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I might be a little off topic here in what everyone is arguing about but I can say this. I am mexican, and I moved to canada when i was a young girl. I remember going to the american embassy in mexico city on numerous occasions applying for my american visa. I just wanted to go to disneyland! the reason I was there so many times was because my mother and I were denied many many times. everytime we went there the place was filled with people who stood in line for hours and hours sometimes waiting since the night before. I know that they don't grant visas to the majority of the people because they have certain guidelines to follow and it also comes down to how lucky you are. I know of people who were just like me and received an american visa that was good for life.
I think that if more american visas where granted and they had more programs to work with people there it would be a better filtering process. for example, i know that every mexican that crosses that border doesn't necessarity like the life they are living in america. some reach the US and experience racism that they have not had to deal with before, poverty, in some cases just as bad or even worse than they had in mexico and other things. it all depends on each indvidual's situations.
If these people who are not enjoying their time here could just get back on a bus or plane and head back to mexico they would more easily do that if they were documented. many of the illegal mexicans paid a lot money which was probably borrowed and they have to pay back, therefore, they feel the need to pay it back and after having to struggle by coming across the border and how difficult it is, they are not willing to just go back after going through all of that. they feel the need to get something out of it.
I know my point of view is not complete here, since there are many more things that can be added to this.
Again, you are also kidding yourself and I stand by what I said. I was speaking about more than this particular posting. There is a neverending supply of these types of postings and thus my lack of patience for them.
The last "paragraph" was exactly on point. It is called a parallel example. In addition, you are acting as though I stated that those who commit these crimes should not "pay for them."
You are putting words in my mouth.
I am sick of the term illegal in this forum. Period. I am tired of the topic. This is a dead horse beaten over and over. There are those on one side and those on the other. There always will be. My main point is: drop it.
The title of the posting was not: those who are grieving the loss of the police officers post here, or any such posting regarding grieving. This dealt with illegals. There is always a posting dealing with illegals. There is so much more to discuss about Phoenix.
It is one of those topics that are very heated, and no one will change anyone's views about their position. It is merely a venting area. I am so tired of it.
I have worked with many people that I suspect are not here legally. These are some of the best human beings I know. They work themselves harder than any American, anyday. They will bend over backwards to help me if I needed it. They ask for nothing in return. These are good people. They are in a bad situation. I do not think that this is a simple topic. My post should have shown that there is a lot involved.
I am just saying: let's give it a rest. If you look on the Hawaii forum, read the first sticky that discusses taking it easy on the hate postings. It needs to be added here on the illegal immigration topic. Give it a rest for awhile. It really has been discussed over and over again.
Also, you most certainly did mean to attack me by your tone, your lack of analytical thought and hostile discussion. For you to say that I should say this to the widow is absolutely ridiculous. I EMPATHIZE WITH ALL SIDES HERE. AS I SAID: NO ONE WANTS A POLICE OFFICER KILLED. AND ANYONE WHO DID SO, MUST BE PROSECUTED. REGARDLESS OF COLOR OR LEGAL STATUS, ETC.
And just what is this supposed to mean: "If deportation doesn't set them straight, I can think of several different ways that most certainly will...." Sounds like a threat.
I am not Mexican. I have no personal stake in this issue. However, I have been rich and I have been poor. When I was wealthy, I couldn't understand/empathize with others who weren't also. I see this often on these postings. It makes me feel profound sadness.
As far as the crime goes: whenever there is poverty- crime rises. This is accross the board. Mexican, black, white, etc.
This is NOT a political board is my point. This is a place for those who want to know about a city that they do not live in. They want to know about neighborhoods, job opportunities, etc.
I just want to be able to come on here and help people from other places when they have questions about the town in general. Nothing more and nothing less. There are plenty of websites where this type of posting and others like it, are welcomed and part of the reason they exist. This is not one of them.
Okay, I get it..you are sick of it. Well, don't read it. The beautiful thing about these forums is that you can choose to participate in threads or not participate in threads. I always take exception when somebody tries to police the forum and tell people what they should and should not post about DUE to what they prefer to read.
Dont like it, don't participate.
And the long waits for Visas? Mexican govt corruption.
Our existence as a wealthy neighbor makes it unnecessary for Mexico to provide opportunity for its people. They want as many people as possible to leave and earn elsewhere, then spend in Mexico. It will never change as long as US is an option.
This type of a post really irritates me. It is unnecessary and usually put up to start arguments about "illegals" which in and of itself in some circles is a racial slur.
Law Enforcement officers are my heroes along with their brothers, fire fighters. Every time they leave home for work, they know they might not come home. Their families are very special people also - they provide a support system that some of us can only imagine.
When these types of senseless deaths occur though, particularly at the hands of someone who was not suppose to be here (illegal immigration), it makes one wonder; could this senseless and needless tragedy have been avoided if we, as a nation, had only protected our borders better - to enforce our laws better? The answer is clearly YES!
Illegal’s are just that - illegally in this nation. They have no business being here. One can argue about how bad things are in their native country but, that is not really our problem - it is that countries problem. The United States, and many American companies HAVE tried to provide assistance in many forms, including development of the economy in these countries. One, of many, examples is Samsonite - with a manufacturing plant just south of Nogales, Sonora. Good jobs for this region. Like I said, this is but one example
On the other hand, I applaud those who seek a better life for themselves and their families. And to them I say, come to this country LEGALLY and you will be welcomed with open arms.
Come here ILLEGALLY and, I will do all in my power to send you "home" (deportation)
Americans by a large margin (over 80% by some polls) are DEMANDING that our government seal the borders, arrest, detain and deport those here illegally - regardless of their nation of orgin.
OBTW - I am not only talking about sealing our southern border; I am also talking about our Northern border as well.
If these people who are not enjoying their time here could just get back on a bus or plane and head back to mexico they would more easily do that if they were documented.
I think it's easier for the undocumented to get back to Mexico. All they have to do is turn themselves in to the local ICE office and I am quite sure they'll get free transportation back to the border. If they were documented they would have to actually pay for the plane or bus ticket.
Location: 5 miles from the center of the universe-The Superstition Mountains
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill-
Sorry if it makes you uncomfortable, but illegal immigration is an important topic to people who live in the Valley, and it should be talked about. I live in what is considered a "nice" part of town and a few months ago a drop house was raided about a mile from my house. There have also been several gun battles between smugglers on I-10 and the 202 within a few miles of my house. "Dropping it" only endorses the status quo, and I don't think anyone should find that acceptable.
You got that right! And this isn't a new problem:
The Officer Down Memorial Page Remembers . . . (http://www.odmp.org/officer.php?oid=3265 - broken link)
Ken Collings was murdered by an illegal immigrant May 27, 1988. And he wasn't the first. I didn't know him, but I carried the wanted poster of his murderer on my clipboard for 12 years until the coward was finally captured in Mexico and extradited back to AZ on the condition that he NOT receive the death penalty.
Then there was Phoenix PD Officer Marc Atkinson killed by an illegal in 1999.
Park Ranger Kris Eggle was murdered by illegals in the Organ Pipe Cactus National Monument in 2002.
Unlike many police departments with policies that FORBID officers to call Border Patrol or ICE to pick up illegals when they're located, I worked for one that did allow it. Problem was, the vast majority of the time, they wouldn't respond or would give an ETA of several hours. I can't tell you how much it pissed me off to stop a van loaded with twenty-plus illegals inside and then have to let them go. The only thing we could do, if we were close to a city, was tow the vehicles which invariably had expired registration and no insurance. The only conciliation in doing that was taking the unlicensed driver of an unsafe vehicle off the road so he didn't kill someone. As a side note, easily one-third of the illegals I came in contact with were from Honduras, Guatemala and Nicaragua-not Mexico.
The solution to the problem is simple, and although expensive and time consuming, it would be worth it. Unfortunately, those who claim to represent us in Washington don't care about the U.S. They care about supplying big business with cheap labor and their bottom lines. One way or another, they need to get the message that the vast majority of Americans, the ones who pay the bills, want our immigration laws enforced.
Military bases need to be on or near our borders - north and south - and our land based forces should be our front-line defense. the Border Patrol doesn't have the manpower.
Repeal the 14th Amendment. It was ratified in 1868 to ensure former slaves would not be denied citizenship. It wasn't intended to create Anchor Babies! There isn't one former slave still alive: Mission Accomplished-get rid of it.
Empower ALL United States law enforcement personnel to arrest persons illegally within the country.
If you think this belongs on the immigration forum, I disagree. As artvandelay said, Arizona is the major pipeline into the U.S. from the south. It has a crippling effect on our health care and educational systems. And for the liberals, how many more trees had to die because the Arizona State and Mesa City Governments feel they must send me all ballots, instructions and forms in English AND Spanish?
I used to post on another BBS where one of the resident trolls is an advocate for illegal immigrants. She immediately accuses anyone who speaks up about illegal immigration of racism and of course starts calling them racist along with a repertoire of juvenile insults.
She recently started stalking one the posters on that board for turning a family of illegal immigrants into the INS. It turns out one of the children from that family (of illegal immigrants) was extorting money from other children before and after school and pulled a knife on that person’s child demanding money So after finding out the identity of that child and child’s family that poster turned them in to INS. That poster then started a thread on that BBS to discuss what had happened. The illegal immigration advocate (and troll on that BBS) was outraged.
More than once I have seen televised town hall meetings where illegal immigrant advocates in the audience will immediatley start to argue that here is no such thing as an illegal immigrant and shortly thereafter start in with accusations of racism.
I am not saying that they can steal it, but a lot of the people that are living miserably in the US would probably return MUCH
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