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He recently moved here from Philadelphia...aka "Killadelphia," which now has the highest murder rate of any big American city, with at least one shooting per day.
One of the reasons things are so outta control there is due to lax enforcement of gun laws/purchases. According to a news special I just saw the other night, it is as easy to buy a gun there as a pack of gum.
So some people who used to settle disputes with fists or even knives can and will kill someone over a minor thing without even thinking about it.
One kid was riding his bike, and a driver behind him thought he was going too slow. Shot him. Other relatively "trivial" one on one disputes are often handled the same way, with little thought to the real danger to innnocent bystanders, including kids. Funerals for family members, including youths and children, are commonplace there. And the "no snitching" culture is very prevalent. Many victims and their families are too scared to talk to the police about what they know. They need more police protection there, just for starters, and much stricter enforcement on gun purchases, which are currently a total joke.
The governor refuses to cooperate with the idea of making Philly a special case in terms of strict gun enforcement vs. the lower crime-ridden areas across the state.
There's your argument for gun control in a nutshell. In NYC it doesn't play well. Thus the very strict gun control laws here. Sure there are plenty of illegal guns, but I'd daresay not nearly as bad as in Philly nowadays. When in NY, do as the NY'ers do, and get rid of the guns. Spend the money you got selling them to get some good solid locks, maybe an alarm system, etc. If you can afford it, move to a relatively safe area.
Kids get their hands on parents' guns, sometimes take em to school, etc. Someone thinks a burglar is in the house, it's dark, they're scared, they react instinctively, and their own kid could get killed. It's no joke, and neither is prison time. Unless you're a thug or a cop, there's no "valid" reason to be packing heat in NYC. Most of the gun crime is either the result of one of these street disputes, or a husband/b/f killing his girlfriend in a jealous rage, holding her and the kids hostage before killing them and himself, etc.
Don't hang in bad areas late at night, and you should not need a gun here!!!!!!
Compared to other countries with strict gun control (london, france, canada, etc) there is a huuuuuge disparity in gun deaths and crime when compared to the US. We are gun happy. If you live in NYC, just fly down to the the carolinas to get a piece, or virginia. The difference in those other contries, is that NO ONE is allowed to have a gun. there is no area in london where you can carry or own easily like there is in the states. No source for guns = no gun crime.
Yet, there are still gun crimes and deaths from gunshots in London.
Yes, but with gun control (if enforced) there is less of a chance they will find one--and if they use one or even own one, they can find themselves in a heap 'o' trouble.
You're right, it's not. I'm just pointing out that if someone wants a gun and has bad intentions, they will find one.
you're correct. the point is with very strict gun control, it makes it alot more difficult than going into Daddy's nightstand and using it on the kid that looked at you funny.
As far as london/UK goes, the murder rate there due to guns, number in the dozens while ours are in the several hundreds. And of those dozens in UK, a very high percentage is due to the jamaican drug trade that started running wild back in 2000. Many of the jamaicans are illegals and have no problem shooting anyone. (think of NYC back in 85). Luckilly for the police, alot of the shootings are gang on gang.
To answer a question brought up by Alan, pertaining to one's mental health history prior to issuing a Pistol License...
Before a license for a pistol is issued in N.Y., an applicant has to complete a release of Mental Health history information in addition to the application for a license. A criminal background check is done on the Federal level (FBI) and the State level through N.Y. Div. of Criminal Justice Services. If an applicant has a history of mental health issues, or even a member of their household, the license may be denied. As I previously discussed, you have to complete a form releasing to the issuing agency, any mental health information.
Outside of N.Y., prior to one purchasing a handgun or shotgun/rifle, if one does not need a license to possess these firearms, a criminal backround check through the FBI and the respective State's criminal history files is done. A mental health history depends on the State statutes. If a person has a license to Carry, like most states in the U.S. have, these checks are done prior to issuing the license.
The NRA has no issues with a mental health check. But advocates for the disabled have had issues with municipalities and others, from obtaining medical information for a person for fear of the person being denied a service because of that record. This has complicated initiatives to include mental and medical history checks at the Federal level.
I don't know why there is such resistance to people owning guns. Law-abiding people and those with Carry licenses are not a problem. America may be ahead of other Countries for gun related crimes, it is by no means ahead of other Countries for crimes in general. Including murder and homicide. What this means is that if criminals can't use a gun to commit murder, they will use other means. In the end a person is still dead.
By the way, America is one of the "first-world" Countries that has the lowest rate of "hot" burglaries. That is when the occupants are home while the crime is committed. This type of crime is very typical in Europe.
As far as Elvira's post about Philly, are the people who are randomly shooting bikers riding too slow in possession of a Pennsylvania License to Carry?? How many people in any of the 40 States (some of which are more populated than N.Y.) that issue Licenses to Carry firearms committing crimes with guns? Even if N.Y.C. changed it's procedures and issued Full Carry Pistol licenses to average people, instead of like they do now where they only issue to connected and wealthy persons, you would not have Licensees running around shooting each other. Do you have any idea how many people in the State of N.Y. are licensed to Carry handguns? And are not acting irresponsibly with weapons.
You can advocate banning guns. That's fine. But, if people want them they are going to get them. Look at narcotics. Most of which isn't even produced in this Country. And they are illegal in every State in the Union. Yet they are everywhere. And think of the gun violence associated with there sale and use. The decline of families and neighborhoods where addicts proliferate and the violence. Yet I see college students at "Ban Guns" rallies smoking pot and taking drugs. Every hit they take on a joint is only adding to the overall violence in this Country because they create a market for that crap by consuming it. I'd say it is a bit hypocritical, don't you think?
Last edited by AnAverageAmerican; 11-27-2007 at 02:23 AM..
First, a hand gun is not the ideal weapon for home defense (in NYC, or anywhere else).
Unless you practice a lot, you will probably miss. Also, with a med to large cal,
when you miss, the chances are high, that the slug will pass thru an interior wall, possibly striking someone in another room. The slug could also pass thru your target and strike someone else.
The best weapon for home defense is a 12ga shot gun. Good chance of hitting your target, low chance of penetrating walls etc. Not as deadly (this, I think, positive point could be an entirely different debate). The sound of you racking the slide, should be enough to send any sane person running. The shortest legal barrel is 18 in, a lot of models have an optional (legal) pistol grip.
Anyone with a clean record can legally purchase and own a shot gun (or other rifle) while residing in NYC. Any sporting goods store that sells firearms would be more than happy to help you. It would be a good idea to get a hunting license (weather you plan on hunting or not) and take the required safety course. The clerk at the store can help you with the details.
I spent the first 42 years of my life in NYC (born in Manhattan, raised in The Bronx), and owned a shot gun for the last ten. When I first moved "upstate" I was surprised to see folks driving around with rifles on racks in their trucks. Now I don't even notice.
I had to use a shot gun once, (upstate), a pack of coyotes was trying to catch and eat one of my pets.
I now have a "full carry pistol " permit (not good in NYC). I never carry, just thought I would get it while I still could.
my dad had a 44cal 1864 colt hanging on a wall for 40 yrs and NYPD came in at his passing last june and took what was left to me in his will ....It was not registerd and i may never see it. Since it was left to me in NJ and was made prior to 1887 all I need is the will and I can take it home no permit needed but to get it out of NY no dice ....any one know of a way out for me on this ?????
I've read that there's about 3,000+, not including those use the weapon because of their job, registered handguns/permits in NYC. That's out of a city of 8 million and change. Plenty more in the hands of violent criminals I'm sure.
theres alot of un-truths through out this thread.
there are almost 40,000 permits issued in nyc.. contrary to what everyone is posting its easy to get a permit in nyc, anyone with a clean record gets one.
what you cant get is a full carry permit, thats next to impossible.
the rest of nyc gets a modified residence permit. you can leave the residence with it locked in a box and un-loaded to go to the range or a field to hunt. you can keep it loaded at home.
last i was aware of collectables which were made prior to a certain year , which im not sure of the year can be owned as long as you dont own the ammo for it. once you buy the powder and balls for a muzzle loader you need a permit. this may have changed so dont quote me on this one but its worth looking up.
you need a permit for handguns and a seperate permit for rifles and shotguns. you can own a rifle or shot gun without a permit as long as its not brought in the city limits. if you leave it with a relative in long island as an example your okay. but thats not true of handguns.
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re: guns in England
