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I'm a strong believer that nobody should be able to control access to the shoreline.
I agree, except for maybe small beaches and waterfront homes that maintain small patches of beach/shoreline. But if NJ allows this arrangement, I don’t see what’s specific about Ocean Grove except for the religious aspect.
I’m not an authority on this, but isn’t it generally considered that the beach is public, but the issue at hand with both Jenkinson’s and Ocean Grove is that they control the gates which provide access from the boardwalks, and by them closing the gates is what prevents the access?
Like, if you wanted, you could walk along the beach from Asbury Park or Bradley Beach and cross over into Ocean Grove, and I don’t think they will stop you. They don’t have barricades on the beach, right? I have never been to Ocean Grove, so I don’t know for sure.
I’m not an authority on this, but isn’t it generally considered that the beach is public, but the issue at hand with both Jenkinson’s and Ocean Grove is that they control the gates which provide access from the boardwalks, and by them closing the gates is what prevents the access?
Like, if you wanted, you could walk along the beach from Asbury Park or Bradley Beach and cross over into Ocean Grove, and I don’t think they will stop you. They don’t have barricades on the beach, right? I have never been to Ocean Grove, so I don’t know for sure.
Yeah, I'm pretty sure that's right, something about a high-tide mark. But obviously by putting up a gate, it effectively has the same impact. I've been to the beach in Ocean Grove a handful of times, I don't recall physical barricades blocking it from Bradley or Asbury beaches, but can't say I've ever specifically looked for them. Ocean Grove does close the gate on the walkway to Asbury Park at like midnight, which was put up in the 90's over fear of crime spillover.
Ocean Grove should just remove their private owned boardwalk and remove access to the public from the beach. Many towns through NJ don't have access, and they should do the same. People should thank these people for building a town where the public can use their property.
Last edited by DannyHobkins; 09-18-2023 at 01:44 PM..
It's silly to say it's an attack on Christians. Very few people are interested in attacking Christians for the sake of attacking Christians. I'm the moderator on the R&S forum here, though, so I know that's a popular claim by some, not all, Christians, that they are being "attacked", even when it's as simple as someone disagreeing with their opinions or beliefs.
I grew up in a fundamentalist (meaning Bible literalist) church as a child, and the mentality is put forth that non-believers are out to persecute and attack them, which may have been a reality at other times and places in history, but here where it's the majority religion that enjoys a great deal of influence on government and society and in fact has done most of the persecuting of other faiths, it's hardly a valid claim.
It's the threat of losing that sense of power that makes them feel attacked, I think.
I think silly arguments like "It's an attack on Christianity!" are best kept out of the situation and the focus put on more logical facets of the argument.
I myself am ambiguous about this. We went to Ocean Grove for a week on vacation when I was a child, renting a house, and it was a lot of fun. The no-driving-on-Sundays rule was in effect, and while it was different, it is also historically part of what gave the town its character because of its religious roots, and there is some value in respecting those roots and not turning everything into a cookie cutter sameness. It's hardly the only beach on the Jersey shore to choose from.
On the other hand, what on earth does being on the beach really have to do with the Christian faith? Is it not part of Creation to be enjoyed?
Christians are the most persecuted group of people in the world. An extreme minority is pursuing the cause to attack Christians. This is a First Amendment and Fifth Amendment violation to these people. If this ever made it to the Supreme Court, it would be a slam dunk case.
Smack you head, but Google it. Its a 100% fact that Christians are the most persecuted group of people in the world. You're living in privilege that you are in the most Christian country in the world.
Ensuring a town complies with state law regarding public access to beaches is "persecution?"
Wow, to live inside some of these folks' heads for a day. LOL.
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