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Old 08-14-2017, 06:00 AM
 
3,570 posts, read 3,757,388 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pierrepont7731 View Post
Wouldn't know what the amount is per month, but am here to tell you, it's *taxpayer money* that's paying for it, so *any* amount is too much. If you want to call that pocket change, they should be able to have it without it coming from taxpayers' pockets. Until they can do that, it isn't pocket change.
People who work full time jobs qualify for Food stamps. You should be asking those employers why they aren't paying a living wage and why their businesses are being propped up by the government teet.
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Old 08-14-2017, 06:07 AM
 
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Originally Posted by whirledpeas0 View Post
I have a friend who once received over $600 per month in food stamps. She wasn't scamming the system. She was unemployed with 4 children under 4 and her husband left her high and dry. I once overheard two women in a grocery store criticizing a woman who didn't properly space out her children to receive TANF benefits. They appeared to have a system down to optimize these benefits. If there is "free money" involved, there is going to be some level of fraud, waste, and abuse involved. Whether this free money comes in the form of cash assistance, government contracts, or "creative tax planning". People abuse programs like SNAP and TANF but I don't think it is as rampant as those who peddle the idea of a "welfare queen" think it happens.
Ding ding. The legend is far bigger than the reality. Most people are on the dole for under two years, and many people who are on it, work full time jobs. Certain social indoctrination and propaganda has expertly got middle class people programmed with the politics of resentment. Don't get mad at the people who are privatizing profit and socializing debt, get mad at people who have less than themselves, people who have ZERO power. Why aren't they angry at the big corps who aren't paying a living wage? Why aren't they mad at the people who played the mortgage market like a casino, profited while the middle class lost their homes? Look deeper my friends, not at the superficial. Who really is the winner in these scenarios. It's not the poor people on the dole. And for those who would cite people on life-long doles, let's talk about mental health. We are a product of our environment and upbringing. You don't have to have bonafide schizophrenia or a personality disorder to have mental problems. When people are programmed a certain way because of lifestyles imposed upon them at birth, changing mindset, changing reality is a very difficult battle. Most people just do the best they can, with the tools they have been given. Some of us are born with tools that work better for us than others. For those who climb out of abject poverty, they are exceptional. It's not easy. We are a product of our parenting, and we parent often as we were parenting. This cycle is deeper than just "get a job." But for any of you to understand that, you'd have to be a scholar of psychology.
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Old 08-14-2017, 06:11 AM
 
3,570 posts, read 3,757,388 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WithDisp View Post
I think part of that 'problem' is benefit recipients not recognizing how much value what they're getting is worth.

Annual Heath Insurance with no to low deductible - $7500
Lottery Apt or Project Housing - $15-20,000 a year benefit.
SNAP for 2 $4000
HEAP benefits - $400
Lifeline Phone Benefits - $300

On some ends that's $27500 in public assistance.

That's closing in on the Median Annual Income for working people in the United States- $32,140.

The poor seem to consider their own struggle, but not that of the 'middle class' who have an income that disqualifies them from the $27,500 in public assistance, rendering them in a worse situation than the poor.
Actually, I think the problem is the government not recognizing that and scaling it. People who make $28,000 a year shouldn't suddenly not qualify for anything. I have a friend who has MS and really needs his government healthcare. But as a person who always worked freelance, he cannot risk going above the threshold because losing benefits could mean an early death. All benefits should be scaled and in my opinion, be benchmarked on the same benefits that the US miltiary thinks is what it cost to live in a municipality. Last I checked, they think an E-2 needs at least $2500 for basic housing in NY per month. (Not including salary.)
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Old 08-14-2017, 01:52 PM
 
3,951 posts, read 5,074,907 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roseba View Post
Actually, I think the problem is the government not recognizing that and scaling it. People who make $28,000 a year shouldn't suddenly not qualify for anything. I have a friend who has MS and really needs his government healthcare. But as a person who always worked freelance, he cannot risk going above the threshold because losing benefits could mean an early death. All benefits should be scaled and in my opinion, be benchmarked on the same benefits that the US miltiary thinks is what it cost to live in a municipality. Last I checked, they think an E-2 needs at least $2500 for basic housing in NY per month. (Not including salary.)
You are on point with a huge issues which I completely agree with.

ONLY the US Military Recognizes the actual cost of living in an area.
They don't give any cost differential to postal employees.
... and a meager one to Federal Employees.

They cut people off at a certain dollar sign, which screws them completely.

The management system is inept and ultimately picks winners and losers.

UBI - Universal Basic Income, could address a lot of these issues, but the numbers would have to be federal- meaning the choice to live in NYC means a lower quality lifestyle. Since housing would decimate your budget.

Addendum : This wasn't such an issue until the 1980-2000 when housing in some cities became so out of whack with the average.

Last edited by WithDisp; 08-14-2017 at 02:12 PM..
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Old 08-14-2017, 02:12 PM
 
3,570 posts, read 3,757,388 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WithDisp View Post
You are on point with a huge issues which I completely agree with.

ONLY the US Military Recognizes the actual cost of living in an area.
They don't give any cost differential to postal employees.
... and a meager one to Federal Employees.

They cut people off at a certain dollar sign, which screws them completely.

The management system is inept and ultimately picks winners and losers.

UBI - Universal Basic Income, could address a lot of these issues, but the numbers would have to be federal- meaning the choice to live in NYC means a lower quality lifestyle. Since housing would decimate your budget.

Addendum : This wasn't such an issue until the 1980-2000 when housing in some cities became so out of whack with the average.
Why does a UBI have to be federal? We do pay state and local taxes too. And more blue money funnels into red states, but that is another debate.
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Old 08-14-2017, 04:25 PM
 
3,951 posts, read 5,074,907 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roseba View Post
Why does a UBI have to be federal? We do pay state and local taxes too. And more blue money funnels into red states, but that is another debate.
I couldn't tell you, it's a hypothetical situation.

The total percentage of residents on the Welfare Roll is splattered red & blue alike.
https://www.cheatsheet.com/personal-...tml/?a=viewall

If you want to curb funneling wealth from one entity to another we should practice more personal responsibility with less taxation.
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Old 08-14-2017, 04:54 PM
 
3,570 posts, read 3,757,388 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WithDisp View Post
I couldn't tell you, it's a hypothetical situation.

The total percentage of residents on the Welfare Roll is splattered red & blue alike.
https://www.cheatsheet.com/personal-...tml/?a=viewall

If you want to curb funneling wealth from one entity to another we should practice more personal responsibility with less taxation.
I don't ascribe to that point of view. I only subscribe to lack of hypocrisy. Red staters want less taxation, but don't contribute as much as they take.
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Old 08-14-2017, 06:43 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roseba View Post
I don't ascribe to that point of view. I only subscribe to lack of hypocrisy. Red staters want less taxation, but don't contribute as much as they take.
That is a complete blanket statement.

The mix of federal aid is jumbled mess of red and blue.

https://taxfoundation.org/states-rely-most-federal-aid/


Also, in the current equation red states contribute to the ACA/Obamacare and receive NO increase in Medicaid coverage. Red states are far more likely to remain uninsured, but continue to pay for the services in the rest of the country.

There's plenty of examples of **** poor taxation/contribution/redistribution.
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Old 08-15-2017, 07:12 AM
 
3,570 posts, read 3,757,388 times
Reputation: 1349
Quote:
Originally Posted by WithDisp View Post
That is a complete blanket statement.

The mix of federal aid is jumbled mess of red and blue.

https://taxfoundation.org/states-rely-most-federal-aid/


Also, in the current equation red states contribute to the ACA/Obamacare and receive NO increase in Medicaid coverage. Red states are far more likely to remain uninsured, but continue to pay for the services in the rest of the country.

There's plenty of examples of **** poor taxation/contribution/redistribution.
I came speak rocky individual earmarks, but know that it's well documented that red states pay less into the fed than they receive back. I'm on a cell phone or I would link it to you. It's easy to find.
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