Waianae... is it really that bad?

[whtviper1]

Originally Posted by HawaiiWarriorFan

Some really twisted logic and ideology on here sometimes. If that logic or ideology was placed in a different context, the same people would be like "huh"? For example, imagine one day your walking down the street and a criminal mugs you. When you seek justice or ask him why? The criminal in court justifies his crime by saying "Your lucky, what are you complaining about? You should be happy, the mugger down the street would of mugged you and then put a knife in your gut". Of course I doubt anyone's response would be "hey ok you know your right" your free to go?

That example would make perfect sense if I dropped you in lets say, parts of Syria.

But doesn't really make sense for Hawaii.

Its a bit silly to deny Hawaii inevitably would have been taken over by someone had the United States not intervened and its not a leap that had another country taken over, then Native Hawaiian stuff would've been moot as it wouldn't even be a conversation starter. Does anyone really think Japan could've cared less about Native Hawaiian rights? Seriously?

The fact the US took over means Native Hawaiians can even have the discussion about some self rule like Indians. I suspect even most Native Hawaiians understand that basic concept.

[HawaiiWarriorFan]

Originally Posted by whtviper1

That example would make perfect sense if I dropped you in lets say, parts of Syria.

But doesn't really make sense for Hawaii.

Its a bit silly to deny Hawaii inevitably would have been taken over by someone had the United States not intervened and its not a leap that had another country taken over, then Native Hawaiian stuff would've been moot as it wouldn't even be a conversation starter. Does anyone really think Japan could've cared less about Native Hawaiian rights? Seriously?

The fact the US took over means Native Hawaiians can even have the discussion about some self rule like Indians. I suspect even most Native Hawaiians understand that basic concept.

Its bizarre to be arguing that Hawai'i would of eventually been taken over by others. There are many examples of small countries or island countries in our world that stil remain sovereign to this day. Even island countries better then Hawai'i. Who knows what would of happened had things been different?

There are many arguments justifying American actions. Like Hawai'i was weak military wise or it has strategic value so it wouldn't have remained sovereign. But again this is faulty thinking because there is evidence in our world of other countries just like Hawai'i in different parts of the world still sovereign. Ok Enough Said this thread isn't about sovereignty.

[whtviper1]

Originally Posted by HawaiiWarriorFan

There are many examples of small countries or island countries in our world that stil remain sovereign to this day. Even island countries better then Hawai'i. Who knows what would of happened had things been different?

But again this is faulty thinking because there is evidence in our world of other countries just like Hawai'i in different parts of the world still sovereign.

Like who? Who has a location similar to Hawaii in the Northern Hemisphere? Who are these island countries?

Bermuda comes to mind as most similar. (British Territory)

Guam? (US Territory)

Okinawa (Japan)

Singapore and Malaysia don't really count - they were British Territorities (until the 60's) that logistically couldn't be held on to....and now I'm drifting Southern Hemisphere....

Tahiti? (France)

Saipan? (US)

Which island countries have always been self governed that weren't taken over at one time? (Better than Hawaii as you put it) It is that very reason that practically every island country in the world has been a part of British Territory, France, Spain, etc that stands to reason it was inevitable that Hawaii would have the same fate considering the strategic location it has.

[Mikala43]

EVERY land mass / area has been taken over by other people going back thousands of years. This is the same thing.

No sovereignty discussions.

[McFrostyJ]

Aren't there currently many sovereign island states?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...vereign_states

That said, the current owners of these islands are most likely not the original owners.
The original owners are probably dead.