Safe place to live in the Youngstown area? (Warren, Cortland: movers, houses)
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
If you are considering living within the city limits of Youngstown, don't turn up your nose at Brownlee Woods, that southeast corner of the city south of Midlothian and between I-680 and Youngstown-Poland Road. The crime rate is low, and you're close to neighborhood stores and the freeway. There is also decent bus service for those that want or need it.
The violent crime rate in this area is low compared to the rest of the city. Not compared to Poland, Springfield, Lowelville etc. Big difference. The closest convenience store was robbed at gunpoint yesterday. That area is peppered with petty crime and it quickly turns into Boardman Twp (still Ytown schools).
Check the police blotter for the apartments on Wolosyn Circle and Oles Ave. Bdman Twp/even Poland schools and you'll find a ton of theft/domestics/possessions. Yes, light on UCR Part I offenses but still trouble.
The suburbs also has an amazingly lower crime rate. Astronomically lower. I'm not sure how that doesn't make your list of advantages.
In the 10 years I've lived in the city, I was the victim of one crime. If that's the amazing amount of additional crime I have to deal with living in the city, I'd rather take additional precautions, and deal with it, than deal with the lower quality of life--for me--in the suburbs.
Quote:
Schools also play a role in property values. So since you own two homes in the city school district the plight of the schools should interest you. For seniors and singles renting, no matter. You say you would utilize open enrollment/private but that puts a burden on the parents making the city even less desirable.
And the schools do interest me. I played a small part in the construction of 2 of their new buildings. This is purely hypothetical, since I'm single and have no kids, but I would consider sending them to YCSD, as sort of a trial run.
Quote:
What suburban sprawl? Crime has spread to the suburbs the same way it spread thru the city: seniors who worked in the mills fled for their lives/died leaving the children who had to move away for jobs sell their homes to anyone they could. A perfect example of this is Lansingville. That's why the areas of Struthers and Campbell that touch Ytown/the mills were the first to fall to the savages. The crime will only be stopped by people with a long term interest in maintaining their property values.
There are a number of reasons homes get sold to slumlords. The overall trend, though, is people find the closer in houses less and less desirable, driving down their values, and making them more easily attainable to slum lords who rent to whoever. In this very thread I remember someone suggesting to stay south of 224, when just being in Boardman used to be enough. At this rete, in 10 years, people will be saying "stay south of Western Reserve road." Sprawl/disinvestment is a vicious cycle that is only broken by maintaining or reinvestment in an area.
Quote:
This is why Poland selects who can and can't drive through its city. They know the undesirables have taken over Struthers to at least Maplewood (I would argue to St Nicks).
Quote:
It's not sprawl. It's a matter of the savages being offered more areas to rent further out after they've destroyed their current area.
And the reason slumlords are able to buy these houses, and rent to these "savages," is because the people who used to live there: died, were foreclosed on, moved away, or moved to a new house 5 miles down the road.
Your one crime in ten years is anecdotal. I could spend 50 years in Ytown and never be a victim of crime. I could spend 50 months in Poland and get a lone punk kid stealing a bike from my garage.
But it's all about the numbers. Ytown's crime rates are off the charts compared to Poland. You are playing a game of Russian Roulette and telling me it makes sense.
For anyone who drives, so yes excluding you, living in the city has absolutely no benefit.
On the sprawl:
You simply repeated my point. The unskilled, poor working immigrants were mainly confined to the S and E sides due to weather factors and the mills. Their kids were the first to flee cuz they didn't have access to jobs because those families never stressed formal education (which became a necessity in the late 70s). The savages took over, places adjacent to the jungle started to feel the pinch, and so the process repeated itself. That's how Lansingville went from a good Slovak working-class neighborhood to a ghetto in the last 25 to 30 years.
I don't know how far the influence of the savages will penetrate into Boardman. It remains to be seen. Plus we are running out of savages to cover the square mileage with the continuous pop. losses in the city and stagnant pops. on the outter reaches of the city's effect. They've destroyed Ytown which is I believe 55 sq miles. But only 66K remain behind enemy lines. Throw out the old timers who couldn't or refused to leave (you'll find them at St. Matthias, St. Pats, or St. Doms this Sunday), the city employees forced to live in the city, and apparently a few people like yourself. The rest are either criminals or those without the resources to make a better life.
Not sure what your reaction to the Poland driving reference intended to serve. Fact: only certain people are allowed to drive thru Poland.
And I never said Ytown was a terrible place to live. Unlike you, I'm connected to it. I grew up in the South Side ghettos while living in abject poverty. I attended Ytown city schools. I was a victim of non-violent crime on a regular basis because I couldn't stay awake or home 24/7. I was never the victim of a violent crime cuz I understood the streets. It's a bit easier to cherry pick what you want about the city when you move here in your 20s with a degree in one hand and a job in the other.
Ytown will always be my home. I would love to see it turn around and that's why I take exception to this fluffy outlook on the city you present. I got out cuz I taught myself how to play the game. Your outlook either overlooks or consigns the current native residents to a footnote.
I bet you're excited about the so-called shale boom for the city. Nevermind the fact nearly all the jobs with it require skilled labor and city school students can't even read. It might be...might...be good for the rural areas but for the city kids...no.
And by the way, I will continue to use the word savages cuz that's what they are. The ones who have raped, robbed, and murdered my friends/classmates get no sympathy from me. I'm very proud of what I've done with my life cuz I know very few people could have accomplished what I did which is get skills for a quality standard of living as well as earn two college degrees. I said no to that way of life and didn't put on rose color glasses either. Reality was there with me 24/7. I enjoy "fooling" the bourgeoisie in my daily life who believe I am of their ilk because I educated myself. Little do they know I'm just a poor street kid. They counted sheep going to sleep. I counted gunshots.
So here it is: Ytown is an amazing town from a historical, cultural, architectural, and natural (parts are really pretty) perspective. I'm not asking for a return to the glory days because that isn't happening. But building world class schools for kids who have no food and can't read is purely social masturbation. Having the BEST park in the nation is greatly diminished if an outsider can't go to it cuz if they come out at the wrong place they are in an area with crime rates 10X the national average.
This lipstick on a pig approach (btw see the news last night) you want to take ignores the dirty work. And that's because social/political/racial realities are too taboo for most to handle. I was forced to handle it.
Last edited by No_Recess; 12-13-2012 at 03:09 PM..
I'm going to be a naysayer of Y-Town and Warren for a long time, unless they can get a handle on their criminal element real quick. It's a shame how much decent older housing stock is lost to the ghetto people in both places. The way those towns are uncontrolled now, a neighborhood can be taken over and converted to ghetto in a year or two. I know people who bought on Tod Avenue in Y-Town and had to flee because of the black criminal element. They couldn't sell their house, and let the bank take it.
Yep, and then somebody can look it over and see what the patterns and the hot spots are.
I don't know the city of Youngstown well enough to give a street by street breakdown of it. It's rather new to us too.
All of Warren is not bad. We really like the part near East Market. The South East side seems very normal and middle calls with lots of very affordable homes.
I think the undesirable part is West Warren, Locals, correct me if I'm wrong,
I don't know the city of Youngstown well enough to give a street by street breakdown of it. It's rather new to us too.
All of Warren is not bad. We really like the part near East Market. The South East side seems very normal and middle calls with lots of very affordable homes.
I think the undesirable part is West Warren, Locals, correct me if I'm wrong,
The only part of Warren that could be considered middle class is North of Market, West of North Rd, East of Genesse, and south of Atlantic. The only SE exception is going east of Eastland to North. That does not include Eastland. The last house I sold had several people from Eastland looking at it. They wanted to get out of that area. Too many burglaries according to them. The southern part of that street, near Youngstown road is bad and it is moving north.
The houses from Youngstown Road to Market I would stay away from. The streets such as Kenmore, Williard, Kenilworth, Perkinswood, Trumbull, etc. A few blocks may seem fine now but in a few years you wouldn't want to be there.
There are a couple of streets west of Gennese, south of Atlantic to Market that seem nice but I don't see much future there either. The area around the Packard mansion and HHH's old house has some great homes but when the rentals start the area changes.
There is not much reason to live in Warren when you can live in parts of Howland for no more or a little more money. Better services and schools and much less crime. I have had property(several) in both Warren and Howland and there is no comparison.
There is not much reason to live in Warren when you can live in parts of Howland for no more or a little more money. Better services and schools and much less crime. I have had property(several) in both Warren and Howland and there is no comparison.
Your one crime in ten years is anecdotal. I could spend 50 years in Ytown and never be a victim of crime. I could spend 50 months in Poland and get a lone punk kid stealing a bike from my garage.
But it's all about the numbers. Ytown's crime rates are off the charts compared to Poland. You are playing a game of Russian Roulette and telling me it makes sense.
Sure my experience is anecdotal. But I'm glad I ignored the naysayers, and took the chance. You stand a greater chance of being killed in an automobile accident than I do of being murdered. Does that stop you from driving? Aren't you also playing a game of Russian Roulette?
Quote:
For anyone who drives, so yes excluding you, living in the city has absolutely no benefit.
In your opinion. I think we get that.
Quote:
On the sprawl:
You simply repeated my point. The unskilled, poor working immigrants were mainly confined to the S and E sides due to weather factors and the mills. Their kids were the first to flee cuz they didn't have access to jobs because those families never stressed formal education (which became a necessity in the late 70s). The savages took over, places adjacent to the jungle started to feel the pinch, and so the process repeated itself. That's how Lansingville went from a good Slovak working-class neighborhood to a ghetto in the last 25 to 30 years.
I never said you were wrong, just incomplete.
Quote:
I don't know how far the influence of the savages will penetrate into Boardman. It remains to be seen. Plus we are running out of savages to cover the square mileage with the continuous pop. losses in the city and stagnant pops. on the outter reaches of the city's effect. They've destroyed Ytown which is I believe 55 sq miles. But only 66K remain behind enemy lines. Throw out the old timers who couldn't or refused to leave (you'll find them at St. Matthias, St. Pats, or St. Doms this Sunday), the city employees forced to live in the city, and apparently a few people like yourself. The rest are either criminals or those without the resources to make a better life.
Just FYI, city employees aren't forced to live in the city anymore.
Quote:
Not sure what your reaction to the Poland driving reference intended to serve. Fact: only certain people are allowed to drive thru Poland.
Well, until I read the rest of your last post, I thought you were just a suburban snob making a potentially racist statement. But it sounds like you were one of the people not allowed to drive through Poland.
Quote:
And I never said Ytown was a terrible place to live.
No, you just suggested that no one should move there, and that only those who have no other choice should live there.
Quote:
Unlike you, I'm connected to it. I grew up in the South Side ghettos while living in abject poverty. I attended Ytown city schools. I was a victim of non-violent crime on a regular basis because I couldn't stay awake or home 24/7. I was never the victim of a violent crime cuz I understood the streets.
Sorry you had a rough life growing up here. I'm not sure why that makes your opinion of the city any more valid than mine.
Quote:
It's a bit easier to cherry pick what you want about the city when you move here in your 20s with a degree in one hand and a job in the other.
Isn't this true of ANY place?
Quote:
Ytown will always be my home. I would love to see it turn around and that's why I take exception to this fluffy outlook on the city you present. I got out cuz I taught myself how to play the game. Your outlook either overlooks or consigns the current native residents to a footnote.
What's "fluffy" about my outlook on the city? How am I marginalizing current native residents? How can the city ever hope to rebound, if real natives--like yourself--tell outsiders to stay away?
Quote:
I bet you're excited about the so-called shale boom for the city. Nevermind the fact nearly all the jobs with it require skilled labor and city school students can't even read. It might be...might...be good for the rural areas but for the city kids...no.
No, I'm not excited about the shale boom, but for different reasons than you, apparently.
Quote:
And by the way, I will continue to use the word savages cuz that's what they are. The ones who have raped, robbed, and murdered my friends/classmates get no sympathy from me. I'm very proud of what I've done with my life cuz I know very few people could have accomplished what I did which is get skills for a quality standard of living as well as earn two college degrees. I said no to that way of life and didn't put on rose color glasses either. Reality was there with me 24/7. I enjoy "fooling" the bourgeoisie in my daily life who believe I am of their ilk because I educated myself. Little do they know I'm just a poor street kid. They counted sheep going to sleep. I counted gunshots.
So your negative experiences within the city made you dislike it. My positive experiences within the city made me like it.
Quote:
So here it is: Ytown is an amazing town from a historical, cultural, architectural, and natural (parts are really pretty) perspective. I'm not asking for a return to the glory days because that isn't happening. But building world class schools for kids who have no food and can't read is purely social masturbation. Having the BEST park in the nation is greatly diminished if an outsider can't go to it cuz if they come out at the wrong place they are in an area with crime rates 10X the national average.
Yes, and these are reasons why someone might want to live here.
As far as coming out of the park at the wrong place, you're using hyperbole again. There aren't gangs of "savages" waiting at park entrances to pounce on unsuspecting outsiders who took a wrong turn.
Quote:
This lipstick on a pig approach (btw see the news last night) you want to take ignores the dirty work. And that's because social/political/racial realities are too taboo for most to handle. I was forced to handle it.
My love is architecture. So, doing my part to improve the city involves saving buildings, restoring houses, helping others work on their houses, hiring locals for jobs I don't want to/can't do, etc. There are others who have different interests/loves, and they do their things to improve the city in their own way. One thing I'm sure will NOT help the city, is telling people that there is no reason for anyone to live there.
The only part of Warren that could be considered middle class is North of Market, West of North Rd, East of Genesse, and south of Atlantic. The only SE exception is going east of Eastland to North. That does not include Eastland. The last house I sold had several people from Eastland looking at it. They wanted to get out of that area. Too many burglaries according to them. The southern part of that street, near Youngstown road is bad and it is moving north.
The houses from Youngstown Road to Market I would stay away from. The streets such as Kenmore, Williard, Kenilworth, Perkinswood, Trumbull, etc. A few blocks may seem fine now but in a few years you wouldn't want to be there.
There are a couple of streets west of Gennese, south of Atlantic to Market that seem nice but I don't see much future there either. The area around the Packard mansion and HHH's old house has some great homes but when the rentals start the area changes.
There is not much reason to live in Warren when you can live in parts of Howland for no more or a little more money. Better services and schools and much less crime. I have had property(several) in both Warren and Howland and there is no comparison.
The only part of Warren that could be considered middle class is North of Market, West of North Rd, East of Genesse, and south of Atlantic. The only SE exception is going east of Eastland to North. That does not include Eastland. The last house I sold had several people from Eastland looking at it. They wanted to get out of that area. Too many burglaries according to them. The southern part of that street, near Youngstown road is bad and it is moving north.
The houses from Youngstown Road to Market I would stay away from. The streets such as Kenmore, Williard, Kenilworth, Perkinswood, Trumbull, etc. A few blocks may seem fine now but in a few years you wouldn't want to be there.
There are a couple of streets west of Gennese, south of Atlantic to Market that seem nice but I don't see much future there either. The area around the Packard mansion and HHH's old house has some great homes but when the rentals start the area changes.
There is not much reason to live in Warren when you can live in parts of Howland for no more or a little more money. Better services and schools and much less crime. I have had property(several) in both Warren and Howland and there is no comparison.
We are moving TO Central Parkway Ave., SE, one block off of E. Market Street. I thought it's been established that this area is good. We have met the neighbors and they are definitely middle class and home owners, employed, and decorate their homes nicely and tastefully. How can you predict in a couple of years you won't want to live there?
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
And the reason slumlords are able to buy these houses, and rent to these "savages," is because the people who used to live there: died, were foreclosed on, moved away, or moved to a new house 5 miles down the road.
