Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Celebrating Memorial Day!
Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > Virginia > Northern Virginia
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 10-18-2009, 09:56 PM
 
3,164 posts, read 6,966,291 times
Reputation: 1279

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by tgbwc View Post
Full day kindergarten may end along with summer school (which was reduced last year), but I don't think they can do away with free/reduced lunches for those who qualify. Look for an increase in class size. As it was for '09-'10, there will probably be no COLA or step increase again next year for staff.

I think they should start by cutting funding which pays for students to take IB and AP testing. Although not a big budget item, I think parents of these students should pay for their kids to take these tests. Also, reduce or eliminate academic coaches. When teachers leave, bring these people back into the classroom. Cut busing to GT programs.
\

They won't stop paying for AP and IB tests because that would mean fewer Black and Hispanic kids taking those tests and FCPS racial gap would appear to be even larger. Can't happen. Won't happen.

For the same reason, they can't cut busing to GT programs because white and Asian kids would find rides, poor kids (more likely to be Black and Hispanic) would have to drop out of GT centers. Political no-no to reduce the number of Blacks in GT programs, and illegal to only provide busing for Blacks but not whites and Asians.

They can't end all day kindergarten because they would have to do something with all of those kindergarten teachers. They would still have to have jobs, so no cost savings there.

What is an academic coach? How many are there? Is this another program for Black students?

How about they cut the number of cluster offices from 8 to three, like they had until a few years ago? How about they cut in half the number of curriculum specialists? How about Jack Dale tries to get by with only 4 assistant superintendents, like the previous FCPS superintendents, rather than the 17 assistant supers that he has now? Who the heck needs 17 assistant superintendents? Even the President doesn't have that many cabinet offices! (Although Obama has three times that many ''Czars".)
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 10-18-2009, 10:01 PM
 
715 posts, read 2,090,305 times
Reputation: 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by Denton56 View Post
\

They won't stop paying for AP and IB tests because that would mean fewer Black and Hispanic kids taking those tests and FCPS racial gap would appear to be even larger. Can't happen. Won't happen.

For the same reason, they can't cut busing to GT programs because white and Asian kids would find rides, poor kids (more likely to be Black and Hispanic) would have to drop out of GT centers. Political no-no to reduce the number of Blacks in GT programs, and illegal to only provide busing for Blacks but not whites and Asians.

They can't end all day kindergarten because they would have to do something with all of those kindergarten teachers. They would still have to have jobs, so no cost savings there.

What is an academic coach? How many are there? Is this another program for Black students?

How about they cut the number of cluster offices from 8 to three, like they had until a few years ago? How about they cut in half the number of curriculum specialists? How about Jack Dale tries to get by with only 4 assistant superintendents, like the previous FCPS superintendents, rather than the 17 assistant supers that he has now? Who the heck needs 17 assistant superintendents? Even the President doesn't have that many cabinet offices! (Although Obama has three times that many ''Czars".)
Is there data on the demographics of GT students in ES and MS?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-18-2009, 10:01 PM
 
3,164 posts, read 6,966,291 times
Reputation: 1279
Quote:
Originally Posted by movingtodcfromseattle View Post
AMEN!

I always love to hear what people think about education cuts, when they don't even work in the schools!!! This thread is just a lot of hot air.
Oh? The people who pay the bills should not have a say in how their money is spent? Parents should have no say in how their children are taught, what they are taught, and by whom they are taught? Only educrats and teachers are allowed an opinion on a $2.2 BILLION budget of OUR money? The rest of us just need to fork over ever more of our money, and shut up about it?

Got love the attitudes of our ''public servants''. lol
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-18-2009, 10:19 PM
 
3,164 posts, read 6,966,291 times
Reputation: 1279
Quote:
Originally Posted by live_strong28 View Post
Is there data on the demographics of GT students in ES and MS?
I wish! The administration is VERY reluctant to give out such data. GT centers were expanded from about 5% to 14% with the hope of capturing more Black students. They also changed how they chose GT students, to use a more ''holistic'' and subjective approach to find students who are ''potentially'' gifted, for whom giftedness might not yet have emerged. Ten or twelve years ago they began a program called ''Young Scholars'' with extra teachers, free summer school, tutoring, for Black and Hispanic students, beginning in kindergarten, with the hope that more of those students would be ready for the GT Centers by third grade and TJ by 9th grade. I know that ONE of those Young Scholars got into TJ a couple of years ago. GT centers adopted remedial classes for those children who were below grade level but whom teachers hoped would eventually become gifted/academically advanced. None of their changes have really worked, but the numbers of Black students in GT programs has increased, just as the number of whites and Asians has tripled. You could ask Dr. Carol Horn, in the GT office (now called advanced academic programs) to provide you with the demographics for students in the GT centers, but I doubt that you would get them. However, such numbers must be provided to school board members, if you can find a school board member who will ask on your behalf. You will have to be very persistent. Even when a school board member requests such data it can take months, if they ever get it. Often staff will simply say that they have no way to compile such data, or they don't have time to compile it.

The bottom line is that FCPS has spent hundreds of millions over the years in a never ending effort to get more Black students into GT programs and TJ. ALL of their ideas have been a bust, yet they continue to throw good money after bad in failed programs. Heaven forbid that they actually use ANY program that has been tested and proven to work. They prefer to use our money on programs that they ''feel'' will work, programs that they love, but are a waste of our money.

Oh well, educrats have to work and eat too! As long as we keep feeding them, with out tax dollars, it's all good.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-18-2009, 10:25 PM
 
715 posts, read 2,090,305 times
Reputation: 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by Denton56 View Post
I wish! The administration is VERY reluctant to give out such data. GT centers were expanded from about 5% to 14% with the hope of capturing more Black students. They also changed how they chose GT students, to use a more ''holistic'' and subjective approach to find students who are ''potentially'' gifted, for whom giftedness might not yet have emerged. Ten or twelve years ago they began a program called ''Young Scholars'' with extra teachers, free summer school, tutoring, for Black and Hispanic students, beginning in kindergarten, with the hope that more of those students would be ready for the GT Centers by third grade and TJ by 9th grade. I know that ONE of those Young Scholars got into TJ a couple of years ago. GT centers adopted remedial classes for those children who were below grade level but whom teachers hoped would eventually become gifted/academically advanced. None of their changes have really worked, but the numbers of Black students in GT programs has increased, just as the number of whites and Asians has tripled. You could ask Dr. Carol Horn, in the GT office (now called advanced academic programs) to provide you with the demographics for students in the GT centers, but I doubt that you would get them. However, such numbers must be provided to school board members, if you can find a school board member who will ask on your behalf. You will have to be very persistent. Even when a school board member requests such data it can take months, if they ever get it. Often staff will simply say that they have no way to compile such data, or they don't have time to compile it.

The bottom line is that FCPS has spent hundreds of millions over the years in a never ending effort to get more Black students into GT programs and TJ. ALL of their ideas have been a bust, yet they continue to throw good money after bad in failed programs. Heaven forbid that they actually use ANY program that has been tested and proven to work. They prefer to use our money on programs that they ''feel'' will work, programs that they love, but are a waste of our money.

Oh well, educrats have to work and eat too! As long as we keep feeding them, with out tax dollars, it's all good.
It may be better that nobody knows what the demographics are because otherwise they will pump even more money into trying to get "underrepresented minorities" into GT programs. Instead of Advanced Academic Center (AAC) that they call GT now, it'll be another version of AAC....Affirmative Action Center.

BTW, why did they rename it from GT? I know in Maryland that they are trying to do away with the GT label b/c they prefer to think of all their kids as gifted....in one way or another.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-18-2009, 10:32 PM
 
3,164 posts, read 6,966,291 times
Reputation: 1279
Quote:
Originally Posted by live_strong28 View Post
It may be better that nobody knows what the demographics are because otherwise they will pump even more money into trying to get "underrepresented minorities" into GT programs. Instead of Advanced Academic Center (AAC) that they call GT now, it'll be another version of AAC....Affirmative Action Center.

BTW, why did they rename it from GT? I know in Maryland that they are trying to do away with the GT label b/c they prefer to think of all their kids as gifted....in one way or another.
Yes, the never ending goal of ALL educrats is to ''prove'' that ALL students are equal. No student is smarter, or harder working, than any other student. (Although some can still more athletic and/or more artistic. Sports awards are still ok, but not academic awards.) If they can do away with the GT label, and every other label, that furthers their goals. Of course that means that many students will not have their educational needs met, but their political agendas are so much more important than the mere education of children. Aren't they?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-18-2009, 10:48 PM
 
3,164 posts, read 6,966,291 times
Reputation: 1279
They don't like to make public the numbers because it then becomes obvious that the 11 special programs for Blacks are not working. The entire division devoted to closing the racial gap has been a bust. They waste 10's of millions every year.

Interesting article in today's Post on what might make a difference with Black kids in schools:
washingtonpost.com

It's their culture that is failing Black kids. Just as the Asian culture and families is why Asian kids succeed, it is Black culture and families that cause Black students to fail. No matter how hard educrats try to deny that, no matter how hard they try to make up for it, they will fail. Not all kids go to school with equal drive and equal backgrounds. Affirmative Action can't fix it either, or it already would have. It won't change until the Black culture wants to change it, and Black kids will continue to suffer for it.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-19-2009, 05:07 AM
 
Location: Fairfax County
1,534 posts, read 3,732,347 times
Reputation: 509
Quote:
Originally Posted by Denton56 View Post
I wish! The administration is VERY reluctant to give out such data.
I went to the FCPS web site and selected Academic Programs (top of the left navigation bar) and then Gifted and Talented (under Special Instructional Programs) and then went to Articles and Presentations of Interest -- this is titled School Board Presentation 2009:
http://www.fcps.edu/DIS/gt/pdfs/pres...ion%202009.pdf
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-19-2009, 10:51 AM
 
1,196 posts, read 2,940,776 times
Reputation: 803
Quote:
Originally Posted by Denton56 View Post
They don't like to make public the numbers because it then becomes obvious that the 11 special programs for Blacks are not working. The entire division devoted to closing the racial gap has been a bust. They waste 10's of millions every year.

Interesting article in today's Post on what might make a difference with Black kids in schools:
washingtonpost.com

It's their culture that is failing Black kids. Just as the Asian culture and families is why Asian kids succeed, it is Black culture and families that cause Black students to fail. No matter how hard educrats try to deny that, no matter how hard they try to make up for it, they will fail. Not all kids go to school with equal drive and equal backgrounds. Affirmative Action can't fix it either, or it already would have. It won't change until the Black culture wants to change it, and Black kids will continue to suffer for it.
Wow, your theory sounds very familiar to Hitlers theory on the Master Race. Great how that worked out for him, huh?

You gotta love the world wide web, allowing cowards to race bait and spew racism with no fear of retribution.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-19-2009, 11:10 AM
 
2,462 posts, read 8,938,706 times
Reputation: 1003
She's right.
Even the kids know it.
From Sunday's Post article:

"Why don't you guys study like the kids from Africa?"

"In a moment of exasperation last spring, I asked that question to a virtually all-black class of 12th-graders who had done horribly on a test I had just given. A kid who seldom came to class -- and was constantly distracting other students when he did -- shot back: "It's because they have fathers who kick their butts and make them study."

Another student angrily challenged me: "You ask the class, just ask how many of us have our fathers living with us." When I did, not one hand went up.

I was stunned. These were good kids; I had grown attached to them over the school year. It hit me that these students, at T.C. Williams High School in Alexandria, understood what I knew too well: The lack of a father in their lives had undermined their education. The young man who spoke up knew that with a father in his house he probably wouldn't be ending 12 years of school in the bottom 10 percent of his class with a D average. His classmate, normally a sweet young woman with a great sense of humor, must have long harbored resentment at her father's absence to speak out as she did. Both had hit upon an essential difference between the kids who make it in school and those who don't: parents."

And, of course, by "parents" he means "fathers." Single mothers often do a heroic job, but children need both their parents.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Settings
X
Data:
Loading data...
Based on 2000-2022 data
Loading data...

123
Hide US histogram


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > Virginia > Northern Virginia
Similar Threads

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:39 PM.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top