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What's 'affordable housing'? Section 8? $1100 a month?
Preserved units
I am highly skeptical that they will actually follow through with it, really feels like they're trying to bargain their way for approval and appease the anti-arena crowd.
I am highly skeptical that they will actually follow through with it, really feels like they're trying to bargain their way for approval and appease the anti-arena crowd.
Just out of curiosity, why do we feel we should offer "affordable housing" in the main section of our city? This should be an area (especially if the arena is built) where millionaires live and pay huge amounts of taxes to our city - further helping fund our broke city that desperately needs money. Can't we just have affordable housing a little further from ground zero of our city and ask people to take the bus to work or whatever? I take buses and the subway all the time. Septa is pretty good - I can get to Pennsport to Northern Liberties in like 15 minutes on an air-conditioned bus that picks me up on the corner of my street. This way we could actually develop areas that desperately NEED development, house people that barely pay any taxes in these areas, while still reaping the benefits of taxes and spend from wealthy people who might want to walk to the arena. H*ll, some may live on the Main Line and just buy a condo there. They'd still pay full board real estate taxes. Why do we want to promote under-funding of our city? It seems like a very strange strategy to me. Do we actively want our city to remain broke and thus be hamstrung on providing social services, infrastructure improvements and school improvements for city residents? I don't want that.
Just out of curiosity, why do we feel we should offer "affordable housing" in the main section of our city? This should be an area (especially if the arena is built) where millionaires live and pay huge amounts of taxes to our city - further helping fund our broke city that desperately needs money. Can't we just have affordable housing a little further from ground zero of our city and ask people to take the bus to work or whatever? I take buses and the subway all the time. Septa is pretty good - I can get to Pennsport to Northern Liberties in like 15 minutes on an air-conditioned bus that picks me up on the corner of my street. This way we could actually develop areas that desperately NEED development, house people that barely pay any taxes in these areas, while still reaping the benefits of taxes and spend from wealthy people who might want to walk to the arena. H*ll, some may live on the Main Line and just buy a condo there. They'd still pay full board real estate taxes. Why do we want to promote under-funding of our city? It seems like a very strange strategy to me. Do we actively want our city to remain broke and thus be hamstrung on providing social services, infrastructure improvements and school improvements for city residents? I don't want that.
Lol, only in Philadelphia. Apparently, being against any form of 'affordable' housing in the heart of the cites tourist hub (and I'm using affordable loosely in this case) automatically categorizes you as an evil racist gentrifier. How dare you advocate replacing a failed mall and a shoddy bus station!!
Honestly, I understand the importance of preserving local culture, but what exactly is the culture at the proposed location? Homelessness, the smell of urine and parking lots? This notion is ridiculous. Philadelphia without a doubt has to have the most brain-dead NIMBYs in the country.
Just out of curiosity, why do we feel we should offer "affordable housing" in the main section of our city? This should be an area (especially if the arena is built) where millionaires live and pay huge amounts of taxes to our city - further helping fund our broke city that desperately needs money. Can't we just have affordable housing a little further from ground zero of our city and ask people to take the bus to work or whatever? I take buses and the subway all the time. Septa is pretty good - I can get to Pennsport to Northern Liberties in like 15 minutes on an air-conditioned bus that picks me up on the corner of my street. This way we could actually develop areas that desperately NEED development, house people that barely pay any taxes in these areas, while still reaping the benefits of taxes and spend from wealthy people who might want to walk to the arena. H*ll, some may live on the Main Line and just buy a condo there. They'd still pay full board real estate taxes. Why do we want to promote under-funding of our city? It seems like a very strange strategy to me. Do we actively want our city to remain broke and thus be hamstrung on providing social services, infrastructure improvements and school improvements for city residents? I don't want that.
I share your opinions of using public transit, and I also understand your point about steering development to places that need it more (you might want to check out what the Nicetown CDC did on its side of Wayne Junction in this regard), but:
We already have affordable housing in the main section of our city and have had it since the 1970s at least. Both senior and low-income affordable housing dots Washington Square West, from two senior apartment complexes facing each other in the 800 block of Locust Street to the Casa Farnese (nee Casa Fermi) at 13th and Lombard to two 1970s rowhouse apartment developments in the 1200 block of Locust and the 1100 block of Pine to a row of rehabbed late-19th/early-20th-century rowhouses around the corner from the latter of those in the 250 block of South 13th Street. (I knew a friend who lived in one of the Pine Street apartments, and someone I see in the Gayborhood bars often enough (she's an older Black woman) lives in a Locust Street unit. I also knew two Casa Farnese residents and did caregiving for another (since deceased) disabled friend who managed to get into one of the other senior complexes, Saint George-Athenagoras Manor at 850 Locust.)
All of these were in place when I moved into Wash West in 1983.
The whole idea behind "scattered-site" low-income housing was to both stop concentrating poverty in large projects like the nearby MLK Plaza, since demolished and replaced with mixed-income rowhouses, and to give low-income residents the chance to live in a better environment than those projects. And I can attest that the scattered-site low-income projects in Wash West aren't hotbeds of crime. Sheesh, both Outfest and the Pride festival take place right in front of two of them.
I share your opinions of using public transit, and I also understand your point about steering development to places that need it more (you might want to check out what the Nicetown CDC did on its side of Wayne Junction in this regard), but:
We already have affordable housing in the main section of our city and have had it since the 1970s at least. Both senior and low-income affordable housing dots Washington Square West, from two senior apartment complexes facing each other in the 800 block of Locust Street to the Casa Farnese (nee Casa Fermi) at 13th and Lombard to two 1970s rowhouse apartment developments in the 1200 block of Locust and the 1100 block of Pine to a row of rehabbed late-19th/early-20th-century rowhouses around the corner from the latter of those in the 250 block of South 13th Street. (I knew a friend who lived in one of the Pine Street apartments, and someone I see in the Gayborhood bars often enough (she's an older Black woman) lives in a Locust Street unit. I also knew two Casa Farnese residents and did caregiving for another (since deceased) disabled friend who managed to get into one of the other senior complexes, Saint George-Athenagoras Manor at 850 Locust.)
All of these were in place when I moved into Wash West in 1983.
The whole idea behind "scattered-site" low-income housing was to both stop concentrating poverty in large projects like the nearby MLK Plaza, since demolished and replaced with mixed-income rowhouses, and to give low-income residents the chance to live in a better environment than those projects. And I can attest that the scattered-site low-income projects in Wash West aren't hotbeds of crime. Sheesh, both Outfest and the Pride festival take place right in front of two of them.
Yes, I'm aware that affordable housing exists all over the city - from the highly affluent sections to the highly impoverished sections. This doesn't mean that it is a wise strategy in every situation. In my opinion, this is one of those situations. We would be potentially sacrificing millions of tax dollars, not to mention the discretionary spending of more high-end income individuals, and I'm not exactly sure why we would do this.
And, while I am suggesting we let the market determine pricing in the most desired city locations, I'm not proposing we shove thousands of non-tax payer low-income residents into some sort of wasteland. There are a lot of undeveloped PHA-owned lots scattered around very solid neighborhoods that are not far from where we are talking about. Loft District, some South Philly areas, Spring Garden neighborhood, Western Kensington (or whatever that neighborhood north of Girard, south of Temple, and west Kensington/Fishtown is called now) are all established neighborhoods that could definitely use some more infill. And most of these locations are like a mile or two from Market East. That's a 5-10 minute bus ride.
I'm just not sure why a tower in this location, that in theory should attract full-paying residents, would include basically free housing to non-tax-paying residents. Seems like an odd strategy to maximize city progress and Philly's financial health.
If a person can't afford to live in an area, then they can't afford to live there. Period.
I guess I should ask Delaware County for affordable housing in St. Davids so I can live there since I'm being displaced by the crime, questionable leadership and political foolishness in the city.
That's not to say that of, course, if a person's home is being taken from them, then compensate them accordingly.
If a person can't afford to live in an area, then they can't afford to live there. Period.
I guess I should ask Delaware County for affordable housing in St. Davids so I can live there since I'm being displaced by the crime, questionable leadership and political foolishness in the city.
That's not to say that of, course, if a person's home is being taken from them, then compensate them accordingly.
Right, exactly. The real irony is that anyone middle class that might be priced out of a neighborhood, even if they have resided there for generations, are completely ignored. It is 100% their problem. Even if they have paid into the system their entire lives - too bad, find a new residence. However, if someone of very low income that contributes basically nothing to society (doesn't pay taxes, limited, if any, rent, almost no discretionary spending to boost the economy; while being subsidized heavily, or entirely, by the taxpaying public), then h*ll will be raised if anyone dares suggest they have to move out of their more or less free lodgings due to the free market setting prices. Odd...
Yes, I'm aware that affordable housing exists all over the city - from the highly affluent sections to the highly impoverished sections. This doesn't mean that it is a wise strategy in every situation. In my opinion, this is one of those situations. We would be potentially sacrificing millions of tax dollars, not to mention the discretionary spending of more high-end income individuals, and I'm not exactly sure why we would do this.
And, while I am suggesting we let the market determine pricing in the most desired city locations, I'm not proposing we shove thousands of non-tax payer low-income residents into some sort of wasteland. There are a lot of undeveloped PHA-owned lots scattered around very solid neighborhoods that are not far from where we are talking about. Loft District, some South Philly areas, Spring Garden neighborhood, Western Kensington (or whatever that neighborhood north of Girard, south of Temple, and west Kensington/Fishtown is called now) are all established neighborhoods that could definitely use some more infill. And most of these locations are like a mile or two from Market East. That's a 5-10 minute bus ride.
I'm just not sure why a tower in this location, that in theory should attract full-paying residents, would include basically free housing to non-tax-paying residents. Seems like an odd strategy to maximize city progress and Philly's financial health.
FWIW, the city has a non-mandatory affordable housing set-aside in its zoning code.
Builders can get density bonuses for including 10 percent affordable units in their developments. They may, however, get them for contributing a percentage of the project budget to the Philadelphia Housing Trust Fund, whose proceeds go towards the provision of affordable housing units or housing subsidies for tenants, instead.
The developer of 305 Race Street in Old City, one of the few truly interesting new apartment buildings built within the last five or so years, opted to include the apartments instead of donating to the Trust Fund.
Right, exactly. The real irony is that anyone middle class that might be priced out of a neighborhood, even if they have resided there for generations, are completely ignored. It is 100% their problem. Even if they have paid into the system their entire lives - too bad, find a new residence. However, if someone of very low income that contributes basically nothing to society (doesn't pay taxes, limited, if any, rent, almost no discretionary spending to boost the economy; while being subsidized heavily, or entirely, by the taxpaying public), then h*ll will be raised if anyone dares suggest they have to move out of their more or less free lodgings due to the free market setting prices. Odd...
I don't like you and you don't like me, but you're correct for once. I've been saying this for years.
I wish the government would help me 'have the opportunity' to live in Society Hill.
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