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Bs on the moronic. Its moronically SELFISH of you to have kids that you can't afford to raise properly, THAT'S what's moronic. We've had birth control (almost free) and abortions for 40 years now. Anyone can look and see what raising a kid (properly) costs (ie, 1/2 milion $ per kid). To hell with you people who use govt/guns to force other people to pay for raising (or welfare'imprisonment) of YOUR kids. Either pay for them yourself, or don't be a pig's butt by having any!
I see that your mommy didn't give you many hugs growing up. I'm sorry.
I don't know much about their sources or anything, but it's saying only 77% of parents plan to help their kids out with college.
Why have a kid if you don't want to (or have the means to) help the kid succeed?
Say what you like about college, but good luck moving anywhere without a college degree.
Even a masters degree is becoming a pre req for a lot of good jobs.
Being successful has nothing to do with a college education as many burger-flippers at McDonalds will tell you. Success has to do with teaching your child how to set goals and achieve them.
There are many successful people who do not have a college education. I don't think it is any kind of prerequisite for success.
My father attended college as an adult and paid his own way through. I was very fortunate to have a GI BILL "assist" me with my education, but plenty of that money came out of my own pocket, believe me. I think that every person should be responsible for their own education and be willing to pay for it.
Bachelor degrees are so common now that I think to stand out you need to have a masters degree in addition. As for financing, if I was to do it over again I'm sure I would be going to a cheaper community college for the first two years for general education requirements and then finish the next two years at a state university.
In the 1970s I went to a state university. My dad had the G.I. Bill and since he was disabled as a war vet, my college at the state level was taken care of. I also lived with my parents - it was cheaper that way. My aid was not a means for me to buy a car or move out. Just not enough. But covered books and clothes and some more.
After earning my bachelor degree I got a job and then my employer paid my way (except for the books) for my MS degree.
Smart young people are also interning. I am all for it. I saw several situations where interns turned into employees. Only recently did one have to be let go - not because he was not a producer - he is very bright and capable. But because the company itself was suffering from cutbacks by the customers. I left that company because of the cutbacks, too.
It's a double edged sword. If you pay for everything for your kid they very well may take it for granted, pick a stupid major with no thought for the future, and have an entitlement attitude throughout life and not work hard to attain their goals (waste their time in school partying, etc.). On the other hand, if a young adult has no help at all they're more likely to drop out or never finish college in the first place.
Personally I'd like to see my kids take at least some direct responsibility for college costs, I think it would be a useful wake up call for them. As my husband says, the school of hard knocks is the best school to learn from.... and the one school no one wants to attend.
But his opinion is to pay for everything for them, so that's probably what's going to happen.
Picking a stupid major wasn't really a problem until the graduating class of May 2008. From the "go to college" push started until then virtually any major worked and would net someone a pretty decent job. The graduates of May 2008 however would find it rather hard to find jobs regardless of major. Now yes, some majors did better but if we say that we have not enough nursing majors, perhaps too many people will flood that field or if we put am emphasis on STEM, that can over-saturate and have too many people in. It's not an easy answer.
The rest I somewhat agree with. College should be provided at least half-way by parents with provisions (if a scholarship is out of the question.) The provisions I am talking about are like if you screw up in a class, you pay to retake the course on your own dime; if you get put into rehab for partying, you pay us back; if you chose a high end school, you pay for it, etc.
I've been actively trying to meet people at my college who are paying their own way. Their life is much much harder than mine (and probably will continue to be harder) mainly because of their parents (And their college major, but that's another story).
I.e if you aren't an engineering/cs or a finance/accounting major, chances are you aren't going to get a paid internship. You pretty much need internships (real life experience) to land the entry level job. If you pay for everything yourself, you can't afford to work for free.
You are directly putting your kid at a distinct disadvantage. Why do you feel that passing along your genes is so important that you are willing to hurt your child's chances at a good life?
Actually, that's false for every internship. I was an English major and I worked an internship that was paid. It was minimum wage, but it paid. I worked two jobs during college - my parents paid for the first four years, but I switched majors and went for 5.5 years as an undergrad - I paid my last year and a half on my own with some financial aide. I commuted to a state school and lived with my parents (still do), so that helped costs.
However, I have seen some internships in finance that was paid. It might depend on the area - in my area, there are some paid internships. It's all about finding and researching. Even if they are unpaid internships, others can still work another job and of course, loans.
And I am still only working part time. I have a writing degree and I can't seem to land a job even with 8 years in a library (still there) and the 2.5 years at the internship. Not sure if it's because I'm unhappy where I currently live, but don't have the money to move and well, I don't want to move broke and jobless. I rather have a job here, save, gain more experience and then move when I'm ready.
Also, parents don't have to pay for anything once the child turns 18 - at age 18, the child is an adult. Some parents don't want to pay for an adult child, especially if they don't have the money. I've worked with many people who paid for everything on their own and honestly, they were more thankful/grateful than someone who was handed something on a silver plate. There's something humbling about doing things yourself. And yes, I'm one of those people who think college isn't for everyone and college shouldn't be made out to be a big deal like it is now.
from the link on post#1:
"About 77% of parents say they plan to help their child pay for college"
Planning on helping is FAR different from "paying for college".
Still a great gift to them, IF they choose to do that. It should not, however, be expected unless the parents have already said so. I have never assumed anyone, even my parents, would give me anything after I started earning my own money and moved out.
I guess you missed the part where I said my plan is to work and go to school [btw, I'll be making 60k/year. College wasn't wasted on me because my parents paid my way. I'm also pretty sure I'm not the only one. ], but that's really besides my point. I'm also not saying parents need to pay for graduate school. I also never said that parents need to pay 100% of college costs, but that got pinned on me anyways. I said that college is a new necessity of the modern world ( there's only like 4 people here who claim success without a college degree and they were all over 50. Since America became a fully service economy, it has become a different world. The rest told a story of how they struggled to get a college degree. The path to middle class life started with the college degree. )
Why would you willingly let your kid struggle this much to get this degree? So far the answer is "build character" or "retirement is more important". I personally have worked a part time job throughout college. It hasn't really built any character into me, so I don't really see that, but whatever. Saying retirement is more important is putting yourself first. A lot of what I do, I do with the idea that if I have a kid, I want the kid to have a nice life and a decent chance at success. Like I'm not studying what I love in college, I'm studying what is practical and marketable. I want the ability to provide well for my kid (if I have one).
Personally, I think the more logical answer is to not reproduce. I don't want to create a child just to see him/her struggle. I really don't know anyone who pays for college fully by themselves who isn't struggling more than what is necessary. Is the kid who is now 100k in debt to land the same job as me in a better position?
Granted necessary in this case is subjective. Someone here was talking about taking ice water baths in order to stay focused in school because they worked so much and had so much homework they couldn't get more than a few hours of sleep a night. It's really weird to me that a parent would think this is good and want their kid to live like that. I'd rather not have a kid than allow him/her to live like that anytime during their lifetime. No one needs that kind of stress.
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It's pretty short sided of anyone to think just because you're financially dependent on your parents at 23, it's equal to someone living in their mom's basement at 40. For example, 23 is around the age of a 1st year medical student. If someone's parents are paying for medical school, would you consider this person a loser? Because that's exactly what you are saying. By the time that person is 28/29, s/he is going to be making well into the 150k+ range (probably more with the aging baby boomers). I highly doubt they will need their parents then.
Maybe I live in a different world than you, but I would like to associate with doctors. I find them immensely successful people.
It doesn't seem like you are thinking much in the long term nor are you looking at the bigger picture . Sure, a 23 year old with no plans for the future or getting a graduate degree in medieval studies (or the like) living on their parents dime may or may not amount to much. I'm not really arguing that.
In case you didn't know, analytics is an up and coming field, and it's pretty common to make around 100k/year after a few years of working the field after graduation. The program will cost a total of 75k, but the rate of return is high. My parents care to invest in my future. They are supporting me now while I get my education. Once I fully complete it, I'll be more than able to support myself.
To be honest, I think this is a class difference. I'm very sorry to have bought this topic up in this forum. This obviously isn't the place for it.
You are right, it is a "class" difference.
With every new post you add to this discussion you prove that you have none.
I think it depends on the kid. My cousins pay for their children to go to college and all three are well grounded, realistic people. They are not into drugs or alcohol. They, also, work during summer.
Grouping everyone under one label is a mistake. And it can be a serious mistake.
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