Philadelphia's Dream Subway System (Reading, Bethlehem: 2013, construction, college)

[PhilliesPhan2013]

Out of boredom, I created a map of what I can imagine Philadelphia's subway system being like.

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The Lines:

Broad Street Line

Under ideal conditions, the Broad Street Line will be expanded in the east, south, and northeast directions. Phase I would begin with the construction of the Roosevelt Blvd Subway. It will begin with a flying junction at Hunting Park. This line will extend to Rhawn Street, making a connection with the Market-Frankford Line. Phase II would entail extending the BSL to the Navy Yard. The BSL would run along the new "Diagonal Boulevard" set to be built in the Navy Yard. Finally, Phase III would bring the BSL to its new terminus of Market and Broadway Streets in Gloucester City, NJ.

Market-Frankford Line

Under ideal conditions, the Market-Frankford Line will expand in the west and northeast directions. Phase I would extend the MFL to Busleton Ave. to meet up with the newly extended BSL. Phase II would extend the MFL along West Chester Pike to Newtown Square at 252.

PATCO High Speed Line

Under ideal conditions, the PATCO High Speed Line will expand west. Phase I would extend PATCO to a new Rittenhouse Square station. Phase II would extend PATCO to 30th Street Station, where an interchange can be made with the MFL

Broad-Ridge Spur

Under ideal conditions, the Broad-Ridge Spur would continue on to serve Philadelphia International Airport as a rapid transit alternative to the Regional Rail already present. This extension will primarily run along 8th Street, Passyunk Avenue, Lindbergh Avenue, and Island Avenue. This extension will be renamed "the Airport Spur".

New South Street Subway

Under ideal conditions, a new subway would be built running primarily along South Street, Aramingo Avenue, and Torresdale Avenue. Its termini would be at Torresdale Ave and Knights Road (with the possibility of continuing onto Academy Road) to the east, and 63rd and Spruce to the west.

New City Avenue Subway

Under ideal conditions, a new subway will be built running from the Sports Complex to City Avenue near the I-76 entrance. This line will primarily hit tourist destinations, such as: the Sports Complex, Penn's Landing, Independence Mall, the Art Museum, Fairmount Park, and the Philadelphia Zoo.

NOTE: This line will utilize a section of tunnel already existing at 19th and Arch.

New Germantown/Chestnut Hill and Cheltenham Subways

Under ideal conditions, a new subway will be constructed. Both lines will originate at 20th and Pattison Streets. There will be a four track mainline from 20th and Pattison to 20th and Lombard. A flying junction at 20th and Lombard will separate the two lines. The Germantown/Chestnut Hill Subway will continue to Germantown and Bethlehem Pikes, hitting tourist destinations such as the Museum District and Eastern State Penitentiary. The Cheltenham Subway will go on to Rising Sun and Cheltenham Avenues.

[AJNEOA]

From an outsider's perspective, and given that this is a "dream subway" concept, I'd love to see something like this:

https://mapsengine.google.com/map/ed...I.kV8eYzNY3lKk

There are probably more needed lines/connections, but I think this would solve a lot of the core issues that a visitor experiences when they get too far west/east of the BSL or too far south/north of the Market El. I'd have to imagine this would be insanely expensive/complicated due to the built density of these areas.

[kyb01]

Originally Posted by AJNEOA

From an outsider's perspective, and given that this is a "dream subway" concept, I'd love to see something like this:

https://mapsengine.google.com/map/ed...I.kV8eYzNY3lKk

There are probably more needed lines/connections, but I think this would solve a lot of the core issues that a visitor experiences when they get too far west/east of the BSL or too far south/north of the Market El. I'd have to imagine this would be insanely expensive/complicated due to the built density of these areas.

We, as a country, can not attend to, and repair, our existing infrastructure because of funding issues. Do you honestly believe that adding even more will change any of the current mentality?

But there's nothing wrong, I suppose, with dreaming about this.

[MikeNigh]

One thing I wonder about... If paying for our existing road systems was done through tolls instead of taxes, would the american public find it outrageously expensive and almost immediately flee to urban cities? Are we holding down our more efficient urban cities to keep an inefficient rural and suburban super road network not just functional but spotless?

[AJNEOA]

Originally Posted by kyb01

We, as a country, can not attend to, and repair, our existing infrastructure because of funding issues. Do you honestly believe that adding even more will change any of the current mentality?

But there's nothing wrong, I suppose, with dreaming about this.

??? I guess that's why the title of the thread is Philadelphia's Dream Subway System. I mean, I even said that it was a "Dream Subway concept" in the post that you quoted! Clearly, I'm not proposing that a new subway be built ahead of needed infrastructure work...

Besides, are you saying that not another road, subway line or bridge should be built because we have aging infrastructure? None? Not dreamed of, discussed or considered?

[kidphilly]

MapQuest Maps - Driving Directions - Map

[AJNEOA]

Originally Posted by kidphilly

MapQuest Maps - Driving Directions - Map

That would certainly be less expensive/complicated than what I proposed. I would really love to see some of the trolleys brought back. They could serve as feeders since it would be quite a few blocks to get to a subway line (in many cases).

[rotodome]

Originally Posted by MikeNigh

One thing I wonder about... If paying for our existing road systems was done through tolls instead of taxes, would the american public find it outrageously expensive and almost immediately flee to urban cities? Are we holding down our more efficient urban cities to keep an inefficient rural and suburban super road network not just functional but spotless?

The Devils Advocate argument here is that an intact roads network is necessary for the shipping and receipt of goods, as well as the movement of people, that are needed to keep cities (as well as practically everyplace else) viable. It is critical infrastructure for nearly all commerce, and a subway does not substitute for all of the functions of the road network.
Whether they personally drive on it or not, everyone benefits from the roads network, and so it makes sense for everyone to pay for it through taxes.

This is not to say that more focus shouldn't be put on urban public transit networks, of course.

[PhilliesPhan2013]

Originally Posted by AJNEOA

From an outsider's perspective, and given that this is a "dream subway" concept, I'd love to see something like this:

https://mapsengine.google.com/map/ed...I.kV8eYzNY3lKk

There are probably more needed lines/connections, but I think this would solve a lot of the core issues that a visitor experiences when they get too far west/east of the BSL or too far south/north of the Market El. I'd have to imagine this would be insanely expensive/complicated due to the built density of these areas.

Originally Posted by kidphilly

MapQuest Maps - Driving Directions - Map

I like both of these concepts! I have been hearing repeated calls for a central circulator, and both maps include this. I also like how one of the lines is following the old Pennsy Schuylkill Branch over the Pencoyd Viaduct in Manayunk. In my opinion, that stupid trail needs to be removed and new rails need to be laid. If the Schuylkill Valley Metro project ever goes through, then the Pennsy Line should go to Reading and Wyomissing, and the old Reading (current Manayunk/Norristown Line) should go to the King of Prussia mall.

Also, despite bring a "dream" thread, I do thoroughly believe that there should be a subway along South Street, and a subway line that can hit the Art Museum and Fairmount Park (the LRT plan for the City Branch could possibly solve that problem). It is a long walk from Market Street to South Street.

[kidphilly]

Originally Posted by PhilliesPhan2013

I like both of these concepts! I have been hearing repeated calls for a central circulator, and both maps include this. I also like how one of the lines is following the old Pennsy Schuylkill Branch over the Pencoyd Viaduct in Manayunk. In my opinion, that stupid trail needs to be removed and new rails need to be laid. If the Schuylkill Valley Metro project ever goes through, then the Pennsy Line should go to Reading and Wyomissing, and the old Reading (current Manayunk/Norristown Line) should go to the King of Prussia mall.

Also, despite bring a "dream" thread, I do thoroughly believe that there should be a subway along South Street, and a subway line that can hit the Art Museum and Fairmount Park (the LRT plan for the City Branch could possibly solve that problem). It is a long walk from Market Street to South Street.

Agree 100% and could in theory make this a LRT line with 15/20 minute headways - both the current Manyunk/Norristown and the line I had on the trail into Manyunk could merge there to give better headways out to Norriston, Conshy/KOP - even could split there to say Chesterbrook and into Paoli for one and up 422 to say the Royersford or Collegeville exit for another

potentially on the map I have have also extending on the Airport line to the airport with LRT and 15/20 minute headways

also could have a LRT rail on the old 11th/12th street (to me no need for S Street Subway) and this could loop out by the stadiums into the Navy yard and then around back up DE Ave


Also to me you could also branch off the CH line on my map to extend LRT up the Blvd maybe all the way to either a terminus at the Neshaminy Mall or Franklin Mills and use nearly all existing or nearly existing dedicated ROW for most

maybe will play with the map some time - double or triple length LRT with better headways could be qa good thing and in closer wouold share tracks to make it very rapid and much ROW used (also my map would have all dedicated ROW under the railyard (if ever developed) and yes sues the Pennsy cut as well


another N/S line on say 20-23 from like Girard to Tasker

and still would love to see the Patco line get to 30th and the Broad street spur to share that line

Oh one can dream - but I think a more comprehensive more modern LRT may be more scalable and felxible