Fairfax County Public Schools Faces $140 Million Shortfall (Washington: taxi, taxes)

[acgood]

Here is the actual 2014 budget...
http://www.fcps.edu/fs/budget/docume...BudgetFY14.pdf

Employee compensation 88.2%
Transportation 5.6%
14,976 FTE teachers

According to a study done in Loudoun, the average tenure was 9.2 years for teachers
http://www.lcps.org/cms/lib4/VA01000...ions%20LLC.pdf

[Grsz11]

Originally Posted by tgbwc

Teachers are expected to teach in a much different way than they did when you were in elementary school.

Was that back when students of all ages were in the same one room?

[choff5]

Originally Posted by Grsz11

Was that back when students of all ages were in the same one room?

Yep, and we walked to school, through three feet of snow, up hill, both ways.....

[NovaOne]

Originally Posted by HokieFan

I don't have a problem with children getting free lunches. For most of these kids, it's the only decent meal they get each day. I don't begrudge money going towards feeding children who would otherwise go hungry.

I don't buy this. If a child in Fairfax county is not getting good nutrition, its due to parental neglect, not lack of food. The #1 food related problem among the poor is obesity, not malnutrition.

I also don't have a problem with children getting free lunches. As much as we pay in taxes every year, there should be plenty to go around.

The problem is that the schools are wasting money on things that bring very little marginal education value - expensive audio/visual/technology aids, rock climbing walls in gyms, and of course the top heavy administration structure.

Fairfax county has it better than most. Even with illegal immigrants, the county has one of the highest tax revenues that would make 99.99% of other US counties see unicorns and rainbows. So if Fairfax county cannot find money to ensure the quality of its core competency, then it is not due a lack of funds, but improper prioritization.

[slim04]

Originally Posted by NovaOne

I don't buy this. If a child in Fairfax county is not getting good nutrition, its due to parental neglect, not lack of food. The #1 food related problem among the poor is obesity, not malnutrition.

I also don't have a problem with children getting free lunches. As much as we pay in taxes every year, there should be plenty to go around.

The problem is that the schools are wasting money on things that bring very little marginal education value - expensive audio/visual/technology aids, rock climbing walls in gyms, and of course the top heavy administration structure.

Fairfax county has it better than most. Even with illegal immigrants, the county has one of the highest tax revenues that would make 99.99% of other US counties see unicorns and rainbows. So if Fairfax county cannot find money to ensure the quality of its core competency, then it is not due a lack of funds, but improper prioritization.

I think you are overstating things. Luxuries are often funded by third party organizations like foundations, nonprofits, PTAs, sports booster clubs, local businesses (often through the PTA and boosters), and corporate donation programs.

[PetaltoMetal]

Originally Posted by NovaOne

I don't buy this. If a child in Fairfax county is not getting good nutrition, its due to parental neglect, not lack of food. The #1 food related problem among the poor is obesity, not malnutrition.

I also don't have a problem with children getting free lunches. As much as we pay in taxes every year, there should be plenty to go around.

The problem is that the schools are wasting money on things that bring very little marginal education value - expensive audio/visual/technology aids, rock climbing walls in gyms, and of course the top heavy administration structure.

Fairfax county has it better than most. Even with illegal immigrants, the county has one of the highest tax revenues that would make 99.99% of other US counties see unicorns and rainbows. So if Fairfax county cannot find money to ensure the quality of its core competency, then it is not due a lack of funds, but improper prioritization.

I agree with most of what you say but accommodating 3,000 students every year, often with special needs would have to be a burden.

According to the budget, since 2009, the cost of ESOL has gone up 43 percent and students eligible for free and reduced priced meals 33 percent. Look at ESOL below. That's an increase of $30 million more to budget annually for ESOL since 2009, plus the meals, plus new schools, teachers, busses, etc.

"In FY 2014, it is projected that 29,723 students, or 16.1 percent, will receive ESOL services in grades 1 through 12, an increase of 9,034 students, or 43.7
percent, since FY 2009. The additional cost of providing services in FY 2014 for
each ESOL student is $3,336."

They also say that 1 in 4 students is economically disadvantaged. This means that someone else's taxes might picking up a lot of their tab. So we have people coming in with more expenses and less money.

[NovaOne]

Originally Posted by PetaltoMetal

I agree with most of what you say but accommodating 3,000 students every year, often with special needs would have to be a burden.

According to the budget, since 2009, the cost of ESOL has gone up 43 percent and students eligible for free and reduced priced meals 33 percent. Look at ESOL below. That's an increase of $30 million more to budget annually for ESOL since 2009, plus the meals, plus new schools, teachers, busses, etc.

"In FY 2014, it is projected that 29,723 students, or 16.1 percent, will receive ESOL services in grades 1 through 12, an increase of 9,034 students, or 43.7
percent, since FY 2009. The additional cost of providing services in FY 2014 for
each ESOL student is $3,336."

They also say that 1 in 4 students is economically disadvantaged. This means that someone else's taxes might picking up a lot of their tab. So we have people coming in with more expenses and less money.

I don't understand the "additional cost" part. When I went through the ESOL program, it wasn't like I was taught by two teachers at the same time for some period of the day. This is especially true for middle and high school classes where kids have a fixed number of class periods. Do modern day ESOL students go to additional class periods over and beyond the standard ones? Do ESOL teachers get paid more than normal English teachers?

Learning English is not a special need. It's not like this is some difficult task that requires extra special skills, such as might be the case with dealing with kids that suffer learning disabilities. We are in the US, which is an immersive environment for those trying to learn English. English is also not a particularly difficult language to learn.

I agree that ESOL students primarily come from low income families who do not contribute an equitable amount of tax revenues in proportion to the services they consume. However, my take is that the population density of a region is directly proportional to its local economic activity, which results in tax revenues for the government. Fairfax county enjoys very favorable tax collection conditions given its favorable economic condition and large population of high income earners. Therefore if there is a shortfall in education funding versus spending, I do not believe the rational response is that there hasn't been enough funding, but that rather there's been excessive spending.

[NovaOne]

Originally Posted by slim04

I think you are overstating things. Luxuries are often funded by third party organizations like foundations, nonprofits, PTAs, sports booster clubs, local businesses (often through the PTA and boosters), and corporate donation programs.

I would love to learn more about this. Would you have any links to information on this? My reaction comes from strolling through my kids' school and other schools in the area and seeing things that are obviously expensive and not being used to much effect.

I know my kids' school run fundraisers frequently, which I gladly support and actively participate in. I also love supporting their specific classes with their projects because the money is spent almost entirely on the learning activities by the kids.

[CaliTerp07]

Originally Posted by NovaOne

I don't understand the "additional cost" part. When I went through the ESOL program, it wasn't like I was taught by two teachers at the same time for some period of the day. This is especially true for middle and high school classes where kids have a fixed number of class periods. Do modern day ESOL students go to additional class periods over and beyond the standard ones? Do ESOL teachers get paid more than normal English teachers?

My experience is middle school. I do not know what this looks like at an elementary level.

ESOL comes in many shapes and sizes. For some kids, it is separate, smaller classes. They'll take "ESOL level 1 science" instead of regular science. Moderate cost--the classes are generally smaller in an ESOL setting, since the kids need more help accessing the information.

For other kids it is a team taught class (where students are a mix of ESOL/general ed). Maybe they are awesome at math in their home country. Their math skills are superb, but they can't fully comprehend the explanations and instructions coming from the teacher. They're often in a team taught setting, so that there is a second teacher who can help catch them up if they start to look confused in the middle of a lesson, or who can take children aside in small groups and work on modified, less verbose problems with the kids while still assessing the same math standards. This seems to me like it would be the highest cost--you should still have a standard class size between 20-30 kids, but there are two teachers.

For still other kids, they go to general ed for all their classes, but instead of taking chorus or woodshop, they take an extra reading or writing class. Moderate cost again--the support classes are generally smaller than an elective (you can put 30+ kids in orchestra, but probably keep an intensive reading class at 20 or less).

No ESOL kid has extra class periods throughout the day. No ESOL teacher gets an extra stipend/salary bump for the certification.

[Middlin]

English is also not a particularly difficult language to learn.

Really? By whose standard?