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Look, I feel bad about being one of those people that moved away and now post complaints on the NYS site. I love NYS. But there’s no way in hell that cheap housing prices make up for the fact that NYS has a property/school tax problem. Yes, there are cheaper prices in NY. But that’s because the inventory is so old. If you move down South you will get a much newer modern home with all the bells and whistles for your money. That’s a fact. Another fact is most people have a mortgage and most people have escrow. When you pay your mortgage down South your money goes to paying down your debt. In NYS your mortgage payment goes to paying your taxes in escrow. That’s a fact too. Long story short, you are not going to get more house for your money in NYS.
Now, if you’ve moved down South and disagree with my comments, let’s talk. But, if you never lived down South, and your knowledge only comes from web links, I have nothing to say to you. We don’t have a common base of reference.
Just so you don’t think I’m dumping on NYS. If I had young children who attended public school, there’s no better state in the Union than NYS to get a quality education. That comes from two things. First is the involvement of parents in their child’s education. The second is the parents willingness to pay for that education. i.e. taxation.
My problem is at my age, when do I get off the hamster wheel of paying school tax. And please! STAR tax reduction is not the answer.
I lived in NC for about 8 months, however I didn't own a house, I rented. As far as apartments go, I fully agree. My apartment was WAY nicer in the South than in the North. It was newer. At the time, they didn't have new apartments in the part of Upstate NY that I lived in. However, now they do. For example, I lived in Queensbury, NY at the time and my place was older brick garden apt. Now you can live at about the same quality in Upstate: https://www.dawnhomes.com/apartments...k-place/photos
I agree on the houses part. They are newer and nicer in the South near the major cities. There's no arguing that. Outside of HOA areas in the bigger metros, your house in the South may be old as a NY house and also sitting next to a trailer. Rural areas of the South, right outside of the bigger metros were also settled long ago like NY. I'm thinking an area like Butner, outside Durham, NC. Many old houses, MANY trailers, and most of them not new or modern. Outside the bigger metros, the South is quite dilapidated and zoning is non-existent. There is a major problem just east of Raleigh actually, with wafting fumes and overspray from hog farm operations.
Quote:
Originally Posted by james621
Overall COL in upstate is not at or around the national average at all. I have family all over NYS. The examples I could give would make your head spin. I have a friend who sells real estate. He just told me a story this weekend about a house that can't sell in Liberty NY because of the taxes. A modest 140000 thousand dollar home has a tax bill of 13000 dollars. This is in Liberty, mind you. I had another friend who bought a house in Walden NY. He had a tax bill of over 12000 dollars. He said if he bought a house a few blocks away, it would have cost less. They had what I believe he called a village tax that added a few thousand. Call up your cell phone provider. Ask them what surcharges NY adds for the privilege of having one. Another thing is the cost of heat. I've seen bills of over 500 a month for a 2000 square foot home. Add in the eighth highest out of fifty states for electricity rates and a higher than average auto insurance rates while your at it. You better not enjoy tobacco either. Ten dollars for a pack now. Over eight percent sales tax too.
Certain parts of NY have tax rates that should be illegal. I'm 100% in agreement. Some towns I looked at in Rockland and Orange County like Tuxedo Park, Sloatsburg, etc had taxes of $17k on a $200k house. Its insane. Not all of Upstate is like that, but I agree its an issue that needs to be fixed ASAP. I chose to live in another state because of it. It seems especially prevalent in Rockland, Orange, and Sullivan Counties and its maddening.
Quote:
Originally Posted by james621
All those "smaller portions" add up. An extra two percent of sales tax on a 25000 car is "only" 500 extra. Car insurance in NY is also in the top ten as far as prices go. A conservative 10% more on two cars with collision cost up to 300 extra a year. Gasoline tax is one of the highest in the nation also. Another few cents a gallon than most states. A few years back NY and NJ fought it out for the highest taxes paid per income at over 12%. What's another couple percent, right? I could go on.
For car insurance, I paid only $600 a year in Queensbury with collision coverage. Not sure what it would be now. I was paying about the same in NC when I lived there. I do know that homeowners insurance is more expensive in the South due to hurricanes.
All those "smaller portions" add up. An extra two percent of sales tax on a 25000 car is "only" 500 extra. Car insurance in NY is also in the top ten as far as prices go. A conservative 10% more on two cars with collision cost up to 300 extra a year. Gasoline tax is one of the highest in the nation also. Another few cents a gallon than most states. A few years back NY and NJ fought it out for the highest taxes paid per income at over 12%. What's another couple percent, right? I could go on.
Again, all of this depends on where in the state, as it isn’t monolithic in terms of COL. I’m in a 2 car household that pays $120-130 a month for car insurance through USAA.
Also, in other states, taxation may be weighted in other things like sales taxes in TN can or approach 10% or they have a personal property tax as well. Not saying it is “tit for tat”, but the way things are administered in that regard varies by state.
In terms of the newer house thing, this even varies as my parents were looking at homes similar to newer homes in the Buckley Road area of Clay near Taft Road, but in the Virginia Beach area. Same type of homes were $250k with higher taxes in Clay were $350k in VA Beach. So, even this depends on what you are comparing.
Last edited by ckhthankgod; 05-12-2019 at 10:09 AM..
Again, all of this depends on where in the state, as it isn’t monolithic in terms of COL. I’m in a 2 car household that pays $120-130 a month for car insurance through USAA.
Also, in other states, taxation may be weighted in other things like sales taxes in TN can or approach 10% or they have a personal property tax as well. Not saying it is “tit for tat”, but the way things are administered in that regard varies by state.
In terms of the newer house thing, this even varies as my parents were looking at homes similar to newer homes in the Buckley Road area of Clay near Taft Road, but in the Virginia Beach area. Same type of homes were $250k with higher taxes in Clay were $350k in VA Beach. So, even this depends on what you are comparing.
Tennessee? When you compare the tax burden between Tennessee and New York, you will see Tennessee is number 48 in the country versus New York which is number 1. Feel free to compare any other state to New York.
Hi!
I 'm not from USA.But i really love this country... and New York...
Oh my gosh,it's the BEST city in the world and the heart of the most powerfull nation.
I want to move here someday,to learb your culture from inside.
Can yo give some advices about moving?
Tennessee? When you compare the tax burden between Tennessee and New York, you will see Tennessee is number 48 in the country versus New York which is number 1. Feel free to compare any other state to New York.
You’re new home argument doesn’t stand up as “same type homes” don’t take into account sq ft nor neighborhood. Let’s see the listings to compare.
Didn’t compare the tax burden with TN. Read what I wrote again.
Again, I’m just passing on information from someone’s personal experience. Whenever this comes up, size is always a criteria that I’ve used. Isn’t that what people want? This is a development in the general area that I was referring to: https://www.jmgcustomhomes.com/pdf/R...nMap010719.pdf
Bottom line is, if you can afford to live in Nashville, Raleigh, Charlotte, or Atlanta, you can afford any of the major cities in Upstate NY.
For me, there's a lot more to life than taxes and the age of your house, too. I love northeastern scenery, particularly in NY and PA. I like old houses and old hometowns. I like how cities like Albany and Rochester are surrounded by natural lakes, hills, vineyards, farms, barns and millions of acres of wilderness areas. I like old drive-in movie theaters to newly built 12 screen mega movie theaters. I like laying out a blanket under a sugar maple in the fall with a Thermos full of hot chocolate. I like the lack of traffic where I live. Life to me is about much more than bargain basement tax rates, or bells and whistles.
If you want a new house, you can get one. They exist in both areas. You only need 1 house, but you can't artificially re-create the natural beauty that God has created by digging and damming a lake. I see so many people that constantly worry about taxes and it consumes people to the point that they can't even enjoy life. They pay $4k a year more than someone else, but make $10k more in a higher paying state, and still they're consumed with it. I don't get it.
If you want a new house, you can get one. They exist in both areas. You only need 1 house, but you can't artificially re-create the natural beauty that God has created by digging and damming a lake.
Again you are on spot on VS! The suburb I live in is full of rolling hills that were created by glaciers pushing the terrain. I'm a 10 minute drive to downtown Rochester. In that 10 minutes I drive over a beautiful gorge that was created most likely by an ice dam that broke during the ice age creating this amazing scenery. I love driving over the Bay bridge and looking at the ice age created terrain. I love the view of the ridge that was the old shore of Lake Ontario thousands of years ago. And the amazing view of Irondequoit Bay which was the old mouth of the Genesee River before it was violently re-routed (again most likely during an ice age damming event.
This beautiful terrain can only be created by these ice age events and can only exist a few places in the world. I am very lucky to live smack dab in the middle of this amazing terrain and scenery.
Bottom line is, if you can afford to live in Nashville, Raleigh, Charlotte, or Atlanta, you can afford any of the major cities in Upstate NY.
For me, there's a lot more to life than taxes and the age of your house, too. I love northeastern scenery, particularly in NY and PA. I like old houses and old hometowns. I like how cities like Albany and Rochester are surrounded by natural lakes, hills, vineyards, farms, barns and millions of acres of wilderness areas. I like old drive-in movie theaters to newly built 12 screen mega movie theaters. I like laying out a blanket under a sugar maple in the fall with a Thermos full of hot chocolate. I like the lack of traffic where I live. Life to me is about much more than bargain basement tax rates, or bells and whistles.
If you want a new house, you can get one. They exist in both areas. You only need 1 house, but you can't artificially re-create the natural beauty that God has created by digging and damming a lake. I see so many people that constantly worry about taxes and it consumes people to the point that they can't even enjoy life. They pay $4k a year more than someone else, but make $10k more in a higher paying state, and still they're consumed with it. I don't get it.
Spot on! This is why I love living in the Rochester area. So much within an hour or so drive, natural beauty (Letchworth) waterways (Finger Lakes, Lake Ontario, Niagara Falls, Lake Erie), pro sport (Bills/Sabres), and countless small towns all around. Just this weekend I walked from my house along the canal to a vintage movie theater (3 screens) and grabbed a coffee at a little shop on main street. You'd be hard pressed to fit all this near any major metro down south.
Don't get me wrong, there are plenty of things you can do in the south that you can't do up here. But this is what I like and enjoy. I used to be one of those to be consumed by taxes and couldn't wait to get out. Sure it sucks but both my wife and I have good jobs that we worked very hard to get. I actually spoke with a friend that works within my same company at one of our southern branches that is actually from Buffalo. Mind you we work for the same company, same job, same experience and I make roughly $12K more than he does. My house was cheaper and larger. My taxes are about $3,500 more a year but do the math, I still come out way ahead. We both have elementary school aged kids and you can't even compare the different level of education the kids receive. His 3rd grader is doing stuff my kids were doing in 1st-2nd grade.
Bottom line is in my opinion if you hate NYS chances are you will be unhappy anywhere. That or you have just conditioned yourself to hate the state so much that no matter what happens you will always hate it.
Bottom line is, if you can afford to live in Nashville, Raleigh, Charlotte, or Atlanta, you can afford any of the major cities in Upstate NY.
For me, there's a lot more to life than taxes and the age of your house, too. I love northeastern scenery, particularly in NY and PA. I like old houses and old hometowns. I like how cities like Albany and Rochester are surrounded by natural lakes, hills, vineyards, farms, barns and millions of acres of wilderness areas. I like old drive-in movie theaters to newly built 12 screen mega movie theaters. I like laying out a blanket under a sugar maple in the fall with a Thermos full of hot chocolate. I like the lack of traffic where I live. Life to me is about much more than bargain basement tax rates, or bells and whistles.
If you want a new house, you can get one. They exist in both areas. You only need 1 house, but you can't artificially re-create the natural beauty that God has created by digging and damming a lake. I see so many people that constantly worry about taxes and it consumes people to the point that they can't even enjoy life. They pay $4k a year more than someone else, but make $10k more in a higher paying state, and still they're consumed with it. I don't get it.
When it comes to your reason for where you live, I can’t argue with you one bit. You’ve found your sweet spot on earth and I’m sincerely glad for you. As far as employment goes, when people leave NYS it’s not like they are making 10k less money so that part of your statement I do not agree with.
Didn’t compare the tax burden with TN. Read what I wrote again.
Again, I’m just passing on information from someone’s personal experience. Whenever this comes up, size is always a criteria that I’ve used. Isn’t that what people want? This is a development in the general area that I was referring to: https://www.jmgcustomhomes.com/pdf/R...nMap010719.pdf
Most people when they buy a new home have a mortgage. And most people have a escrow set up in that mortgage that pays property tax and insurance. So in New York you’re mortgage payment will pay for less home than it would in Virginia or just about any other state. So in NY you buy in the low 200k Ryan home neighborhood, and in Virginia you can shop in the better mid 200k Ryan home neighborhood because that’s what you can afford.
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