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We must be reading different liberal newspapers. The Washington Post wrote a rare and scathing editorial page condemnation of Cooch a few months ago----the guy is so anti-gay, I wonder about him sometimes. He's still fighting the culture wars of the 1980's. Regarding the crime rate thing, I think Richmond wins the prize for high crime. I don't know where else you've lived in the country, but NoVa is a veritable paradise, crime wise, when compared to most of the rest of the U.S..
When the Cooch was running for AG, I recall WaPo had a piece about him, which was along the lines of "he's crazy conservative and we disagree with him, but even Democratic legislators say that he is a principled guy and a straight shooter." It was a surprisingly fair article and there were quite a few like it. But once it seemed like he was a surer thing and became more prominent as a conservative activist, the lib papers started to go after him more viciously (don't forget that the Cooch was a local legislator of a fairly liberal district and managed to survive electorally -- I attribute that to the fact that he is a great campaigner as well as because his constituents knew him to be a fair and principled person even if they disagreed with him on policy issues).
I got you beat. Hampton Roads, where I lived for a little while, is far worse than Richmond in terms of crime.
However, as great as NoVA is, esp. considering its high density, your statement that it is better "when compared to most of the rest of the U.S." is stretching it. There are many towns in this country where crime is virtually nonexistent.
Of course I agree things are pretty good here in NoVA -- that's why I live here. But I find statements like "Im pretty sure many parts of RoVa have higher crime than most of NoVa does, btw" unnecessarily smug.
When the Cooch was running for AG, I recall WaPo had a piece about him, which was along the lines of "he's crazy conservative and we disagree with him, but even Democratic legislators say that he is a principled guy and a straight shooter." It was a surprisingly fair article and there were quite a few like it. But once it seemed like he was a surer thing and became more prominent as a conservative activist, the lib papers started to go after him more viciously (don't forget that the Cooch was a local legislator of a fairly liberal district and managed to survive electorally -- I attribute that to the fact that he is a great campaigner as well as because his constituents knew him to be a fair and principled person even if they disagreed with him on policy issues).
I got you beat. Hampton Roads, where I lived for a little while, is far worse than Richmond in terms of crime.
However, as great as NoVA is, esp. considering its high density, your statement that it is better "when compared to most of the rest of the U.S." is stretching it. There are many towns in this country where crime is virtually nonexistent.
Of course I agree things are pretty good here in NoVA -- that's why I live here. But I find statements like "Im pretty sure many parts of RoVa have higher crime than most of NoVa does, btw" unnecessarily smug.
Of course you'll find areas of the country with much lower crime rates than NoVa, but you would be hard-pressed to find a jurisdiction like Fairfax County, with over a million people, with a lower crime rate. I lived in Fairfax County during the 1980's----there were a few years when no one was murdered, an astonishing statistic for a county its size. As far as the Cooch, my absolute distain for the guy arises from the fact that, as a gay American and law abiding taxpayer, I'm deeply offended by the zeal with which he goes after the "gay agenda". He's a throwback, and I thought we were beyond that kind of hateful attack-politics. If the WaPo had nice things to say about him in the beginning, they sure changed their tune after his first year in office. When you are on the receiving end of political vitrol, you tend to see people in a different light, and words like "principle" and "straight shooter" become empty platitudes.
But I find statements like "Im pretty sure many parts of RoVa have higher crime than most of NoVa does, btw" unnecessarily smug.
But that statement was just a counter to another smug statement about how crime would get out of control if NOVA was its own state. Which makes no sense whatsoever (Richmond is somehow keeping NOVA from being dangerous?). My guess is that it was an implication that NOVA would be a more liberal state ala Maryland and liberal states by default have higher crime...which isn't true at all.
NOVA splitting from the rest of VA is an absolutely horrid idea.
I shudder to think what would happen in a state run by Fairfax and Arlington types. Massive increase in taxes, high crime rate, crippling budget deficits. They might as well call the new state "Southern Maryland".
Really? REALLY? really? What are you smoking? Hyperbolic much? That's like those of us up here claiming that the good old boy richmond types would take us back to the days of slavery, incest, and farm animals... etc. You know all of those awful stereotypes. Although we should note here that our current governor does want to celebrate "confederate history", and somehow omitted one very important aspect of said "history". The only reason he apologised for that was because of the heavy fire he came under for it. I would almost be willing to bet that the current gov would invite David Duke to richmond to be a guest of honor at one of his dinners if he thought he could get away with it.
Furthermore, comparing So, MD to NoVA is apples and oranges. So MD is very different from NoVA and to the rest of its state, than NoVA is in general and to VA. The fact of the matter is that richmond, and the rest of VA would likely be hurting were it not for the tax base and income for the state that NoVA and the Tidewater areas provide. Southern MD is much less densely populated, and is far more rural in most places than NoVA is, and does not have an enormous population center(s). The most sizable thing down there is Waldorf.
Anyway, While most people "up here" don't think that those things are necessarily true, many of us DO feel that those same good old boy richmond types want to, try to, and DO hold Virginia back from moving forward / progressing. You know, honestly, its people that think and speak like you do and what you said here that make those of us up here in NoVA Cringe, and even possibly dislike you. The fact is, that Virginia as a whole, while SOME are attempting to hold it back, is NOT the same state it was during or even shortly after the civil war, nor before it. Though, some (maybe even many) in certain parts of it would like to think that it has not changed much at all. Sorry, but it has.
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Originally Posted by brooklynborndad
we dont vote for governor at mid term. we vote for gov BETWEEN the presidential election and the midterm. Hmmmmm.
My mistake, I did not mean "mid term election"... I meant this:
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Originally Posted by brooklynborndad
the folks who vote in the super off year election. And excluding those who plan on voting by 7 and get stuck in traffic.
We have ridiculously early poll closing in Virginia, and are one of the few states that dont align our statewide elections with congressional elections. The latter tends to favor candidates with support from older and wealthier people (who also are more of the vote in mid term congressional elections, BTW, than in presidential elections) and the former specifically hurts NoVa (and some NoVans more than others).
All of what is he said IS very true though.
Funny things about Loudoun and PW co's. I see more liberal stickers and meet more liberal folks in those counties than I do in most other supposedly 'rural' counties. If the full force of the democratic vote was felt in NoVA, and SeVA (South Eastern VA) in each and every election, VA would not be a purple state, it would be solid blue.
Last edited by United_Caps_Skins_Fan; 09-15-2011 at 09:04 AM..
Of course you'll find areas of the country with much lower crime rates than NoVa, but you would be hard-pressed to find a jurisdiction like Fairfax County, with over a million people, with a lower crime rate.
A fair point. And I would (and do) not object to a statement such as yours.
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I lived in Fairfax County during the 1980's----there were a few years when no one was murdered, an astonishing statistic for a county its size.
That was 20-30 years ago. The population density of Fairfax was not quite what it is now, was it?
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As far as the Cooch, my absolute distain for the guy arises from the fact that, as a gay American and law abiding taxpayer, I'm deeply offended by the zeal with which he goes after the "gay agenda". He's a throwback, and I thought we were beyond that kind of hateful attack-politics. If the WaPo had nice things to say about him in the beginning, they sure changed their tune after his first year in office. When you are on the receiving end of political vitrol, you tend to see people in a different light, and words like "principle" and "straight shooter" become empty platitudes.
Well, I do not think this is the right space for arguing about these political (or moral) issues. I happen to know the Cooch personally and I do not think he harbors any hatred or vitriol toward homosexuals. I do think he -- based on his religion and conscience -- believes that traditional marriage should be preserved as is.
Whatever one may think of his particular views, he makes them clear, transparent and is always earnest in defending them. That's all.
Really? REALLY? really? What are you smoking? Hyperbolic much? That's like those of us up here claiming that the good old boy richmond types would take us back to the days of slavery, incest, and farm animals... etc.
Not that you believe all that stereotype about "the good old boy Richmond types," right?
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I would almost be willing to bet that the current gov would invite David Duke to richmond to be a guest of honor at one of his dinners if he thought he could get away with it.
And, yet, distressingly, you seem all too eager to assign base motives and stereotypes to others. "Hyperbolic much?" was what you wrote earlier, I believe.
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The fact of the matter is that richmond, and the rest of VA would likely be hurting were it not for the tax base and income for the state that NoVA and the Tidewater areas provide.
Sadly, the area formerly known as "Tidewater" (now "Hampton Roads") is hurting badly as well.
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many of us DO feel that those same good old boy richmond types want to, try to, and DO hold Virginia back from moving forward / progressing.
And I thought you earlier brought up the whole "good old boy Richmond types" as an equally egregious stereotype...
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Funny things about Loudoun and PW co's. I see more liberal stickers and meet more liberal folks in those counties than I do in most other supposedly 'rural' counties.
That's because substantial chunks of Loudoun and PW counties are NOT rural at all, but high density suburban. I read somewhere that the Ashburn/Eastern Loudoun area is now the second most highly densely populated area in NoVA. I don't know whether that's true or not, but it does say a lot about the transformation of those area.
However, these are hardly leftist counties. I would describe both as "center-right" counties politically, much as I would describe the Commonwealth of Virginia. "Center-right" areas do on occasion vote Democrat, but once party labels are stripped, center-right areas do support center-right policies.
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If the full force of the democratic vote was felt in NoVA, and SeVA (South Eastern VA) in each and every election, VA would not be a purple state, it would be solid blue.
You would prefer that, I am sure, but that's just not the case. If you conduct a survey on policies rather than parties, a sizable majority of VA voters prefers center-right policies.
Outstanding point! Those horrible, right-wing counties!
Talk away! Even liberal newspapers will grudgingly admit that the Cooch is principled.
And many parts of "RoVa" ("there you go again" to borrow President Reagan's words) have lower crime rate than NoVA. What's your point?
My point was to respond to SPhokie, who seems to think that there is something about RoVa that holds down crime.
My point was to respond to SPhokie, who seems to think that there is something about RoVa that holds down crime.
White people? I kid, I kid. Yes, to repeat, that was a joke (and, for the record, I am not of European ancestry, well mostly anyway; there might be some miniscule genetic contribution in me from Europe).
Well you know, I find that silly either way. Although politics -- especially those that relate to law enforcement -- do have some role in determining crime rate, the latter is really more of a product of civic culture, economics and so on rather than geography or ethnicity.
So yes, I agree it's silly to say that there is something magical in "RoVA" or NoVA that keeps crime up or down one way. But this is not the first time you were derisive or dismissive about "RoVA" you know. The term itself I think is highly insulting, as if to say there is NoVA and then there is the rest.
If you conduct a survey on policies rather than parties, a sizable majority of VA voters prefers center-right policies.
Given what the Democratic party has stood for since 1992, and what the GOP has stood for since 2009, preferring center right policies is not at all inconsistent with preferring the Democratic party.
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I kid, I kid. Yes, to repeat, that was a joke (and, for the record, I am not of European ancestry, well mostly anyway; there might be some miniscule genetic contribution in me from Europe).
