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Don’t know the best place to ask this, so I’m gonna try here. (Open to suggestions for a better forum)
I pay rent for my rent stabilized nyc apartment via the mail. My management company doesn’t have an online payment system unfortunately. Just want to make the distinction that it is not a housing connect apartment, it requires annual certification but is still rent stabilized at $1,315. In January 2023, I mailed the rent check and it was deposited. Fast forward to year later I get a rental arrears letter. That I didn’t pay for December. I knew this was false because in November. I payed two months of rent because I would be going away and didn’t want to worry about mailing it. So I get on the phone with management and they said that it was originally January 2023 payment that was never received, mind you we’re in 2024 now, why wasn’t I notified that this wasn’t recieved then.
I looked up a copy of the check on my chase app and someone signed for it. I sent the evidence of the check. They told me that I was likely a forgery because they use stamps to deposit into an account.
I filed a claim with chase whom said they would recuperate my money in like 60-90 days.
Then chase mails me a letter stating that since it’s been so long (January 2023). They won’t get the money back for me.
Wtf, now I gotta pay an extra month of rent because someone committed fraud.
It was more likely that it was someone from the USPS that stole the check and committed the fraud.
Don’t know the best place to ask this, so I’m gonna try here. (Open to suggestions for a better forum)
I pay rent for my rent stabilized nyc apartment via the mail. My management company doesn’t have an online payment system unfortunately. Just want to make the distinction that it is not a housing connect apartment, it requires annual certification but is still rent stabilized at $1,315. In January 2023, I mailed the rent check and it was deposited. Fast forward to year later I get a rental arrears letter. That I didn’t pay for December. I knew this was false because in November. I payed two months of rent because I would be going away and didn’t want to worry about mailing it. So I get on the phone with management and they said that it was originally January 2023 payment that was never received, mind you we’re in 2024 now, why wasn’t I notified that this wasn’t recieved then.
I looked up a copy of the check on my chase app and someone signed for it. I sent the evidence of the check. They told me that I was likely a forgery because they use stamps to deposit into an account.
I filed a claim with chase whom said they would recuperate my money in like 60-90 days.
Then chase mails me a letter stating that since it’s been so long (January 2023). They won’t get the money back for me.
Wtf, now I gotta pay an extra month of rent because someone committed fraud.
It was more likely that it was someone from the USPS that stole the check and committed the fraud.
Any help on what to do?
A. Check washing/fraud has been on upswing for a decade or so with ever rising amounts of mail stolen from USPS. So much so postal service has been removing letter boxes and making other decisions.
B. You have been a victim of fraud. You need to contact your bank, close current account and open a new checking account. Someone out there has your checking account number and other information. They can easily do what they've done already again. You may also wish to file a police report.
C. Yes, you do owe missed rent payment. It simply is what it is; LL did not receive funds and your lease makes you responsible for payment of rent. Only possible way to get around this is for you to take legal action against LL and or wait for them to sue you over missed rent. Even then law is on LL's side, though perhaps a lenient judge *might* take issue with fact they waiting a year or so before reporting error.
D. LL simply took each current payment sent in and applied it towards back rent, which is legal.
You should have been receiving rent statements/bills each month noting payment due. Didn't they say (or you notice) that account was one month in arrears?
E. Far as your bank goes they may be perfectly within rights to say "you're on your own". Terms of use agreement given to you when account was opened clearly spells out procedures in case of fraudulent activity. Generally account holders have between 30 to 60 days to report fraud including forged checks and other unauthorized withdrawals.
Is paying rent through online bill pay with your bank safer than dropping a handwritten check in the mailbox? Might be worth doing that in the future to avoid check theft happening again. Plus, scheduling automatically to send each month makes for one less thing to remember.
Is paying rent through online bill pay with your bank safer than dropping a handwritten check in the mailbox? Might be worth doing that in the future to avoid check theft happening again. Plus, scheduling automatically to send each month makes for one less thing to remember.
Online bill isn't always trouble free.
If bank in question is merely cutting a check and sending it via snail mail to recipient, that's no different than doing same thing oneself. Worse if payee (for purposes of this discussion a landlord) does not receive said check tenant is still on hook for missed payment and or any late fees.
Most banks have restrictions on when a search for missing online payment can begin. Nor do many allow "stop payment" orders on said checks. If something goes down an account holder may be stuck making a second payment until missing one turns up, or investigation pans out.
Large companies usually have established accounts with various bank's online payment systems. Con Edison, Time Warner, Verizon and other similar companies likely do have accounts with most NY banks. When payments are made via online bill pay it's just a matter of debiting one account and crediting another.
Con Ed for example would receive a lump sum transfer credited to it's main account. Bank in question also sends names of persons who made transaction, their account number, amount paid and other information.
Again where a person or company does not have such a listing with a bank all it does is write and mail a check.
Landlord online rent portals can work out well. However not all LLs offer that service for free; instead tenants must pay a fee. This is one reason why even when such a service is offered tenants still send payments via mail.
This is not much help but perhaps it's where you are depositing your mail. Can you bring it to a post office and drop it in the mail drop inside? Or instead of a check, use a money order. These have built in protection for fraud and are often free or a couple of dollars.
I think the landlord is at fault here. If a rent check went missing, why wasn't the OP told within a couple of weeks, at the latest?
I know that if I missed a rent payment, the very next month I would get a bill for two months, PLUS a late fee, or even an eviction notice. I don't see why the OP should suffer out of pocket because the landlord screwed up.
Have you asked your landlord why the delay was so long? You shouldn't have to pay an additional month's rent because of the landlord's negligence.
If you don't get satisfaction from your landlord, maybe start by contacting your local city councilperson for help. Best of luck!
Sorry to hear you're going through this! I agree with 7Continents, it might be worth it to bring it to the post office and drop it in the slot. My mother had a similar incident. She pays her rent via money order and someone got her envelope that was dropped in a corner usps mailbox, changed the name and deposited her rent check back in October. Found this out in January after questioning the management office about arrears that showed up on the rent bill for November and December. Did a trace via western union and got a copy of the cashed money order with the perp's name on it. Filed a claim with Western Union and they said it can take up to 120 days to get the money back smh I now take her rent envelopes to the post office to mail! The mailboxes on the street have these rollers where the edge of letters can get stuck so if you don't make sure the letter drops in the box, some bad actors can pull the letter back out, open it and steal the money order or check. I also agree with macnyc2003, the landlord should have added the arrears to the following month's rent bill right away if the payment was missed. They did that with my mom, we just ignored it in November and December, but when it showed up again in January, we investigated. I hope things work out for you!
I think the landlord is at fault here. If a rent check went missing, why wasn't the OP told within a couple of weeks, at the latest?
I know that if I missed a rent payment, the very next month I would get a bill for two months, PLUS a late fee, or even an eviction notice. I don't see why the OP should suffer out of pocket because the landlord screwed up.
Have you asked your landlord why the delay was so long? You shouldn't have to pay an additional month's rent because of the landlord's negligence.
If you don't get satisfaction from your landlord, maybe start by contacting your local city councilperson for help. Best of luck!
OP doesn't address if his/her monthly statements did or did not reflect balance owing.
Reading over OP again things happened apparently as one stated.
January 2023 rent payment was not received (stolen/fraud)
Tenant paid February through October 2023 rent on time but for some reason did not notice rent invoices had past month rent due.
Tenant paid two months rent in November 2023 which he/she believed was covering that month and December 2023, but in reality since was always one month in arrears (missing January 2023 rent) this merely brought account current.
OP believed he/she had a cushion of one month rent paid in advance, when in reality that advance month payment only replaced missing January 2023 missing rent.
Only way LL could be remotely held responsible (and it would take a court ruling to sort it out) is if monthly rent invoices from February 2023 onwards did not reflect any arrears. If they did and tenant did not question or whatever, that's it then. LL did what he was supposed to do.
As have said many RS tenants (more than many would imagine) take advantage of system in that they know there is nothing a LL can do about late rent payments until things go beyond about 40 days.
Rent is due on first or whatever day, but plenty of RS tenants pay it whenever they GD are ready or have the money. Thus it isn't unusual or unheard of for RS tenant to pay say March 2024 rent in say first week of April of same year. Unless another payment is made in April that tenant's account is will always be in arrears and remain so until caught up.
Sorry to hear you're going through this! I agree with 7Continents, it might be worth it to bring it to the post office and drop it in the slot. My mother had a similar incident. She pays her rent via money order and someone got her envelope that was dropped in a corner usps mailbox, changed the name and deposited her rent check back in October. Found this out in January after questioning the management office about arrears that showed up on the rent bill for November and December. Did a trace via western union and got a copy of the cashed money order with the perp's name on it. Filed a claim with Western Union and they said it can take up to 120 days to get the money back smh I now take her rent envelopes to the post office to mail! The mailboxes on the street have these rollers where the edge of letters can get stuck so if you don't make sure the letter drops in the box, some bad actors can pull the letter back out, open it and steal the money order or check. I also agree with macnyc2003, the landlord should have added the arrears to the following month's rent bill right away if the payment was missed. They did that with my mom, we just ignored it in November and December, but when it showed up again in January, we investigated. I hope things work out for you!
USPS charges a fee (IIRC $10 to $20) to launch a search for a money order reported lost or stolen. Many other places that issue money orders do same.
If trace of money order reported lost or stolen comes back with instrument not cashed, replacement or refund is more straightforward. However if trace comes back money order was cashed then like OP's situation it turns into fraud which is another kettle of fish. Usually issuer or money order will want to conduct an investigation to satisfy themselves someone isn't trying to run game.
As for rest of it did a thread about mail theft in main forum. USPS has been telling people for many years now to stop mailing checks, money orders and cash (yes, some people still mail actual money).
Post office in our part of UES has removed all mail drop boxes from in front. You have to take mail inside during business hours or when lobby is open.
Have know people who mailed things from those new supposed secure drop boxes, and yet mail was still stolen.
I think the landlord is at fault here. If a rent check went missing, why wasn't the OP told within a couple of weeks, at the latest?
I know that if I missed a rent payment, the very next month I would get a bill for two months, PLUS a late fee, or even an eviction notice. I don't see why the OP should suffer out of pocket because the landlord screwed up.
Have you asked your landlord why the delay was so long? You shouldn't have to pay an additional month's rent because of the landlord's negligence.
If you don't get satisfaction from your landlord, maybe start by contacting your local city councilperson for help. Best of luck!
We do not know if LL sent OP invoices listing arrears amount.
All OP states is LL sent them an "arrears" letter. That could be anything up to including notice that if back rent isn't paid by "X" date LL will commence non-payment proceedings (three day notice).
Again as have said if tenant continued to pay rent (which apparently he/she did) and LL provided correct and accurate invoices then it would have been up to latter to query why January 2023 rent was not applied.
Strictly speaking OP is victim of a crime (fraud and theft), not the LL.
For record landlords in NYS generally can go back one year (or in some cases more) to sue for unpaid rent.
In order to bring legal action however a LL must first send notice demanding payment of sums owed to debtor. Debtor then can either affirm or dispute sums owed in whole or part.
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