, just a range. Then, if there isn't enough pressure, they may need to hydrofrack (sp?) which costs extra. If you have arsenic or radon, you'll have to pay to filter it out. You may need to pay for a water softener. A local driller can tell you what the problems in your area tend to be and give you a guess based on that.
Do you know whether your well is artisan or dug? I would find out, then call a few local drilling co.s, explain that you're looking at a property with X type of well that's been contaminated with X or Y (because the treatment for coliform is different than for something like chloride, you want to know everything) and ask what they think. They probably install filters and treat water too so they should be able to give you a good idea of what will work. Then factor that into your offer. Or, just assume the worst and subtract 12k from your offer, and do a dance for joy if you move in and end up not needing a new well!
"my agent feels its much less in this area to replace just the field (more like $6k) since her boss just had it done."
I'd like to get the name of the installer. in 2003, my neighbor in Derry had to put in a new leachfield, unfortunately her property contained a lot of ledge rock, so the field had to be put ON TOP of the existing ground - even without the digging - it cost $15K.....just the leachbed, not the tank.
There is lots of good advice here. I was in a similar situation about ten years ago when I bought a 200+ year old house. I got an estimate for a new septic, which was around $8,000 back then. The seller gave the cash back at closing and I got a new septic system installed. By the sound of things, you really do want to have a new system installed. Even if the system does function after it has been pumped out, Murphy's Law dictate that it will fail next winter when there is four feet of frost in the ground. You will want to make sure that you have an area to install a new system. How big is the property? Are there wetlands on the property? You may want to have a septic design done before closing if it is questionable whether of not you can meet State standards.
part of the problem I'm having with this farmhouse, is that we don't know anything about the well other than the bad report. We don't know where it is, how deep it is, I'm assuming it's dug (but I could be wrong). And the only way to find out any of this stuff is to put a contract on the house so we can investigate - without someone buying it out from under us!
My agent tells me that there are a lot of people in the immediate Monadnock area with lots of equipment for digging these fields, mostly just waiting around for some work to do - hence the 'rock bottom' price - then we just need someone to hook it up for us. Since she lives in town, and not terribly far from the farm, she said she could make sure we choose a reputable company and she can pop over to make sure the work is really being done (since from down here.. we're a little handicapped).
We don't have to deal with the well problem immediately since we're not moving permanently for another 4 years - just the occasional visit 3 or 4 times a year. We can make do with jugs of water - but we need to be able to flush!!
It's an otherwise really cool farmhouse. And since they're only asking $150k for it.... on 7 acres...... we'll see if the inspection turns up anything else that would break the deal. I hope not.
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- then we just need someone to hook it up for us. Since she lives in town, and not terribly far from the farm, she said she could make sure we choose a reputable company and she can pop over to make sure the work is really being done (since from down here.. we're a little handicapped).
