Honest Opinions on Moving to PNW (OR vs WA) (Portland: low income, sales)

[stabbingwestward]

I've posted a couple of things in the WA forum because my family wants to relocate to the PNW in a couple of years. We had sticker shock looking at the prices of homes in the WA cities we found interesting, but I guess coming from Texas, we would. We are looking for 300k and under around a fairly large city/town. We are considering Vancouver, WA the strongest contender at the moment.

I'm in IT, my wife is medical. She can get a job almost anywhere by asking, me not so much. I've looked at the WA vs OR tax situation. We like the idea of maybe living in WA and driving to OR to save on sales tax. I hear that's a popular thing to do.

We have some family in WA around the Seattle and Leavenworth areas, but that reason alone doesn't tie us to any particular city choice. It's nice they would be within a half day's drive.

What compelling reason(s) would we have to consider OR in lieu of WA? What are the pros and cons, please? The more info we can get from people on the ground the better. We will of course, visit any areas of interest before making the move to confirm choices.

Looking forward to hearing from you guys...

[Billy_J]

They say "Location, Location, Location"...

I'm older and wiser - I say "Traffic, Traffic, Traffic" (if you are moving to the Portland/Vancouver area).

With that said, RENT someplace, anyplace (maybe stick your stuff in storage). Get your jobs, and get to know the area for 6 months or a year. THEN decide where you want to settle down. Part of that will be morning/evening traffic - getting to your jobs and going home. One area may be wonderful, another a daily nightmare.

[stabbingwestward]

Originally Posted by Billy_J

They say "Location, Location, Location"...

I'm older and wiser - I say "Traffic, Traffic, Traffic" (if you are moving to the Portland/Vancouver area).

With that said, RENT someplace, anyplace (maybe stick your stuff in storage). Get your jobs, and get to know the area for 6 months or a year. THEN decide where you want to settle down. Part of that will be morning/evening traffic - getting to your jobs and going home. One area may be wonderful, another a daily nightmare.

Thank you. That is sage advice. We did want to rent for at least a year, maybe two to be certain. It also gives us time to save more.

Is the Portland traffic fairly hideous? I wonder if people will drive less if/when that mileage measure thing in OR passes.

[Sherwoody]

Originally Posted by stabbingwestward

Thank you. That is sage advice. We did want to rent for at least a year, maybe two to be certain. It also gives us time to save more.

Is the Portland traffic fairly hideous? I wonder if people will drive less if/when that mileage measure thing in OR passes.

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[Billy_J]

Originally Posted by stabbingwestward

...Is the Portland traffic fairly hideous? I wonder if people will drive less if/when that mileage measure thing in OR passes.

Portland traffic can be a nightmare... Or no problem. Depends on where you are going to and at what time. You will see that working at one location, and living the opposite direction form everyone else going there in the morning, can be wonderful!

There are other options too. Like the MAX train and buses which might come along every 5 minutes in some areas at rush hour.

As for the mileage thing, no one is going to drive less. That just makes people with electric cars pay their fair share of road taxes. Currently if they don't use any gas, they are not paying any "gas tax" - which goes for road maintenance and so forth. It is a good thing for the state to have the money to maintain the roads/bridges!

[pdxMIKEpdx]

Originally Posted by stabbingwestward

Thank you. That is sage advice. We did want to rent for at least a year, maybe two to be certain. It also gives us time to save more.

Is the Portland traffic fairly hideous? I wonder if people will drive less if/when that mileage measure thing in OR passes.

Unless you constantly drive a vehicle that gets way less than 20mpg, the costs even out or are more expensive.

High miles per gallon vehicles will pay a lot more, which I think is fair.

20mpg x 1.5cents per mile = 30 cents per gallon

Current tax = 30 cents per gallon.


A Hybrid car that gets 50 miles per gallon would pay a 75 cents per gallon fuel tax.

[oregonwoodsmoke]

And the millions of tourists will pay no gas tax at all because they aren't wired into the system

[j_k_k]

Originally Posted by stabbingwestward

What compelling reason(s) would we have to consider OR in lieu of WA? What are the pros and cons, please? The more info we can get from people on the ground the better. We will of course, visit any areas of interest before making the move to confirm choices.

Both sides have dry sides, wet sides, mountain ranges, and coastline. Culturally, they differ more east to west than between the two states; Walla Walla more resembles Pendleton than either resembles Seattle or Portland. Your biggest differences relate to laws and taxation, as I see it.

Having lived in both, I prefer Washington's high sales tax to Oregon's high income tax, because I am happier with any tax that doesn't involve filing a return and dealing with a Department of Revenue (just one more governmental agency that could have an excuse to mess with me). I think Washington has better education overall, but that Oregon probably gets the nod on environmental protection. The Washington coast is much more deserted, and probably colder and rainier (which would explain that). Washington is nearer to Canada, which can be fun, though Vancouver (WA) is basically a Portland suburb so the advantage doesn't really factor.

Portland has better-realized mass transit than Seattle, definitely. It has a slightly different vibe, though only slightly. I don't yet know how efficient Oregon's legislature is, but I have a hard time imagining it more inept/transparently undemocratic than Washington's. Washington gets a lot of 'citizen' initiatives, and the legislature just ignores the ones they don't like, and gets away with it. A budget crisis seems to be its natural state. It screwed up the changeover from state to privatized liquor stores, and then screwed up the legalization of weed.

Seattle and Portland traffic both suck with a powerful suckage. You won't have to live in Van long to realize you simply will not cross the river for any shopping much under four figures, especially groceries, since standard groceries are not subject to WA sales tax. And you may take it for gospel that there's a system in place to make sure you don't go buy your car in Oregon thinking you'll avoid WA sales tax if you're a Washington resident. You'd have to license it in OR, and I bet some people try that, but I bet the penalty for getting caught is most unpleasant. Government loves its money big time.

Both beat Idaho six ways from Sunday (not that you asked). Idaho is Ayn Rand's wet dream, and while it has lower property taxes for the most part (thanks to the homeowner's 'exemption'), it has both sales and state income taxes, which combined are a heavier burden than either WA or OR's tax load.

[texasdiver]

I've lived most of my life in both states. In Eugene, Portland, And Seattle.

Washington is more conservative and pro business and has a huge military presence and defense industry compared to Oregon which hasn't had a military base of any kind since WW2 or so. Washington also has a huge maritime and fishing industry (the big Alaskan Fisheries are mostly based in Seattle). Washington also has a populated east side with actual cities due to the presence of water. Eastern Oregon is mostly unpopulated desert with nothing like Spokane or the Tri cities.

Oregon has more progressive land use laws and public access to the coast. So the countryside tends to be prettier with less suburban sprawl ano there is much better public access to beaches and much better state parks.

Schools are better funded in Washington which may be an issue if you have kids. And Washington has better universities.

The greater Portland area is the only place in Oregon that really has a reasonably vibrant and diverse economy whereas Washington has a greater variety of places that are economically robust such as Tacoma and Spokane so you aren't just stuck with Seattle.

Generally speaking if you are looking to get ahead in life then Washington will probably be teh better choice. If you are independently wealthy, retired, or looking to live some sort of alternative low income lifestyle then Oregon might be better.

Another piece of advice. If you chose the Portland or Seattle areas then for God sakes live near your work or make sure you have alternative transit options like biking or light rail because car commuting in both cities is hellish and only going to get worse.

[Nell Plotts]

MicroSoft will be 'restructuring' significantly in the next year or two and laid off employees typically find new positions by networking. I am not so sure that a tech professional without local contacts in Seattle metro will find employment pickings as ripe at they were a few years ago. Also, housing prices in Seattle are higher than Portland.

Your challenge will be finding an IT job in Vancouver. As others have mentioned lower housing costs in Vancouver are a reflection of the cost and frustration of commuting to Portland... and if you work in Oregon you will pay Oregon's income tax. You might find homes in your price range around Oregon City or Canby. You will still have (for us) a commute to Portland but it won't be nightmarish.

As others have mentioned you may find more housing in your price range in Tacoma or Olympia. I have never had any interest in living in either city and would choose to live just west of the Tacoma Narrows Bridge if I worked in Tacoma.