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Hi all- I currently live in a townhouse in Alexandria. Hubby is an attorney working in DC. We are in our early 30s with no kids but looking to start a family in the next year or so. He is looking at changing jobs and most of the businesses seem to be out towards Reston, Sterling, etc. He wouldn't want to commute from Alexandria and we could never afford a single family home inside the Beltway anyway (at least not one that we'd like- I'd love to live in DelRay). I've looked online at some real estate prices and prices are definitely cheaper out there. My question is, are Reston, Sterling, etc. just big box suburbia? I've been to Reston Town Center but never to Herndon, Sterling, etc. We just don't get out that way that much. Reston Town Center was nice but we are looking for something similar to Alexandria- you have the uniqueness of Old Town and DelRay but also the big box stores of Target, the Kingstowne area, etc. It's the best of both worlds! My hubby and I have always lived in the close-in suburbs of a city (i.e. Alexandria) and never out in true suburbia. Are there any towns out that way with cute little mains streets with boutiques, or is it all McMansions and big box stores?
Also, we like the bungalow-type style of houses like in DelRay or Arlington- are all the houses out that way McMansions?
Last question, living all the way out there, do you feel like you're part of DC? Sometimes "suburbia" seems like it could be Pittsburgh, Augusta GA, anywhere, etc. Do you find living out there still very expensive?
We are under a bit of a time crunch- hubby has a possible offer in Charlotte but also an application out in Sterling. Normally we could spend time and drive out there, but this Charlotte job has come up quickly and they will probably want an answer this week. We work late hours and there's just no way we can get out to the suburbs during this work week. I would rather stay in the DC area, I love how much there is to do and I love the weather (coming from GA, I had never seen snow!). But I am just not familiar with those areas and I don't know if suburbia is "us." We need to know if there's a possibility of us liking the VA 'burbs and what they're like before we turn down Charlotte. Thanks so much for any advice you could give!
I'd recommend my neighborhood, Brambleton, to you. Here's a photo tour I did last year.
Unlike many of the developments in eastern Loudoun, Brambleton is a mix of several different builders. There are some unique styles here - not just your typical brick-front neo-Colonial McMansion. Our neighborhood is "New Urban"-ish; built to be walkable, with a strong community. Our town center is a mix of big chains (Regal Cinema, Harris Teeter, Sport & Health, Subway, Caribou Coffee, etc.) and locally-owned business (Go Bananas toys, Blue Ridge Grill, Caliente, The Next Step, medical services, etc.) We are a short drive from big box stores in several directions - Wegmans and Target are about 10 minutes away; Leesburg, Sterling, and Chantilly are all about 20 minutes away and have everything. This is a great place to raise a family. It's very ethnically and culturally diverse (though not as economically diverse).
We feel like we're part of DC, sure. We live right behind Dulles and we have our own Smithsonian museum nearby! Brambleton is about 2 miles from what will be the terminal stop on the Silver Line, so we'll have Metro (someday). I think most people here work from home, in Ashburn, Leesburg, or along the Dulles Corridor from Herndon to Tysons, though I know some people who work in DC. I had some of the same reservations as you about living outside the Beltway - I lived for several years in Arlington and several years in Falls Church. But my husband and I were both reverse-commuting to Ashburn, and it just made sense to buy something out this way.
Are you interested in a single-family home or a townhouse? There are about 9 single-family resales listed right now (from $535K to $998K, though the cheaper ones are short sales), and about 9 townhouse resales (from $300K to $415K, with over half of those being short sales). There are also some quick-delivery new construction homes - Quick Delivery, Homes Available Now! (http://www.brambleton.com/quickdelivery - broken link).
I hate to burst your bubble, but, yes, the Reston/Sterling/Herndon/Dulles area is indeed your poorly-planned generic soulles and sterile "big-box suburbia" with little historic flair. Anyone who tries to tell you the contrary either has a vested interest in "selling" the area or thinks Reston Town Center is the equivalent of Old Town Alexandria. You're not going to find anything historic, quaint, or "unique" here. There is no "Del Ray" here. Old Town Herndon would be the only exception in this area, but even then it is so tiny in size that I'd hardly consider it a contender, even though some of my favorite local businesses are there.
Welcome to Northern Virginia outside the Beltway, the place where everyone desperately wants to live in a non-sterile community with a true sense of "place" and "community" but settles for vinyl siding, cul-de-sacs, traffic, and strip malls instead because they can't afford anything else and protest any developers who try to bring in anything better than "slap 'em up quick." If it weren't for the extensive tree canopy and respectable trail system here in Reston I'd wither and die, and the NIMBYs here are actually against efforts to improve the community with more dense mixed-use transit-oriented developments (i.e. Ballston).
Falls Church and Vienna each have some aspects of what you seek, but both are very expensive (marginally cheaper than Del Ray, if at all). Vienna isn't really "quaint", either. Michgc loves to boast about the town, but I visited the "historic district" of Vienna along Church Street and was underwhelmed and disappointed by how tiny it was in comparison to the overall community (a dozen businesses, if that?), and the gridlock along Maple Avenue, the true strip mall-lined "main drag" through town, never ends. Couple this with a lot of cute bungalows and ramblers being torn down for ghastly "show off" McMansions on postage stamp-sized lots, and I'm not really a fan of Vienna. Falls Church is better to give you that "Main Street" atmosphere, in my opinion, but even this place, too, falls short. Traffic along Broad Street (Route 7) through town is gridlocked, and the town also has a ton of strip malls, fast-food places, etc. instead of having focused on historic preservation over the years.
The only relatively affordable option you may be able to find out this way that would truly suit your tastes would be Old Town Leesburg, which offers a quaint downtown area with a county courthouse, town green, festivals, old brick buildings, etc. surrounded by a sea of big-box stores and tract housing. The problem? Leesburg is very congested (it now has 42,000+ residents in the town proper itself), and it is very far-flung from most other parts of the area.
I'm in the same boat as you guys, and I'm still seriously considering eventually taking the plunge and moving all the way out to Winchester, which I absolutely adore. The 2.5-hour round-trip daily commute would be hellish, but with how undesirable the rest of NoVA is for those seeking a "Main Street" or a slice of nostalgia, what other options do we really have? I know Alicia Bradley loves her newly-adopted Old Town Fairfax, but I also found that business district to be very small.
I'd recommend my neighborhood, Brambleton, to you. Here's a photo tour I did last year.
Unlike many of the developments in eastern Loudoun, Brambleton is a mix of several different builders. There are some unique styles here - not just your typical brick-front neo-Colonial McMansion. Our neighborhood is "New Urban"-ish; built to be walkable, with a strong community. Our town center is a mix of big chains (Regal Cinema, Harris Teeter, Sport & Health, Subway, Caribou Coffee, etc.) and locally-owned business (Go Bananas toys, Blue Ridge Grill, Caliente, The Next Step, medical services, etc.) We are a short drive from big box stores in several directions - Wegmans and Target are about 10 minutes away; Leesburg, Sterling, and Chantilly are all about 20 minutes away and have everything. This is a great place to raise a family. It's very ethnically and culturally diverse (though not as economically diverse).
We feel like we're part of DC, sure. We live right behind Dulles and we have our own Smithsonian museum nearby! Brambleton is about 2 miles from what will be the terminal stop on the Silver Line, so we'll have Metro (someday). I think most people here work from home, in Ashburn, Leesburg, or along the Dulles Corridor from Herndon to Tysons, though I know some people who work in DC. I had some of the same reservations as you about living outside the Beltway - I lived for several years in Arlington and several years in Falls Church. But my husband and I were both reverse-commuting to Ashburn, and it just made sense to buy something out this way.
Are you interested in a single-family home or a townhouse? There are about 9 single-family resales listed right now (from $535K to $998K, though the cheaper ones are short sales), and about 9 townhouse resales (from $300K to $415K, with over half of those being short sales). There are also some quick-delivery new construction homes - Quick Delivery, Homes Available Now! (http://www.brambleton.com/quickdelivery - broken link).
I'll agree with Brambleton as a suggestion, as it is a pedestrian-friendly community in a mixed-use environment. It's not a bad choice at all. They'll be horribly disappointed, though, if they come out to Brambleton expecting to find Old Town Alexandria. There's nothing like that in this part of NoVA, unfortunately.
I'll agree with Brambleton as a suggestion, as it is a pedestrian-friendly community in a mixed-use environment. It's not a bad choice at all. They'll be horribly disappointed, though, if they come out to Brambleton expecting to find Old Town Alexandria. There's nothing like that in this part of NoVA, unfortunately.
No, you're right about that, but in my opinion it's the closest thing, especially considering her desire to still feel like part of DC. We have unique shops, and houses that aren't McMansions. Historic Leesburg might be a close fit, but I personally would never want to live there. The area where I live tends to look eastward, whereas Leesburg as the county seat tends to look at Leesburg - if that makes any sense.
Their lives will change a lot when they have kids in the next couple of years. I can personally testify that pushing a stroller around Old Town can be a nightmare. The short commute to Sterling will be even more important once kids are in the picture. And someday when her kid's a teenager, they can drive to the Metro station and take the train in together to see a show at the 9:30 Club. (That's my plan for my kids. I'll tell them about the good old days when "930" was the address and it smelled awful and there was that stupid column that blocked the view of the stage.) The city will feel like it's right next door (sort of).
No, you're right about that, but in my opinion it's the closest thing, especially considering her desire to still feel like part of DC. We have unique shops, and houses that aren't McMansions. Historic Leesburg might be a close fit, but I personally would never want to live there. The area where I live tends to look eastward, whereas Leesburg as the county seat tends to look at Leesburg - if that makes any sense.
Their lives will change a lot when they have kids in the next couple of years. I can personally testify that pushing a stroller around Old Town can be a nightmare. The short commute to Sterling will be even more important once kids are in the picture. And someday when her kid's a teenager, they can drive to the Metro station and take the train in together to see a show at the 9:30 Club. (That's my plan for my kids. I'll tell them about the good old days when "930" was the address and it smelled awful and there was that stupid column that blocked the view of the stage.) The city will feel like it's right next door (sort of).
True. Brambleton has always earned my "gold seal of approval" from a budding urban planner's standpoint because it has legitimately tried to recreate the quaint wholesome "Mayberry" towns of our parents' and grandparents' generations, many of which fell into disrepair thanks to decades of white-flight to traditional newer suburban environments. I've been to Brambleton several times and have explored. I like what I see, for the most part. I like how many of the neighborhoods have rear parking as compared to other parts of Ashburn that are dominated by front-facing two-car (or three-car) garages and driveways. Neighborhoods should be built with people in mind first and cars second.
I'd definitely encourage the OP to check into Brambleton, but it still has that "faux" atmosphere you get from Fairfax Corner, Reston Town Center, Kingstowne, and other suburban developments here that try to serve as substitutes to downtown business districts. It seems like a great reasonably-priced place to raise a family. I'd still likely never live there, though, due to its relative isolation to the city (the Dulles Greenway isn't exactly a bargain, either), and the fact that I yearn for history. I visit places like Old Town Alexandria, Winchester, Fredericksburg, Culpeper, Berryville, Middleburg, etc., and I melt inside because it feels like I'm back in my native Pennsylvania. Then I come back to the "reality" of Sterling, Reston, Herndon, Ashburn, Dulles, etc. and find myself dreaming at night about living in those other areas, buying a hybrid, assembling a carpool, and power-commuting. I just may do it in the end.
I like to walk down a street, close my eyes, and envision the hard-working immigrants who moved to this great land 150 years ago with nothing but the shirts on their backs and worked hard to build homes with character and charm to house their families. I don't like to close my eyes and hear the cheesy elevator music playing outside Macaroni Grill, ghetto thugs blasting "Ice Cream Paint Job" from their Escalades with spinning rims and Maryland plates, teenage girls saying "like seriously like and some like stuff..." into their cell phones very loudly, Hispanic families being very LOUD right outside my bedroom window, or 30-year-old gay-acting yet heterosexual tools talking about their jobs on Saturday nights, all of which I endure now in Reston. Yeah, the latter are some cruel stereotypes that the cheerleaders will give me serious heat for, but I can fully understand the environment the OP is seeking (many of my friends sought it when moving here, too). Sadly, it just doesn't exist in NoVA, and not only will developers not bring it here, but when they propose it they are fought tooth-and-nail by Baby Boomers still clinging to outdated urban planning trends of the 1960s.
As I say every so often - most recently yesterday, in fact - much of what is considered NOVA today was rural until as recently as 25-30 years ago. So beyond the relatively few incorporated towns and cities largely mentioned already, there weren't any quaint areas on the level of, say Old Town Alex or Del Ray. Rapid job growth begat rapid "typical" suburban housing and retail development whose aesthetics and arrangement can admittedly leave something to be desired at times.
All of that is to say that much of NOVA outside Arlington/Alexandria is your "usual" fast-growing suburban area. There are relatively new exceptions such as Brambleton and Reston Town Center as mentioned.
As cdmurphy hinted at, knowing your preferred budget would help us help you as well.
Location: Chapel Hill, NC, formerly NoVA and Phila
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Originally Posted by RestonRunner86
Michgc loves to boast about the town, but I visited the "historic district" of Vienna along Church Street and was underwhelmed and disappointed by how tiny it was in comparison to the overall community (a dozen businesses, if that?), and the gridlock along Maple Avenue, the true strip mall-lined "main drag" through town, never ends. Couple this with a lot of cute bungalows and ramblers being torn down for ghastly "show off" McMansions on postage stamp-sized lots, and I'm not really a fan of Vienna.
I don't "boast" about the quaintness of Vienna and never have. But I do like Vienna quite a bit. The DC area is lacking in towns, no doubt about it. I have driven through dozens of small towns in central PA and New Jersey that are much quainter than Vienna or any other town (except for Alexandria) in the DC area. However, being that quaint towns are few and far between around here, I think Vienna offers some of the best that they've got. I agree that the strip shopping centers on 123 leave a lot to be desired. But there is more to the town than just the businesses. It is a great family area. Would it be fun for a single person? Not so much. But, for families, there is a lot to the downtown area. And it's not all on Maple Avenue or Church Street.
There are baseball fields and football fields on Center Street along with the fire station, town hall, police station and art center. On Park Street is a community center Town of Vienna - Parks and Recreation (http://www.viennava.gov/Town_Departments/comctr.htm - broken link) with all kinds of classes as well as a teen center for middle school kids to hang out at after school. The W&OD trail W&OD Railroad - Main Page runs through the center of town. In each quadrant of town there are parks with tennis courts, playgrounds, and more baseball fields. There are churches and preschools on many of the downtown streets off Maple Avenue. There are two swim clubs. The elementary schools are scattered througout the town. While Route 123 is not quaint or without traffic, there are lots of amenities for those who live in Town can walk or ride their bike to: the library, dozens of non-chain ethnic restaurants, chain restaurants, chain and non-chain coffee shops http://www.jamminjava.com/home, drugstores, a bike store, Whole Foods and other grocery stores, several antique stores, banks, a natural market, and some ice cream shops. There is a new Town Green that has twice-weekly concerts in season and WiFi access. Is Route 123 pretty and quaint? No. Is it functional? Yes.
Paralleling Route 123 is Church Street. It is the old, historic street of Vienna. The business area is not large -about 4 blocks long. It is getting built up. There is a yummy, NY-style pizza place, some restaurants, a custard shop, a dance studio, a toy store, a bread store, some boutique-type stores, a new coffee shop That’s Amouri (http://www.connectionnewspapers.com/article.asp?article=342823&paper=73&cat=104 - broken link), a church, some thrift stores, a bike shop, and other places. There is a historic building, The Freeman House Historic Vienna, Inc. » Freeman Store that you can visit, an old library that's open once per month, an old railway station that houses a model railroad club that opens to the public once per month to see their display, as well as an old caboose that you can climb or sit near.
Off of Church Street are some other type places that run into a light industrial area. There is a new art studio/coffee hangout place called The Soundry The Soundry | which has art classes, music, and other things. There is a pet shop, a karate place and some other places.
The housing, for the most part, is not quaint and pretty. Most of the downtown area is 1950's ramblers. Some of the smaller ones have been knocked down and Arts and Crafts style homes have been built in their place, for the most part. The lots are by no means postage-size. Nearly every lot in Vienna is at least 1/4 acre. Overall, I estimate that fewer than 20% of the town has been knocked down. And, for the most part, cute bungalows were not there before. They were mostly post-WWII ramblers. As you spread out from the center of town, there are more 1960 splits, bi-levels, and 1970's and 1980's colonials.
Another nice perk of living in the Town is that the Metro is about 1-2 miles away from the Town Center. It's the farthest west stop (for now) on the Metro Line in NoVA.
The schools, for the most part, are very highly rated. After both McLean High Schools and Woodson in Fairfax, Madison High School generally boasts the highest test scores for the county.
The Town has regular functions for families - a weekly farmers market on Church Street every Saturday, a Halloween Parade that closes down the town, fireworks for the 4th of July. A fair with rides every Memorial Day, an Oktoberfest, a Holiday Stroll, regular activities at the community center, open houses at the Fire Station for kids, bingo at the fire station, bike rodeos for the kids, etc.
Is it the best town in the world? No. Is it the cutest town in the world? No. Will you be "wowed" by its cuteness? No. Does it offer what many other Census-designated areas in NoVA do not? Yes. Does it function as a true town? Yes.
The best part of Vienna, though, is that there is a sense of community found throughout the town. People who live here care about the Town, their kids, the schools, and their community. People are, for the most part, are friendly. And if I "boast" about Vienna it's because I really like living here. It's a great place to raise a family.
Here is a photo tour I did of Vienna. https://www.city-data.com/forum/north...ur-vienna.html I still need to do a Part 2 of it, which shows more on the North Side of Town. I will try to do it this fall now that my kids are in school.
Falls Church and Vienna each have some aspects of what you seek, but both are very expensive (marginally cheaper than Del Ray, if at all). Vienna isn't really "quaint", either. Michgc loves to boast about the town, but I visited the "historic district" of Vienna along Church Street and was underwhelmed and disappointed by how tiny it was in comparison to the overall community (a dozen businesses, if that?), and the gridlock along Maple Avenue, the true strip mall-lined "main drag" through town, never ends. Couple this with a lot of cute bungalows and ramblers being torn down for ghastly "show off" McMansions on postage stamp-sized lots, and I'm not really a fan of Vienna. Falls Church is better to give you that "Main Street" atmosphere, in my opinion, but even this place, too, falls short. Traffic along Broad Street (Route 7) through town is gridlocked, and the town also has a ton of strip malls, fast-food places, etc. instead of having focused on historic preservation over the years.
It's a bit unfortunate, in my opinion, that RR jumps on every single post that provides him with a launching pad to express his negative views about the region. It's also very rare that his posts are completely accurate, since he gets carried away with his own rhetoric.
To take one example, there are NOT a lot of "cute bungalows" getting torn down in Vienna. There are some ramblers from the 1950s that have been torn down - often replaced with NEW bungalows built in a historic style, as well as larger Craftsman-style homes that most probably would not label "McMansions." And, while a more subjective call, the "postage stamp-sized lots" in the Town of Vienna are typically 1/4 to 2/3 of an acre (larger than the typical lot in Arlington or Alexandria), and the new houses have to comply with the Town's fairly rigorous site requirements. No one has claimed that the strip malls on Maple Avenue are "quaint," but they (and the stores on Church Street) offer a great variety of family-friendly shops and restaurants (some are chains, but a significant percentage are not). The adjacent suburbs outside the Town with Vienna addresses consist of a range of houses built from the 1960s to last week, on even larger lots (great for those who love to garden, or want to provide their kids with plenty of room to play).
I simply don't think the OP can make a quick judgment about which areas might appeal to her without actually coming to look at places like Vienna, Reston or Brambleton. They aren't perfectly planned by any means, nor do they appeal to all tastes (I like Brambleton a lot, as do many others, but others think it's too perfect, like a stage set from "The Truman Show"). However, each contains amenities that often appeal to couples in their early 30s contemplating the years ahead, as opposed to a single guy in his mid-20s.
And, if outside-the-Beltway NoVa holds no immediate appeal for the OP, she and her husband should keep in mind that most of the housing in the Charlotte area (with exceptions like the Myers Park neighborhood in the city of Charlotte, which has a great variety of pre-1960s homes) resembles the housing in places like Vienna and Brambleton more than it does Old Town Alexandria or Del Ray. Like NoVa, and unlike the towns in the Scranton area from which RR hails, most of the development in the Charlotte area is relatively recent.
I don't "boast" about the quaintness of Vienna and never have. But I do like Vienna quite a bit. The DC area is lacking in towns, no doubt about it. I have driven through dozens of small towns in central PA and New Jersey that are much quainter than Vienna or any other town (except for Alexandria) in the DC area. However, being that quaint towns are few and far between around here, I think Vienna offers some of the best that they've got. I agree that the strip shopping centers on 123 leave a lot to be desired. But there is more to the town than just the businesses. It is a great family area. Would it be fun for a single person? Not so much. But, for families, there is a lot to the downtown area. And it's not all on Maple Avenue or Church Street.
There are baseball fields and football fields on Center Street along with the fire station, town hall, police station and art center. On Park Street is a community center Town of Vienna - Parks and Recreation (http://www.viennava.gov/Town_Departments/comctr.htm - broken link) with all kinds of classes as well as a teen center for middle school kids to hang out at after school. The W&OD trail W&OD Railroad - Main Page runs through the center of town. In each quadrant of town there are parks with tennis courts, playgrounds, and more baseball fields. There are churches and preschools on many of the downtown streets off Maple Avenue. The elementary schools are scattered througout the town. While Route 123 is not quaint or without traffic, there are lots of amenities for those who live in Town can walk or ride their bike to: the library, dozens of non-chain ethnic restaurants, chain restaurants, chain and non-chain coffee shops http://www.jamminjava.com/home, drugstores, a bike store, Whole Foods and other grocery stores, several antique stores, banks, a natural market, and some ice cream shops. There is a new Town Green that has twice-weekly concerts in season and WiFi access. Is Route 123 pretty and quaint? No. Is it functional? Yes.
Paralleling Route 123 is Church Street. It is the old, historic street of Vienna. The business area is not large -about 4 blocks long. It is getting built up. There is a yummy, NY-style pizza place, some restaurants, a custard shop, a dance studio, a toy store, a bread store, some boutique-type stores, a new coffee shop That’s Amouri (http://www.connectionnewspapers.com/article.asp?article=342823&paper=73&cat=104 - broken link), a church, some thrift stores, a bike shop, and other places. There is a historic building, The Freeman House Historic Vienna, Inc. » Freeman Store that you can visit, an old library that's open once per month, an old railway station that houses a model railroad club that opens to the public once per month to see their display, as well as an old caboose that you can climb or sit near.
Off of Church Street are some other type places that run into a light industrial area. There is a new art studio/coffee hangout place called The Soundry The Soundry | which has art classes, music, and other things. There is a pet shop, a karate place and some other places.
The housing, for the most part, is not quaint and pretty. Most of the downtown area is 1950's ramblers. Some of the smaller ones have been knocked down and Arts and Crafts style homes have been built in their place, for the most part. The lots are by no means postage-size. Nearly every lot in Vienna is at least 1/4 acre. Overall, I estimate that fewer than 20% of the town has been knocked down. And, for the most part, cute bungalows were not there before. They were mostly post-WWII ramblers. As you spread out from the center of town, there are more 1960 splits, bi-levels, and 1970's and 1980's colonials.
Another nice perk of living in the Town is that the Metro is about 1-2 miles away from the Town Center. It's the farthest west stop (for now) on the Metro Line in NoVA.
The schools, for the most part, are very highly rated. After both McLean High Schools and Woodson in Fairfax, Madison High School generally boasts the highest test scores for the county.
The Town has regular functions for families - a weekly farmers market on Church Street every Saturday, a Halloween Parade that closes down the town, fireworks for the 4th of July. A fair with rides every Memorial Day, an Oktoberfest, a Holiday Stroll, regular activities at the community center, open houses at the Fire Station for kids, bingo at the fire station, bike rodeos for the kids, etc.
Is it the best town in the world? No. Is it the cutest town in the world? No. Will you be "wowed" by its cuteness? No. Does it offer what many other Census-designated areas in NoVA do not? Yes. Does it function as a true town? Yes.
The best part of Vienna, though, is that there is a sense of community found throughout the town. People who live here care about the Town, their kids, the schools, and their community. People are, for the most part, are friendly. And if I "boast" about Vienna it's because I really like living here. It's a great place to raise a family.
Here is a photo tour I did of Vienna. https://www.city-data.com/forum/north...ur-vienna.html I still need to do a Part 2 of it, which shows more on the North Side of Town. I will try to do it this fall now that my kids are in school.
I see RR's post triggered a comment on your part, too. Thanks for not letting it go unanswered.
In the interests of accuracy, however, I should point out that Madison's test scores typically are behind not only McLean and Woodson HS, but also Langley HS.
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