[McBain II]

Originally Posted by pheaton

Which laws were enacted and enforced that limited their rights? There was a lack of laws, that was the problem. The mis-interpretation of the current law was the problem. The addition of and the clarification of laws is what freed the slaves and ended segregation.

What difference does it make? Same result.

You certainly had more opportunities back then if you were white. I'm glad that we ultimately realized that slavery was wrong.

And a generation or so from now we'll say the same thing about gay marriage.

But owning people and forcing them to work against their will is still different than not having a marriage recognized.

That's like saying felony assault is better than murder.

This is true, so lets not make it worse. Why do you think the traditional family is going away? Because it's being eroded by our disposbale do what you want society.

Gay marriage would have absolutely zero effect on this.

Where are the benefits going to come from? By reducing the benefits that recognized marriages already enjoy.

How are these benefits going to be reduced?

The right thing according to the law.

Which, as I've said before, doesn't hold much weight with me.

If you want a energy tax credit on your house, you put in windows or siding or whatever to get that credit. You don't just ask that the law be changed to give you a credit for doing nothing.

That assumes there isn't a law that stops you from making those energy efficient changes. Gays don't want the benefits for nothing. They want the run to do the things that earn them those benefits.

They want the law to change to specifially accomodate their lifestyle.

Yes. They want the rights we have. Nothing more and nothing less.

Changing the law in this way would benefit only themselves, so yes it's special treatment.

Doing away with slavery and civil rights violations only benefited blacks and other minorities. Should that have stopped us?

True, but certain laws are based on morals

The only time "morals" should be used in creating laws is when someone's lack of morals are having a clear and legitimate negative impact on someone/something else, not when it offends someone's prejudice or religious beliefs.

Call it the common sense rule.

No, it's not. Having the freedom to eat in the same dining room as white people is not the same as getting a tax credit for marrying your gay lover.

It absolutely is the same thing. You're denying rights to a group of people because of something they have no control over.

So what? To Johnny it's perfectly fine. I know it sounds stupid, but if the gay people really love each other, why does the legal status matter? And if it does matter that much, why not just go to a state that recognizes it?

Because like I said, just like Johnny's little driver's license it's ultimately a sham with no real value.

Ok, then if a gay person is marrying only for the benefit, why can't the gay couple find another gay couple of the opposite sex and "legally" marry each other, get the benefit and continue living with their partners. If you take love out of it, it's easy, just find someone that wants to be married only for the benefit and marry them.

Wow.

I guess I'm wondering, how does it help the state?

You said it wasn't in the state's best interest, so I assumed you would be the one answering this question.

The state is into encouraging people to have kids and raise them to get jobs, buy houses, and in the end, pay more taxes.

You're kidding right?

[Raphael07]

Ok you know what? ********** charade! I never chose to be gay! EVER!!! Why would I?! And you know what?! I hate it so freaking much!!! I want to be straight, I've tried for years and years and years! So much to the point that I started to become sick physically and mentally! I've prayed and done everything! But it is not changing! Ever! I wish it could but it won't! So to say I can't be recognized as marriage with someone I'll end up loving is just sickening! People like you treat us like we aren't human! Do you have any idea how hard it is to be gay?! Of course not because you're the lucky ones! But I will not let people like you, EVER strike my love down. True Love is perfect, and you can never deny that!

[Calvinist]

Originally Posted by Go Ne

Ok you know what? ********** charade! I never chose to be gay! EVER!!! Why would I?! And you know what?! I hate it so freaking much!!! I want to be straight, I've tried for years and years and years! So much to the point that I started to become sick physically and mentally! I've prayed and done everything! But it is not changing! Ever! I wish it could but it won't! So to say I can't be recognized as marriage with someone I'll end up loving is just sickening! People like you treat us like we aren't human! Do you have any idea how hard it is to be gay?! Of course not because you're the lucky ones! But I will not let people like you, EVER strike my love down. True Love is perfect, and you can never deny that!

Who is trying to say you can't love someone? You can choose to love as many or whomever you want.

But to equate that with marriage on a 1 to 1 basis is just not correct. I know many people that have gotten married for reasons other than love, and I know many people that love each other but choose to never marry.

[DTO Luv]

So if you can marry for things other than love and for love, what is wrong with gay people being able to marry the person of their choice for love or otherwise?

[pheaton]

Originally Posted by DTO Luv

So if you can marry for things other than love and for love, what is wrong with gay people being able to marry the person of their choice for love or otherwise?

They can marry. The state just wont recognize it.

[Omaha Rocks]

Originally Posted by DTO Luv

So if you can marry for things other than love and for love, what is wrong with gay people being able to marry the person of their choice for love or otherwise?

So what's keeping you from driving across the river and getting married in Iowa?

I know that ideally you'd like to have gay marriage legal in Nebraska. But for the time being, what's keeping you from just going across and into Iowa? Seriously?

[Calvinist]

Originally Posted by DTO Luv

So if you can marry for things other than love and for love, what is wrong with gay people being able to marry the person of their choice for love or otherwise?

Because we, as a society, have decided we don't want to allow 2 men or 2 women to marry each other. Just like 9 women and 9 men can't marry each other, or 1 man and 9 women, etc. We don't care to define a new type of marriage that is different for a small minority.

That's just the way it is. Drive to Iowa if you want it to be all legal.

Why are you so determined to get me to approve of your lifestyle?

[McBain II]

Originally Posted by Calvinist

Because we, as a society, have decided we don't want to allow 2 men or 2 women to marry each other. Just like 9 women and 9 men can't marry each other, or 1 man and 9 women, etc. We don't care to define a new type of marriage that is different for a small minority.

That's just the way it is. Drive to Iowa if you want it to be all legal.

Why are you so determined to get me to approve of your lifestyle?

Was it okay when society decided that they wanted to limit or remove civil liberties for blacks and other minorities?

[Calvinist]

Originally Posted by Bosco55David

Was it okay when society decided that they wanted to limit or remove civil liberties for blacks and other minorities?

Nope. That's why they have the same rights as white people. Kind of like the gay/straight argument today. The same rights apply--no more, no less. Society has determined we want it that way. And it's the decent, moral thing to do.

[McBain II]

Originally Posted by Calvinist

Nope. That's why they have the same rights as white people.

Thanks to people fighting against that prejudice and securing the rights they had previously been denied.

Kind of like the gay/straight argument today. The same rights apply--no more, no less.

Then why can't two gay people get married.

Society has determined we want it that way. And it's the decent, moral thing to do.

But you agreed that is was wrong when we were limiting the civil rights of blacks and other minorities (done on the "moral" and "decent" argument) but it's okay to do it to gays?

Seriously, why don't you people just come out and admit "Hey, I don't want you ******s to get married simply because I don't like you!" or whatever your reasoning is, and stop trying to hide behind the bible or morals.

Hell, at least then I would respect your honesty.