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I think Saranac looks like it is going to be beautiful, but I have my reservations. I visited the site when they first opened more than a year ago and I was shocked when I re-visited Saranac this past weekend to find that there are less than a dozen built, but then again I am not surprised, for most of the other builders in the area lowered their prices in accordance with the real estate market crashing and the current economic status; however, Brookfield's Saranac has not and they made that very clear when I visited the model.
The minute I asked about price the salesman (mentioned in earlier posts for pulling disappearing acts to Morris farm) loudly announced that the prices have not gone down!
Yikes! It was an honest question considering.
My reservations are with Brookfield, they made a lot of idiotic, illegal and para-communistic decisions in Braemar where I was a former resident. Whatever happened to building a community of homes and selling the homes and that's it?
They negotiate deals with mediocre cable TV and data service firms, astronomical HOAs that don't hold up their end of the bargain. In fact, Braemar is one of the craziest set ups I have ever seen in that they have an overarching HOA along with many other HOAs for each 'village' as they so colorfully put it. Comcast has an exclusivity agreement with Prince William County, yet Brookfield denied Comcast when they wanted to put the lines in the community and awarded a 10 year contract to Lamont Digital Systems d.b.a. Gatehouse Networks. At this point, I would ask is the builder maybe deciding too much for the future residents? Then in their infinite wisdom they wrap that cost of that poorly run and technology deficient communications company into the HOA fees, so whether you want the service or not you pay for it which makes it harder to swallow paying for DirecTV, knowing your HOA fees include the poor service you didn’t order, and don't forget Comcast is not an option. All of this came out much later and a hearing was held, but of course enough residents didn't show up so, the existing provider was permitted to stay.
Fast forward to Saranac, while I was in the sales office a couple was inquiring about the lots in Phase 3, and they were told that they hope to begin them in 2010, they wanted to know if a pool could be built in the back yards, which in theory your darn right on a 1/2 acre lot, but the sales team told them they would have to call the HOA and find out. I cringed, here we go again, you buy a house starting in the 800's, probably over a mil when all is said an done and some HOA is going to decide if you can have a pool in your yard. BraeUSSR all over again! Then I hear the new smaller and less expensive line up they have introduced and seem to be pushing. Reaction to the market is to build them smaller and cram them together. Phase 3 will be the most desirable, with the most wooded area and closest to the lake. What about the lake? When the site was brand new, the road was not closed off as it is today and I was able to drive all the way back to where the phase 3 lots are going to be, with beautiful views of the lake and I took a short walk to the edge of the lake an got a feel for what that the community is going to be like, but this past weekend in the sales office I heard the sales staff telling people they don’t know about lake access and ‘they believe’ you can take canoes out on the like and little craft like that. They know public access is closed and any access will be up to the City of Manassas, the statement can be read here: http://www.dgif.virginia.gov/fishing/waterbodies/display.asp?id=82 If people, are making their decision based on the hopes of accessing this lake one day like those who live in Lake Anna, beware and don’t listen to what the sales staff is telling you all they want to do is sell homes and they are going to mislead you. Ask questions of people in the legal community, go to the City of Manassas who owns the reservoir, yes Lake Manassas is the reservoir for the City of Manassas, so it is carefully held. Look carefully at the plots and ask questions and it becomes obvious. There is plenty of trees behind the lots and there is no reason why the lots should not include the wooded area all the way up to the water, but the sales staff will tell you it is like free property to use you just won’t legally own it. I heard this out of the mouths of the two working in the office this past weekend; this is what they are telling respectful future buyers, and I bet it is because they are banking on the lake being opened to the public again in the future at which time Brookfield will come back and start offering the rest of the space between your lot and the water for…well I can only imagine.
The Saranac community is very beautiful and can be the perfect place for you as long as you have full disclosure about the property, and don’t have any of the false hopes that are being implied while in the sales office. Look around it is not the end all and if you are going to be house poor don’t cave into the greed. Brookfield could offer a lot more for the price you’re paying, but they are a nickel and dime organization. It is sad, the sales lady was commenting on what a wonderful job (John and Jane Doe) did on selecting their options to the young couple I mentioned earlier, when the older less inhibited salesman chimed in and expressed “yeah and they are never home to see it”.
In an earlier post SYG Associates was mentioned and I went to SYG’s website and am really impressed. SYG offers a lot of standard features that are very desirable; I think I will find out by paying them a visit. Brookfield certainly doesn’t do that. It is sad to see families come into the cabin model in Saranac and their mouths drop open and then they find out they are looking at 1.2m and what you get in the 800’s is a fraction of what you see in that model. It was the same situation with the Canterbury model in Braemar, it took them forever to sell that one and it was much lower then they originally asked.
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Thanks BPG for the thoughtful posting. We love Saranac -- we checked out SYG website and the homes look nice they just aren't the look we going for-- the Saranac homes are so homey looking and remind me of New England where I am from. The prices have come down a lot so I am not sure what that sales rep is saying. They are offering a lot of incentives.
That is good to hear! In hindsight, I did not specify when I entered the office when I last visited, which was day one so maybe the salesman thought I was asking did the prices change since the first of the year or something like that. Aren't incentives abundant right now? The auto industry sure is offering them up too! Yes, Saranac is beautiful I have not visited SYG, they just look very attractive.
I don't know about you, but what make the difference for me are trees. Do you remember climbing a tree as a child, and most yards had at least a tree if not a few?
Today, it appears that the standard MO is for a builder to buy up a piece a land and remove all of the trees, then build the homes on top of each other and give you hardly any lot size (yard) and charge premiums! I have grown to hate that. I have vowed to never live in an environment like that again, life is too short and we all pay too much to not have a nice bit of scenery when at our homes.
This is where I praise Brookfield and their decision to leave trees at Saranac, although some of it in the back is by Federal law for it is a Bald Eagle breeding area. In fact, they were unable to use the machinery within certain proximity at certain times as to not disturb our nation's bird.
Another older, but majestic neighborhood that has a bounty of trees is Snow Hill south of Gainesville off of 29, just inside the Warrenton limits I believe. If you get a chance drive through some time, it looks like the builders carefully carved out large lots inside of the trees and built beautiful homes.
I am tired of the corporate giants removing everything and squeezing homes as close as possible for greed. Doesn't this county have enough people in it already, e.g. RT29/Linton Hall/66 on any morning during the week?
Hopefully more will catch on and make neighborhoods look good again, rather than a bunch of housing.
My other comments were for the water lovers out there, a lot of false rumor was going around in the beginning and Saranac should not be compared to something like Lake Anna. Huge difference, in that you own the property all they up to and x number of feet of water, with docks and boat houses, etc. Too bad the City of Manassas is worried about terrorism, maybe the powers that be watch too much '24', but I don't think the City of Manassas is high on the terrorism hit list.
I wish you the very best in your endeavors and I don't know where you are in the process, but if you get a chance when spring comes and it is warmer drive to the back and walk past the gate with the sign that reads 'residents only' (you’re looking for a lost dogand go to the tree line in view of the lake. You will feel even better about living there; it is truly a scenic and peaceful environment.
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Thanks for all the recommendations. I totally agree about the trees. I hate the big box on small lot look. Hopefully in 15 years or so, some trees will fill in and those neighborhoods won't look so bad!
Brookfield changed their webpage www.brookfielddeals.com - it must be a typo however, it claims for Saranac "Adirondac-Style Homes from the upper 300's". If you go to the Saranac website - the cheapest I can find is the Sunnywood model starting at $619,900. Maybe they haven't revised the prices or put in the new lower priced model - and I'm guessing "upper 500's" might be what the new price would be. Maybe someone should go visit Saranac and say they saw the ad about the homes starting in the upper 300's and see what they say.
I was there last weekend. They are changing the development -- the condo-like townhouses weren't selling I guess (Sunnywood Models) so they are building smaller detached single family homes in their place. They range from 300's to 400's and basically look like the Morris Farm homes that have been modified to look "Adirondak Style". THey are still selling the bigger "cabins" I think the smaller ones are called "lodges" and "cottages"?
I was there last weekend. They are changing the development -- the condo-like townhouses weren't selling I guess (Sunnywood Models) so they are building smaller detached single family homes in their place. They range from 300's to 400's and basically look like the Morris Farm homes that have been modified to look "Adirondak Style". THey are still selling the bigger "cabins" I think the smaller ones are called "lodges" and "cottages"?
Ok I was wondering what was going to be changed. When they first built that first (only?) set of townhomes, I thought it was one big house. Then I thought it was 2 houses. Took me a while to figure out it was 4 townhomes. I forget the exact dollar figure on them, but at their price point I couldn't see anyone justifying spending that much on a townhouse.
Has anyone seen the diorama lit up at night at the entrance of Saranac? It's very pretty. The land the neighborhood is on used to be Camp Glenkirk. So there's a path that goes thru the woods and there are fire pits & abandoned building out there.
OK, wow - I never figured they would have that much lower priced homes in that development. That's a huge drop, but I guess sales had to be awfully slow with prices starting in the low 600's. With those new models being at the same price as models in Morris Farm - it is an interesting question as to which neighborhood would be the better one to buy in. I might have considered Saranac if the prices were in that range, as that's the range for the model house I bought (the Yardley model) in Morris Farm 3 months ago.
Ok I was wondering what was going to be changed. When they first built that first (only?) set of townhomes, I thought it was one big house. Then I thought it was 2 houses. Took me a while to figure out it was 4 townhomes. I forget the exact dollar figure on them, but at their price point I couldn't see anyone justifying spending that much on a townhouse.
Has anyone seen the diorama lit up at night at the entrance of Saranac? It's very pretty. The land the neighborhood is on used to be Camp Glenkirk. So there's a path that goes thru the woods and there are fire pits & abandoned building out there.
I didn't realize until recently the Sunnybrook model was actually a bunch of townhomes! Hard to imagine anyone paying that much for a townhouse.
The Saranac diorama is indeed very pretty at night. I find it odd on the other side that there isn't really any permanent sign marking Morris Farm at that entrance. I know there's nice signage and structures within Morris Farm and at other entrances, but it seems odd that at the Glenkirk entrance - the only thing is sales signs marking the neighborhood.
I find it odd on the other side that there isn't really any permanent sign marking Morris Farm at that entrance. I know there's nice signage and structures within Morris Farm and at other entrances, but it seems odd that at the Glenkirk entrance - the only thing is sales signs marking the neighborhood.
Good point... I've noticed that too. Maybe it has something to do with the school being on one corner. But come bring it up at an HOA meeting!
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and go to the tree line in view of the lake. You will feel even better about living there; it is truly a scenic and peaceful environment.
